wheelreason

"Comfort" and fit on a bike has nothing to do with it being new, old, or anything in between. If you were happy with the fit on your old bike, you should have looked to (by yourself or with help of a professional) match the setup, sounds like the bulb came on a bit late. Another thing to keep in mind is that a bike that you've been riding for sometime will feel "right" even if it isn't. We are great at compensating and adjusting to things, one of the reason most folks' favorite bike is the one they piled on the miles on early, regardless of it's characteristics.

rsbob 

Going from an 87 Bianchi to a 2020 took a bike fitting and then it took another few months to tweak everything, including a still shorter stem than recommended, to make it perfect. After your fitting, which I found out after going to two, their word is not the gospel, so keep fiddling with seat height, set back, stack height and stem length, and eventually you will get it. It can be a bit frustrating with all the trial and error after laying out the bucks for a fitting, but you will get there.

Now when I ride my 87, it is still comfortable, but feels quaint and antiquated even with new Continental GP5000s and light weight tubes.

genejockey 

Bingo. I have been riding 175mm cranks for the last 25+ years, but about 3 years ago I started getting older bikes, just for fun, and they have 170s. I set the saddle height - measured from the BB - the same as my other bikes, and pedaling felt weird, like I was flatfooted or something. And then, when I switched back to the bikes with 175s, I felt like I had to reach out while pedaling. So I measured from the pedal surface at full extension and made that the same, and they feel... well, not the same, but close.

So if your old bike has 170s and the new bike has 175s, and the saddle height is set from the BB, you'll feel like you're overextending on the new bike, because you are.

big john

Some people swear by fitters, some don't. Also, just because someone calls themself a fitter doesn't mean they are good at it.

Take all the measurements from the bike you feel good on and duplicate them on the new rig. It's still not going to feel the same and may take time to feel just right. I take tools with me and go ride the thing and make adjustments during a ride.

Fredo76

So many good suggestions in this thread, including spiffing up your old bike.

The first thing I'd try is lowering your set about a centimeter, and moving it forward the same distance.

Camilo

Fit can be very technical but doesn't have to be. Especially if you're happy with your old bike's fit and simply want to duplicate it. Furthermore, the brand of the bike doesn't matter, the geometry of a particular model does.

You simply need to match the fit from your Supercourse onto your new bike, taking measurements from the old bike and matching them to the new bike. Use your old saddle to get started, if you can to make measurements easier because most of the measurements use the saddle as a starting point. Do the adjustments in this order: saddle height and saddle set back from pedal spindle (readjusting height if needed), saddle level/angle, reach/stem length to the hoods or wherever you normally place your hands (do NOT adjust reach with saddle position), and handlebar height (saddle-bar drop). If you can't do that with your new bike, you might need a different bike.

It's common to need a new stem to make the handlebar height and reach work. Most bike shops will work with you on that, but you can also just buy some cheap stems (ebay for instance) until you get the one you need. Then upgrade, or not.

Plus, doing this fit is a starting point, and you might need to do a little tweaking from it to dial it in.

There's many online guides how to do these measurements, and really if you're willing to give it a go, you can do it yourself. BUT - but a good bike fitter should be able to easily help you accomplish this or tell you why you can't and recommend an alternative bike.

Do not rely on aTrek (or any other) salesperson. Someone who sets up your bike simply by adjusting the saddle height, is incompetent and no bike fitter. They're a sales person. Find a bike fitter. Spend $100 if you need to, it's worth it when you consider the money you're spending on a new bike.

FWIW, My old Supercourse was one of the most comfortable bikes I ever owned. But I've been able to match the comfort with several bikes afterwards by doing the above.

rm -rf

For riders that don't have a good idea of how their bike should really be set:
Many fitters have a fitting bike, which has a wide range of adjustments for saddle position, stem length and height, etc.
Video with tracking software can be good, I suppose. I think it's likely better for fast riders and racers to fine tune their position.

I had a "low tech" fitting when I got my new bike in 2014. I just wanted to get feedback and fine tune my fit, the bike geometry was similar to my old bike, which was "okay".
The store had a room with a big turntable and a bike trainer mounted on it. I sat on my new bike for this fitting session. The fitter did a knee angle measurement with a protractor fitting tool, and used a hardware store laser level to see how my knees tracked.

