cudak888 

I looked at it and can't be 100% sure that it's split. Given the bubbling of the paint around that area (probably from lack of adhesion to the chrome), I think it's just paint flaking off in a very deceptive way.

I could be wrong.

-Kurt

beicster 

My thought as well.

WGB 

I emailed seller because rustystrings 61 wants it. Haven't got a reply back maybe seller is done with me.

If still in sellers good graces will hopefully see it tomorrow afternoon\evening. I saw that spot and will only take if no obvious cracks or breaks or bends or god knows what....

Schreck83 

Looks to be white where the paint is chipped at lugs




Loosened bolt and applied some penetrating oil....26.6 to 26.8 diameter vs. 26.4 for my 72 SC


Seat tube ding


27" Weinmann rims on Normandy hubs; TDC 14-28 freewheel


Round-oval-round chainstays with indent for chainwheel. Same as my 72 SC

cudak888 

White would seem to indicate the Grand Sports/Gran Sport.

Any word on the fitness of the dropout?

If you plan to repaint it, that'd be a great opportunity to roll out the dent in the seattube and fill the cracks in the seatstay caps with silver solder too.

-Kurt

Schreck83 

The dropouts are fine. Just flaking paint. Serial # on NDS dropout:0009188

Darth Lefty 

Is this like birdwatching when if you doubt for a moment that the eagle is a buzzard then it becomes a buzzard?

madpogue 

D'OH, we've had a '75 (-ish) Gran Sport for over 30 years, and I never noticed it had stamped dropouts. Seems so cheap for an all-531 frame.

Anyway, rear triangle and main lug work look a lot like our GS, but the fork lugs are completely different.

cudak888 

Early ones were Zeus or Simplex. Then they went to the bog-standard stamped drop of the Super Course and everything below it.

It probably streamlined production so they could produce all-531 frames quickly and sell them cheaper than the next guy. Relying on their own stamped dropout = no logistical issues or extra costs from dealing with outside suppliers.

Or not. Sometimes, you can't explain Raleigh's decisions with rational explanations.


-Kurt

rustystrings61 

I’ve seen at least two different crowns used, this simpler one and what I think was a Vagner PL variant.

madpogue 

"Stout" is a perfectly rational explanation, as is "Watneys".

rustystrings61 

And I went and looked and this bike has the Vagner DP + losange fraise - the other crown I've seen on these bikes is the Vagner no. 11. Not that I'm OCD about these things or anything ... though I do find it funny that this is probably a 1973, and the Competition I've been monkeying around with is a 1973, and I got my very first drop-bar road bike in - yup, 1973.

Schreck83 and I are working something out. This could be a fun project!

USAZorro

I have at least two examples of models that are above the Super Course that do not have forged dropouts. There's a 1971 Competition (lilac) that has Zeus Competicion dropouts, and a Grand Sports (with no serial number to be found on the frame or dropouts) that has forged dropouts that I can't make out the markings on. I had thought this was 1973-ish, but frankly am not certain.

Schreck83 

I have the Grand Sport stripped down to the bare frame. With the fork and headset (no BB) it weighs 7 lbs. 2 oz. I measured my '72 SuperCourse, which is also a 23.5" frame, to be 7 lbs. 13 oz. That is a difference you can feel when you lift them.
Based on the SN, the GS is a 1973 model. The frame geometry between these two frames is the same, except the GS wheelbase is longer at 41.5" vs. 41" for the SC. The GS top tube is 1/4" longer and the fork has 2.5" rake instead of 2.25" on the SC. The GS head tube is 1/4" longer also. Overall, this GS is a stretched version of the SC with a lighter tubeset.

Kent T

I got my first bike with Drop Bars, and Disraeli Gears in 1973. And it was a Raleigh, of the new old stock 1969 Green smallest framed International kind, from 3 speed Sturmey-Archer IGH, to Disreali gears of the Campagnolo Nuovo Record kind. $200 with panniers and rack bought with my second paycheck at 9 years old as broadcast engineer assistant and announcer, and the only special needs schoolboy with keys to the building, and a job after school and on weekends. ($9 per hour in 1973, my ticket to higher learning, still in the same profession). Rode that bike to 1978, when I outgrew it. Afternoon announcer at work bought it from me in 1978 (still rides it daily, maintains it well like I have). I miss my 531, and my International, if I find one I can afford, my size, I plan on restoring it and riding it like it was 1970 something.

rustystrings61 

It occurred to me that it would be good to show the bike in its current state - as built up and ridden in the 2020 Clunker Challenge 100 No. 6 Covid edition -



Mismatched 27-in wheels with (heavy!) Bell Streetster tires, Sugino VP crankset and BB from a donor '87 Schwinn World Sport, Weinmann 999s in 610 and 750 from the great parts stash, Carlton hooded levers from my '73 Competition, SunTour derailleur set from a '75 Motobecane GT, steel 26.4 mm seatpost from an ancient Peugeot PR-10L with a shim to get it to 27.2, ratty Centurion-branded Vetta from a bike literally rescued from a scrapyard, recycled shellacked cotton bar tape, scavenged rando bars and a recycled stem - but it all works pretty well together and comes in at 27 lbs or so, without bag but with the Zefal lights.

Post Clunker Challenge, it's nestled into the centerpull-centric stack of '71-73 Anglo-French iron in my workshop. waiting for its next incarnation - sports tourer with lighter parts? Fixed-gear, front dynamo hub dedicated commuter?