fubada

About a month ago I purchased a wabi special w/ the lighter Sub 15 wheels (Wabi Cycles fixed gear wheels) and use it as a commuter bike in NYC. So far I've had the front wheel trued twice and the rear 3 times. They arrived in bad shape - very out of true, and Richard@Wabi was kind enough to compensate me for the first truing (they did not destress the wheels). However I keep having issues and Im now considering rebuilding the wheels ($60/ea) or getting an entirely different set of wheels. I'm curious to know if anyone else is using these wheels in NYC and how are they holding up? The wabi wheels are highly rated on the forums but my LBS guys recommend purchasing a different set. Thank you.

prooftheory

The set that most forum members have are older and heavier than the ones you have. It is possible that wabi erred on the site of lightness with the updated version. How much do you weigh?

TejanoTrackie 

Well, @franswa who weighs about 160 lbs reported breaking spokes on both the front and rear wheel on his, so maybe they are a bit fragile. I've had zero problems with my standard sets, which are plenty lightweight, so I have no plans to buy a set of Sub 15s.

IAmSam

My weight hovers around 165-170 lbs and I have put several thousand completely trouble-free miles on Wabi's lighter wheelset without being overly careful. They are still true too.

That being said...I (and I believe franswa as well) got mine last December when Richard was experimenting and actually building these by hand, himself.

Now he imports them pre-built, and told me that he de-stresses and retensions them as he fills orders, like he does with all his wheelsets. So what you have is actually somewhat different than mine and YMMV. It is strange that yours came to you untouched, but mistakes happen.

Let's face it - low spoke count, lightweight wheels (and light bikes) are not necessarily the best idea for heavy commuting, or if one is banging through NYC streets, potholes, etc. Maybe something more substantial would be better for you so check to see if you can return your problematic Sub 15s.

I do like my set very much - they ride fine and spin up to speed easy. Have even put off plans for an expensive custom wheel-build to stick with them for a while...

jlafitte 

Exactly. Seems pretty much counterintuitive.

fubada

I'm usually around 215-220lbs plus my bag which is typically another 20 lbs.

If I go the new wheels route, would it make sense to reuse the hubs?

Thank you all.

TejanoTrackie 

Your total weight is probably too high for these wheels, and I'd go with a higher spoke count, at least 28 front and 32 rear. Using the old hubs makes no sense, since you'd still have a low spoke count, which is the main cause of the problem. The standard Wabi wheelset has 32 spokes front and rear. Also, avoid aluminum nipples, and get brass nipples instead. They are much more durable and the weight increase is very small.

79pmooney

From the Wabi website

• Superlight at 1475g/set
• Silky smooth sealed bearing hubs
• Bolt on design is lighter and doesn't damage dropouts
• True 410g rims- superlight and compliant for a great ride
• 14/17 double butted stainless spokes 20/24 (F/R)
• Aluminum spoke nipples
• Hand built, finish trued and pre-stressed at Wabi Cycles
• Threading on both sides allows flip flop options (see specs below for more info)

I rode and raced in New England in the '70s. I rode ~400g sew-up rims w/ 36 4X 15-17 spokes and brass nipples. After a winter, they were trash and I rebuilt with new rims and spokes every spring. You are riding the same weight rims with similar stiffness and far fewer spokes. I highly doubt the streets you are riding are much better than the streets I rode. And you are using aluminum nipples. Brass nipples lace up better, are far stronger and allow tighter spokes. If you told a mechanic of my day what you are using he would predict exactly what you are seeing. Yes, you are riding much stronger rims, the new aluminum alloys see to that, but stronger does not mean stiffer so that isn't helping your spokes.

Oh, I weighed 150 pounds and was not hard on wheels. I suggest you ride rims closer to 500 grams with at least 32 spokes for commuting and save these for weekends and good roads.

Ben

SquidPuppet

+

= problems

TimothyH

I'm not too happy with the set I got yesterday. There were several issues, none having to do with spoke count or broken spokes.

To be fair, my lower end Bianchi frame may be part of one of the issues. The bike has stamped dropouts and the wheels do not fit. The proprietary bolts/bezels don't close enough to be able to clamp each dropout. The video below is with the bolts tightened all the way on both sides.


Wabi stated that the wheels were designed for a bike with "more substantial dropouts, in the 8 - 10 mm range" and that he has never encountered this issue. Richard suggested that I use washers or file down the axles on the rear wheel - I'm really not into having to do either on a brand new set of wheels and they agreed to take the wheels back if that is what I wanted. Be forewarned if you have stamped dropouts - these wheels probably are not for you.

The website says they are supposed to come with a lockring but it wasn't included. One is being shipped.

I also wonder about quality control on the hubs. The cog/lockring threads look like they weren't deburred at all. I don't know what all the black fibers are about in the picture but you can see all the metal trash on the threads, really sloppy. Both sides are the same. I used some light machine oil and a scotchbrite pad to deburr it myself.




-Tim-

Onfixiate

Joytech hubs are not typically known for high quality...

Dave1978

I just got a State Undefeated and these wheels were recommended across the board for a good budget upgrade over the stocks. I weigh 154 and use my bike for exercise and joy riding on bike paths and stuff. I don't commute with it. I don't need the super light sub set, just the regular set is fine. The frame has stamped dropouts that are just over 6mm thick. Is this still a good option?

Nagrom_

Yes.

OP is a Clydesdale commuting through NYC and is surprised his sub 1500g wheelset isn't holding up. Beats me.

cDiff Notorious

The old wheelset is good.

seau grateau

I believe the expression is, "Lightweight, durable, cheap -- pick two."

TimothyH

I wanted to follow up on this thread... Not so unhappy any longer...

After about 150 miles of suburban Atlanta roads, the Sub 15 wheels are out of true just a little and they are going to the shop next week. Hopefully they will stay true after the initial break in. Time will tell. FTR, I weigh 185.

These made a huge difference on my bike - down from 21.6 Lbs to 19.8 Lbs - and I'm really happy with the way they ride. The biggest difference is climbing. Now I can get over some of the nasty hills here without running out of gas.

On a side note, I switched from 25mm tires to 23mm but could feel the deformation of the sidewall - a squishiness - right away. Definitely more rolling resistance with 23's. In spite of the wheels being only 18.2mm wide I switched back to 25mm tires after a few rides and can feel a positive difference in both speed and quality of the ride.

I've ditched the stubby 15mm combination wrench and now carry 2x 5mm hex wrenches in my saddle bag instead, one long and one short. Yes, the wheels do use 5mm bolts.

The wheels did not work with the stamped dropouts on my Bianchi Pista because they were too thin and so I used two washers, I think they were size M10. Tightening the bolts was a pain with the washers behind the bezels because the washers caused the fasteners to walk all over the place, sliding back and forth as they were tightened. It took multiple tries to get the wheel centered and the chain tension right - wasn't looking forward to dealing with this on the side of the road trying to repair a flat. It held, but I really didn't like it at all.

What worked really well are the stainless Dropout Protectors from Wabi. They were about $12 after shipping and arrived USPS in two days. If you have stamped dropouts and are concerned that they will not be thick enough for the fasteners to bite then you would do well to order these too. These make the installation nice and clean and I was able to get the wheel centered and chain tension correct on the first try.


Wabi Stainless steel rear axle washer



Before...



After...




-Tim-