Otherwise, it was the fitter observing me riding, then minor changes to the saddle and bars, and repeat. It was helpful.
It needs an experience fitter, of course.
I'm still riding that bike, and probably only changed the bar and saddle positions by a few mm over that time period.

rm -rf

Talk the bike store manager, let them know you aren't happy with the useless saddle height from the ground "fitting". I haven't bought a bike for a while, but stem changes and/or saddle swaps were usually included. Along with putting the bike on a trainer and doing a quick fitting evaluation. They should step up and work with you.

BlazingPedals

This. Most bikes of that vintage don't have such short-reach calipers and the pads can be moved down the 4mm required to work with 622mm wheels. The other concern is the rear spacing. Steel frames are no problem to respace to 130mm and then they can take a more modern gearset. Of course once you set down that path, you may end up replacing everything BUT the frame!

Metieval

Personally I hate the way trek fits.

Try a defy,

Try a synapse

Iride01 

You mentioned that your Raleigh was a large size. I grew up riding bikes that were way oversize for me. And I was comfortable on them. However as I got to riding more and more for longer times, distance and speed, I started to realize that they were too big. The bike I rode the longest, over 41 years, was a 25" (64cm) frame from the late 70's. And I'm only 5' 11". I enjoyed it and even did a few 100 mile rides with it. However as I rode more I got a 60cm vintage bike that fit me better. Today I'm on a 56 cm modern bike and riding more aero. Even wondering what a 54 cm bike would be like.

Net take-a-way should be that your old bike might have gotten you use to oversize bikes. So it might take some time to get use to a properly sized frame.

One of the differences I've found with old vintage bikes I use to own and bikes of today is that the cranks are longer on larger frames sizes today. If you are use to shorter cranks, then you will feel like your legs are thrashing real far up and down. And if those cranks on the new bike were longer, and they just matched your saddle height to the BB or to the ground, then probably the saddle was to high. Longer cranks will lower your saddle height when measured that way. If you measure from the saddle to the pedal furthest away, then you can get the saddle height reasonably correct from one bike to the next.

You might get use to the crank length. If you don't you can change them. But depending on the bike it might be quite a bit of extra expense. I put 165 mm cranks on my new bike that came with 172.5 mm cranks. But if you can get use to the longer, you'll save some money and be just as well off.

wheelreason

lol

squirtdad

to note it is not hard to convert to 700c new wheels and longer reach brakes....good time to go dual pivot brakes

here is best selection of 27 tires i have found....not going to find gp 5000 level for sure https://www.biketiresdirect.com/search/27in-road-tires

70sSanO

Just to back this up a bit, maybe 35 years. Bike fitting in the 80’s was based on height, inseam, and “How does that feel?” Ah, the golden age of cycling.

If you like the setup on the Raleigh, and you don’t want to make “calculated” adjustments yourself, take it and the new Trek to someone who can replicate the setup, or get close, to your old Raleigh.

John

Maelochs

I can appreciate a taste for old Raleighs ..... mine has seen a few years and a few miles.

wheelreason

This explains a lot...

Camilo

Final answer!

zandoval 

Many years ago I could jump on just about any bike, or bike set up, and take off. Now in my 70's not at all. About 5 years ago I took careful measurements on my most comfortable bicycle, an 80's UNIVEGA. Now days all my bikes are set up to those measurements. As little a one centimeter off and I can feel an uncomfortable change. I don't really like it but if I am going to continue to ride its a must.

My suggestion is to find your most comfortable bicycle type and set up before age and osteoarthritis sets in. A comfortable ride is a blessing...

alex2074

So I did see a fitter. It was $125, but I think money well spent. I could futz and fiddle with all sorts of different seat configurations and maybe in 6 months find something that felt the best, not knowing if I should address the stem and cranks as well. But this guy did it in just a few minutes using lasers, video, and a rotating platform in which he compared my old Raleigh to my new Trek. He showed me the metrics that he is looking for, that have been established over decades of research about what constitutes, statistically, the best fit, like the angle of the knee when the pedal is at its lowest, and the location of the knee relative to the pedal when the crank is horizontal. And he adjusted the cleats in my shoes slightly to improve my posture. So now I feel pretty good, time will tell if i get used to the longer cranks, but he says the stem and cranks don't have to be modified to 'improve' my posture. He feels very confident in my fit and even suggested that Ill never ride my Raleigh ever again.

jgwilliams

I faced just this situation with one of my old Witcomb bikes from 1970 something. I was able to got back to the original frame builder and get it adjusted to take 700c wheels. It was a question of shortening the forks and moving the bridge for the rear brakes; in actual fact, they fitted a new bridge and drilled out the rear of the front fork crown slightly so that I could also put modern dual-pivot brakes on, which would solve your other problem. Any competent frame builder should be able to do the same for you.

