wolfchild

It's true that majority of bike shops sell the same boring generic crap such as Specialized, Trek and Giant. The best thing to do is to look to other bike manufacturers and find the type of frame which can be built up in many different configurations and have a bike shop build it for you. That's the only way to get exactly what you want.

Metieval

Oh but mainstream is wrong, on bikes and many other things!

Old grump clubs, riding their weekly group rides at 12 mp average. On their carbon Race bikes, skinny tires, full spandex kit, because its mainstream. All to ride 20 miles.

We need individualism to come back again.

Metieval

So what is is?

Manufactures creating, demand.

Or

Demand, determining what manufactures produce.

Pick one!

Never mind, people are sheep. We all know this. Leaders are few, and leaders are not always correct.

Jameth

I can't even begin to understand this mentality. I'm a born dissenter, so appealing to the status quo and suggesting I do the same perhaps isn't the best argument you could make.

If 95% of the restaurants in my area serve cheeseburgers, fried chicken, or pizza, am I to assume that those are healthy, wise meal choices?

If all the convenient stores sell gasoline, cigarettes, and Red Bull, should I stop in to see what I'm missing out on?

Mainstream society has chosen plenty of things that don't work well or that are wrong. Drop bars make it more difficult than flat bars for me to ride in the most comfortable position possible for my back and arms...leaned back with my hands off the bars. They're heavier and bulkier and reduce the stability of the front end. Derailleurs are far more expensive and far less reliable than the single-speed and IGH drivetrains I prefer. It's as simple as that.

staehpj1

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wheelreason

Bike shops (like every other business) exist to make money. If stocking racks upon racks of touring bikes (or any other type of bike) was condusive to that,, that is what you would see. We carry and stock a few such frames, and will be happy to build that (or anything else) to a customer's specs.

ps: Hendrix and Doyle Bramhall are pretty good players...

Metieval

If it's both, then start your stance with 'both',

indyfabz

I seem to recall some dude from Seattle who played a righty left handed and didn’t even restring it. He had some success but ended up dying young. I think Jimi something or other was his name.

Wildwood 

Sounds like a P&R rant. Sheeple is not a bicycling term.
or
go to the touring forum for answers or the fixed gear forum or order a Rohloff equipped bike or go to the C&V forum as many old ruddy (not grumpy) guys there who organize tours and celebrate their unique vintage touring rides.

Branko D

Dissent for dissent's sake is less likely to give you the right answers than blind conformity, it's just cooler sounding and more attractive. Both are inherently fallacious.
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I used to think flat bars were better until I started riding more and more and longer distances, and then added barends and finally swallowed my pride and installed drop bars. I was simply wrong. People who have been doing it for a long time were right, and I, a newcomer to it, was wrong. Who would have thought? 🤔

The thing is, it takes a certain amount of experience to be able to judge what is nonsense and what is valid. Most of the talk about derailleurs vs IGHs vs single speed is theorycrafting which makes sense on paper.

Derailleurs are better in ways which matter for basically everything which isn't a purely utilitarian commuting bike in a flat area (there's a reason why single speeds are mainstream for commuting in Amsterdam). Cheap IGHs are a reasonable alternative to derailleurs in a narrow niche of commuting bikes where there are uphills, and Rohloff for touring in, idk, lower Tasmania 1000km away from what could be described as a bike shop.
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indyfabz

I’ve heard of businesses that will build you the bike you are looking for if/since you can’t find that on a shelf.

I’d post a photo of a cloud for you to yell at, but nothing but blue sky at the moment.

Trakhak

Paraphrasing Rooster Cogburn in True Grit:

If I ever meet a young white American male who doesn't believe he's a true dissenter and a free-thinker and that everyone else is a sheep, I'll shake his hand and give him a five-cent Daniel Webster see-gar.

indyfabz

Sounds like a troll, especially with the bit about cost. Ever see what something like a Rohloff hub goes for?

staehpj1

Why?

You seem to have some big axe to grind with the manufacturers as if the first one constitutes some miscondict on their part. I do not. I think that for the most part manufacturers creating demand is fine and part of the process. Where they get it wrong the marketplace ultimately corrects.

Maelochs

People who rebel are so closely tied to the status quo ... they need it to define their dissent ... and they call themselves "independent."

People who are actually independent realize that there are many paths and many people walking them ... and not all the people walking in the same direction are sheep ... they are just going in a similar direction.

Why do people ride multi-speed bikes with drop bars? Because for a whole lot of people They Work Really Well.

Even if I am old and fat and average 14 mph, I do it on a drop bar road-bike most of the time because, Having Tested All the Alternatives, I find it the best for my purposes.

"Look at all those stupid, conformist sheep driving nails with hammers."

You want a specialty machine, and complain because not everyone else does ... but if everyone did, would you sell yours because you wouldn't want to "conform to the norm"?

