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Seems like an interesting tool vendor

Old 09-19-20, 06:12 AM
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smontanaro 
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Seems like an interesting tool vendor

Over on The Paceline, one of the folks lost the derailleur on his CF bike (the hangar bent but didn't break). He asked about an inexpensive hangar alignment tool. One of the replies pointed to this tool:

MTB Tools Mountain Bike, Bicycle Derailleur Hanger Alignment Tool

I poked around the seller's listings and saw a number of inexpensive tools. I asked about their source. The response:

We make everything ourselves in El Cajon California


Seems like a win/win - inexpensive and US-produced. I have no direct experience yet with any of their products (and many aren't for our C&V steeds), though I just bought that hangar tool.
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Old 09-19-20, 06:50 AM
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Originally Posted by smontanaro

Seems like a win/win - inexpensive and US-produced. I have no direct experience yet with any of their products (and many aren't for our C&V steeds), though I just bought that hangar tool.
Awesome, thanks for sharing! Could’ve done with a set of their custom spacers instead of hunting all around for the WheelsMfg Campagnolo 9 to 8 spacer kit (for like net $40).
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Old 09-19-20, 07:22 AM
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So for $18 you get a tool that can bend a hanger, but does nothing to assess the amount and direction to which it needs to be bent back. Having used the Park alignment tool many times, I can say that it takes a bit of finesse to correctly align. I don't know how you can do it reliably without the feedback gotten through measurement.

I don't see the point. You'll be aligning by eye and it would be a rare lucky day that you would get it right.

It pains me to offer such a negative post, but it seems to me that this vendor should have put a bit more thought into the design of this tool. Simply adding a 10x1mm shoulder bolt of appropriate length would allow you to spin the handle around the wheel. Then you could measure the distance to the rim using a rule.
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Old 09-19-20, 07:35 AM
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I saw that disclaimer about it not being a measuring tool. I wonder though, if the seller didn't put that after getting some negative feedback from an idiot who bought the product thinking it was an equivalent to the park tool thing. If the bushing is a tight enough fit on the bolt, you could probably just use calipers to measure between the rod of this tool and the wheel rim, instead of the park tool sliding post thingy.
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Old 09-19-20, 07:36 AM
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I agree with Moe, the pics don’t show the ruler or other indicator you need to s check the 360 degree alignment.

the original Dura Ace that mounted to the hub as well as the hanger was probably the best one ever made


the Park tool


The Park tool
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Old 09-19-20, 07:42 AM
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I made one for my shop that is very similar. I use a Mitutoyo dial caliper to take measurements before coaxing the hanger back into alignment, then check with a long straight edge between cogs for a final eyeball of alignment. I easily get less than the 4mm rim deviation at the rim as recommended by Shimano for alignment. Works well but no doubt slower than a DAG-2.2, but I am retired so no worries.
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Old 09-19-20, 07:57 AM
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Originally Posted by Moe Zhoost
So for $18 you get a tool that can bend a hanger, but does nothing to assess the amount and direction to which it needs to be bent back. Having used the Park alignment tool many times, I can say that it takes a bit of finesse to correctly align. I don't know how you can do it reliably without the feedback gotten through measurement.

I don't see the point. You'll be aligning by eye and it would be a rare lucky day that you would get it right.
Agreed, I've done the "eyeball" alignment using a large crescent wrench on cheap bikes and got "close enough" but when I acquired a good bike with a bent hanger I ponied up for an alignment tool. It's not a Park but it has built in gauging so you can check vertical and horizontal alignment just like the Park. I don't anticipate using it often but it is very well made and I expect it to last.

I checked out some of this seller's other tools, the headset cup removal tool looked nearly identical to one I bought a few years ago off Ebay. I won't say it was the same seller but the tool looks identical and it worked well 2 or 3 times before it went to crap. It was basically made of small diameter exhaust pipe cut with a band saw to form the fingers. It only took one stubborn cup to bend one of the fingers. The installation tool was marginally better and I have since purchased a Park but I have encountered cups that didn't work with the Park and the el cheapo saved the day. When I bought the cheap stuff I thought I would only use them a few times but I found once I had the tools I was less reluctant to swap headsets and have used them quite a bit. I wish I had just spent the extra money up front, it would have been cheaper in the long run.
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Old 09-19-20, 08:20 AM
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I’ve purchased several tools from MTB and they have all been good. The headset press has been in use for a dozen years or so, no problems.
Am pretty sure that others have copied some of his designs, possible that the execution on those was not as good.
He has also made me some custom stuff, including adapters to make recessed nut frames accept nutted brakes, and some spacers for installing a six speed HG cassette on a later 120mm hub.
Good people.
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Old 09-19-20, 09:18 AM
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Custom stuff

Originally Posted by rccardr
He has also made me some custom stuff, including adapters to make recessed nut frames accept nutted brakes.
Doc, can you tell us more about what you had made and how it works?

thanks.