Having said all that, I think it's largely about adaptation. You've been riding the same bike for years and geometry has changed over that time. Give it time and I imagine you'll adjust.

jgwilliams

I see I came a bit late to this thread. I think he could well be right. The old Witcomb I mentioned above barely gets ridden any more - it's basically a shopping bike now, much as I love it. Modern tyres are astonishing; I've recently gone tubeless with Vittoria Corsa N.Ext (stupid name). I'm 1,100 miles in and I can't even find a nick on them from a flint. Previously I was using Michelin Pro 4 Endurance, which I regarded as a pretty good tyre, but after this distance I'd have been able to find lots of little cuts where flints had penetrated (flints being the major hazard where I live), and probably had a flat or two as well.

Enjoy your new bike.

Edit: Just been looking at the SL5. Man, that's some upgrade! My latest ride also has disc brakes and I gotta say, I love them. I live in quite a hilly area and the disc brakes just give me a level of confidence I never felt before. My last main ride (and my first carbon bike) had SRAM Force 22 groupset; the brakes were good, no doubt, but they certainly can't match hydraulic disc brakes. I see also that the Trek has fully hidden cables, as does mine (Dolan Tuono). It makes for lovely clean lines but I sincerely hope I never have to change the headset bearings!

top506

I'm a C &V guy with a barn full of steel and alloy from the 70's, 80's, 90's and early oughts and had the opposite experience with a Domane SL7. Even with going from 170 to 172.5 cranks it wasn't too hard to get the fit dialed in. I've found it MUCH more comfortable over a long day than any of my older bikes. It does, however, lack panache. Shell out a little dough and time and you'll still be finding yourself astride your Raleigh, just as I've found myself on mine.

Top

Mtracer

I'm also 6' 2" and ride a Domane 4th gen 60 cm. My height is in my torso, so, I have relatively short legs. I bought mine with 172.5 mm cranks while the stock 60 cm Domane comes with 175's. 175's just don't' work for me. As small as that difference is, I get knee pain, of all things, while riding out of the saddle.

I was going to vote for get the bike fit. And, you've done that. I'm sure the bike is fine, It sounds like it is the right size and there's no reason you shouldn't be able to get a good fit. Keep in mind, even with a fit, you might want to tweak something things as time goes by. It also takes time to adapt to the new fit. ANy change, even if for the best, will often feel odd until you get used to it.

My Trek store works with me on components. You might find if you need a different length stem, they'll swap it out. I'm 3 months into my Domane, and they are going to swap out my seat post for a shorter one. Mine is just about at the edge of being too long. The Domane has a hard stop on how deep the seat post can go. It won't change anything for me now, but perhaps in the future I might have some reason to drop the saddle a bit, and wouldn't be able to.

I strongly suspect you'll find the ride of the Domane much smoother. Your bike likely came with some version of Bontrager tires. Consider getting some GP 5000's in 28 or 30 mm. They roll better. I'm about 200 lbs and run 57/60 PSI (front/rear). There's almost no loss of power running that low a pressure on smooth pavement. And given the mixed quality of pavement I ride on, likely it is a near optimum overall. And it certainly makes for a smoother ride.

I think the bike fitter may be right in thinking you won't be going back to the old bike once you settle into the new one.

Congrats on the new ride!

Lenton58 

Somebody is making a lot of 27 inch tires. Japan and other Asian countries have multiple millions of bicycles — on 27 inch tires. Every household here in Japan as at least. one or two bicycles. They are an everyday appliance for getting around — on 27 inch tires. They may not be very "sporty" though. The last sporty type I bought a few years ago were Pacellas.