You are a 6'9", 400-lb guy going into a Target for new clothes and complaining that nothing fits. If you saw some giant in a target throwing a tantrum because none of the clothes fit, you would walk away ... no point in engaging there, lost cause.

Yet here on Bike Forums ...

Go buy the bike you want. it is out there if you Really want it. Don't ask for the Bike Fairy to deliver it to your door ... the Bike Fairy is Not Real.

Don't hate me for telling you that.

PhilFo 

Sounds like the OP simply needs to suck it up and build their own bike. Absolutely nothing is going to be off-the-shelf ready, so the fixed or IGH upright touring bike with flat bars will need to be built. A few years ago, this was called a "hybrid", now it's called a gravel bike. Perhaps a gravel bike with the handlebars changed and a new rear wheel with an IGH is just the ticket. This creature will NOT be found stocked on the floor of any shop though, since it's a niche within a niche market.

Jameth

Come on, now I'm a troll? The cost issue was more in relation to single-speed setups. But, let's not pretend like there aren't groupsets that cost twice what the Rohloff does. Or hubs that cost a fraction of that.

I'm also not going to ignore the fact that buying a bike I've never had an opportunity to ride is risky and inconvenient. I know I can order a bike. I could also move to Holland, but that wouldn't be very convenient, either.

But, that's not my original point. Which is:

Most American bike shops offer a disturbingly homogeneous selection.

I find it really hard to believe that an unmanipulated society of hundreds of millions of people would uniformly be very keen to ride the exact same bike as one another.

Branko D

Bike frames are designed with a certain type of handlebars in mind. A gravel bike is designed and sized around drop bars, which add a lot of reach on a bike.

You get the best results by starting with your intended use and then choose the kind of bike which does it best. If you want to eat up lots of miles on the open road, a drop bar road bike just does it best. Gnarly offroad? MTB. So on and on.

If you start from the imagined ideal bike which you think is best, that is just backwards.

Most US customers don't buy bikes for commuting or touring and hence the set of ideal bikes for their purposes is fairly homogeneous.

cb400bill

Have you ever worked retail?

JohnDThompson 

And derailleurs, for that matter.

Caveman

I see the other side of the problem. people go to bike shops to get a test ride and then go home and buy it online I'm guilty of that with bike shoes and helmets. sizing is all over the chartsso I admit to trying on few things in the bikeke shop an then ordering online to save a few bucks. I try to make up for it by buying everything i can from the LBS when possible including a bike every now and then.

Branko D

You are going from the wrong starting point, starting from the bike rather than the intended use.

There's an optimal kind of bike for a certain purpose. If you're aiming to ride some gnarly singletrack, a MTB is simply optimal. Sure, you can do it on a road bike if you don't mind walking sections of it as a demonstration that it's possible, but it's just an inferior choice. Everyone gets that.

If you’re aiming at riding lots of miles on the road? Road bike. Sure, you can do it on a lot of bikes, but why choose something inferior for the purpose? Going to throw some lighter offroad in the mix or ride exclusively nontechnical offroad? Gravel bike.

If most people are buying bikes for sport and intend to ride them on the road, then as a shop you will unsurprisingly have a selection of road bikes, not because they are manipulated, but because it's the best bike for the purposes of a vast majority of people who come there.

A Rohloff is a good alternative to a derailleur for an around the world bike tour, but who does that? One in a hundred thousand of people who buy a bike? It's not going to be in a shop, and if you're looking for it and don't plan to tour in nowhereland, you are doing it because you're contrarian and don't have the experience to judge what you are talking about.

Caveman

I've had more than one bike shop offer to work with me if I ordered a bike and it didn't fit or I didn't like it. usually something like I could use the deposit for any other purchase in the shop.

There are more than enough reviews of Surly bikes all over the internet and most of them are positive. if you want a LHT just order one. I doubt you'll be disappointed.I also agree with the comments about building your own dream bike order a frame and have your bike shop build up whatever you want. they win, you win.

TiHabanero

"Drop bars make it more difficult than flat bars for me to ride in the most comfortable position possible for my back and arms...leaned back with my hands off the bars. They're heavier and bulkier and reduce the stability of the front end. Derailleurs are far more expensive and far less reliable than the single-speed and IGH drivetrains I prefer. It's as simple as that."

Personal preferences can be accommodated by most any shop, and please do not expect them to take the financial risk to please your fancy. Pay up front and let them do their thing.

wolfchild

There is no law which prohibits you from being different. You are allowed to ride whatever bike you want.....Personally I've been riding only SS and FG bikes for the past 15 years. That's right, I haven't shifted gears for 15 years, oh the horror .... Do I care what other cyclists think of me ???. Not one bit....It's pointless to argue and debate personal preferences here on bikeforums especially if your preferences are not mainstream.