Brad
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Old 09-19-20, 10:02 AM
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Originally Posted by Moe Zhoost
So for $18 you get a tool that can bend a hanger, but does nothing to assess the amount and direction to which it needs to be bent back.
you supply the ruler. I've seen a YouTube video where a similar style tool is made. In the demonstration segment, the guy used a ruler to measure the distance to the rim. Given the radius of most bike wheels, I'm sure that will be accurate enough. If you need to hold the ruler in place, a bit of tape or a rubber band should suffice.

I'll try and remember to report back when I've used mine. I have a Motobecane with a slightly bent hanger.
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Old 09-19-20, 10:33 AM
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Originally Posted by smontanaro
you supply the ruler. I've seen a YouTube video where a similar style tool is made. In the demonstration segment, the guy used a ruler to measure the distance to the rim. Given the radius of most bike wheels, I'm sure that will be accurate enough. If you need to hold the ruler in place, a bit of tape or a rubber band should suffice.

I'll try and remember to report back when I've used mine. I have a Motobecane with a slightly bent hanger.
From what I see, the bolt supplied with that tool will clamp it on the hanger tight so that you won't be able to rotate it. What you need is a shoulder bolt that screws down tight to the dropout while allowing the tool shaft to rotate (and without too much slop). I reckon you could tighten the bolt, measure, loosen the bolt, rotate the shaft, tighten the bolt, measure ... i.e. a big hassle.

For a bit more money, you could buy something like this that should be more functional.

Good luck to you in any case. Feedback about tools from real users is valuable to all of us.
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Old 09-19-20, 10:46 AM
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I mean, don't screw the bolt all the way snug. Problem solved

Obviously not good for a shop where time is money, but to _avoid_ going to a shop, using the tool a couple times a year, it seems like it could work, if a little finicky.

I too am awaiting the results. If the end bushing is a nice tight fit on the bolt, I may buy one, because I've been thinking about making one and it will cost more to make one than the price MTB Tools is asking!
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Old 09-19-20, 01:22 PM
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Originally Posted by scarlson
I mean, don't screw the bolt all the way snug.... it seems like it could work, if a little finicky.
You are correct and Moe has a point. If you are a mechanic sure but for home use I would save your money for a lovely set of Vessel screwdrivers for those JIS screws. I probably check a hanger a couple times a year at most and a machined shouldered bolt would be nice but a few seconds is all that you will be delayed without one. I have a large brass washer between my fabricated tool and the hanger and there is usually residual grease on the hanger so it rotates smoothly and I always check the bolt head with my fingers after every move to another spot on the rim. I find finger tight does not allow the arm to shift at all for accurate measurements.
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Old 09-19-20, 03:46 PM
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Originally Posted by rccardr
I’ve purchased several tools from MTB and they have all been good. The headset press has been in use for a dozen years or so, no problems.
Am pretty sure that others have copied some of his designs, possible that the execution on those was not as good.
He has also made me some custom stuff, including adapters to make recessed nut frames accept nutted brakes, and some spacers for installing a six speed HG cassette on a later 120mm hub.
Good people.
Yup, this seller has been around for some time doing this. Most of his stuff is crude but works, I almost bought a headset press from him a couple times before ultimately deciding on a higher end one. Seemed like good people and answered my emails and question promptly.
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Old 09-19-20, 08:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Stevensb
Doc, can you tell us more about what you had made and how it works?

thanks.

Brad
The two things I can remember right away were:
1) A set of spacers to use six 9 or 10 speed HG cogs on a 130mm OLD rear hub so that it would interface properly with a DA 7400 shifter and RD. Note that the original 6 speed UG cogs were somewhat thicker than later 9 and 10 speed HG cogs, so standard spacers wouldn’t do the trick. The exact calculations escape me at the moment, but he cut the spacers precisely as requested. Several years later, they now reside on my ‘78 Richard Sachs, with 7403 hubs. And they shift perfectly.
2) A set of ‘top hat’ inserts that went into the recesses of the fork and brake bridge on a Bianchi Eroica frameset so that I could install nutted Record brakes. Will see if I can pull up some,pics, but this was the bike donated to the 2018 Eroica auction for the SLO Hospice. Later on, discovered that Dia Compe made plastic inserts that did the same thing, could have saved myself the trouble.
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Old 09-20-20, 11:54 AM
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Lots of stuff just a little better than I could piece together myself at the hardware store. Pretty much the same price as diy, I'll definitely keep this vendor in mind.
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