Mechanical 12 speed road group set
08-31-20, 07:31 PM
#1
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Thread Starter
Mechanical 12 speed road group set
Am I correct in that Campagnolo has the only fully mechanical 12 speed road group set on the market right now?
Also, would anyone happen to know if there is any way to mix up Sram and Campy to get a mechanical 12 speed road group set with Sram's AXS cassette that goes down to 10 tooth and their flat top chain?
Also, would anyone happen to know if there is any way to mix up Sram and Campy to get a mechanical 12 speed road group set with Sram's AXS cassette that goes down to 10 tooth and their flat top chain?
08-31-20, 07:39 PM
#2
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Talk to Dave, he seems to know a lot about Campy 12 speed.
https://www.bikeforums.net/members/davesss-142522.html
https://www.bikeforums.net/members/davesss-142522.html
08-31-20, 07:48 PM
#3
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Thread Starter
Talk to Dave, he seems to know a lot about Campy 12 speed.
https://www.bikeforums.net/members/davesss-142522.html
https://www.bikeforums.net/members/davesss-142522.html
08-31-20, 09:23 PM
#4
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I am guessing it won’t work because SRAM spacing is fixed whereas Campy cassette spacing is variable. If it does I imagine it would be noisy.
Campy does have an 11/34 cassette.
Campy does have an 11/34 cassette.
08-31-20, 09:33 PM
#5
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Thread Starter
Plus, the AXS cassette goes down to a 10 tooth for and has 8 gears with a single tooth spread vs seven the Campy group set.
Last edited by Melvang; 08-31-20 at 09:40 PM.
09-01-20, 09:11 AM
#6
Senior Member
Am I correct in that Campagnolo has the only fully mechanical 12 speed road group set on the market right now?
Also, would anyone happen to know if there is any way to mix up Sram and Campy to get a mechanical 12 speed road group set with Sram's AXS cassette that goes down to 10 tooth and their flat top chain?
Also, would anyone happen to know if there is any way to mix up Sram and Campy to get a mechanical 12 speed road group set with Sram's AXS cassette that goes down to 10 tooth and their flat top chain?
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09-01-20, 10:04 AM
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From Weight Weenies:
Now for measurements... I took some calipers and measured (in inches, sorry!) the cassette total width, spacing, overhang, and cog width.
The Campagnolo measures 1.610" from outside-to-outside of the cogs. Each cog is about 0.057" thick with 0.080" of spacing between them (the "about" is because of the machined profile). The 11-tooth cog--like the 11 speed versions--will "fit into" the 12-tooth cog slightly.
The SRAM measures 1.631" from outside-to-outside, so it is a hair wider than the Campagnolo. The cogs are slightly wider at 0.070 for the 28-tooth aluminum gear to 0.062 for the steel ones. The spacing between cogs is also uniform.
Conclusion? We're looking at a 0.021" delta over the width of 12 cogs, or about 0.5mm. I think this is within the tolerance of bicycle components and that the standard EPS adjustments will make it work.
Now for measurements... I took some calipers and measured (in inches, sorry!) the cassette total width, spacing, overhang, and cog width.
The Campagnolo measures 1.610" from outside-to-outside of the cogs. Each cog is about 0.057" thick with 0.080" of spacing between them (the "about" is because of the machined profile). The 11-tooth cog--like the 11 speed versions--will "fit into" the 12-tooth cog slightly.
The SRAM measures 1.631" from outside-to-outside, so it is a hair wider than the Campagnolo. The cogs are slightly wider at 0.070 for the 28-tooth aluminum gear to 0.062 for the steel ones. The spacing between cogs is also uniform.
Conclusion? We're looking at a 0.021" delta over the width of 12 cogs, or about 0.5mm. I think this is within the tolerance of bicycle components and that the standard EPS adjustments will make it work.
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09-01-20, 11:33 AM
#8
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Thread Starter
Nope, pure road bike. Max tire clearance is 25. I *might* be able to fit some 28s, but probably only with the correct rims.
09-01-20, 11:34 AM
#9
Senior Member
Thread Starter
From Weight Weenies:
Now for measurements... I took some calipers and measured (in inches, sorry!) the cassette total width, spacing, overhang, and cog width.
The Campagnolo measures 1.610" from outside-to-outside of the cogs. Each cog is about 0.057" thick with 0.080" of spacing between them (the "about" is because of the machined profile). The 11-tooth cog--like the 11 speed versions--will "fit into" the 12-tooth cog slightly.
The SRAM measures 1.631" from outside-to-outside, so it is a hair wider than the Campagnolo. The cogs are slightly wider at 0.070 for the 28-tooth aluminum gear to 0.062 for the steel ones. The spacing between cogs is also uniform.
Conclusion? We're looking at a 0.021" delta over the width of 12 cogs, or about 0.5mm. I think this is within the tolerance of bicycle components and that the standard EPS adjustments will make it work.
Now for measurements... I took some calipers and measured (in inches, sorry!) the cassette total width, spacing, overhang, and cog width.
The Campagnolo measures 1.610" from outside-to-outside of the cogs. Each cog is about 0.057" thick with 0.080" of spacing between them (the "about" is because of the machined profile). The 11-tooth cog--like the 11 speed versions--will "fit into" the 12-tooth cog slightly.
The SRAM measures 1.631" from outside-to-outside, so it is a hair wider than the Campagnolo. The cogs are slightly wider at 0.070 for the 28-tooth aluminum gear to 0.062 for the steel ones. The spacing between cogs is also uniform.
Conclusion? We're looking at a 0.021" delta over the width of 12 cogs, or about 0.5mm. I think this is within the tolerance of bicycle components and that the standard EPS adjustments will make it work.
09-01-20, 04:04 PM
#10
Senior Member
I've been using Campy chorus 12 for over a year. It works with an axs chain. Campy is only brand making a 12 speed mechanical group. I got my complete groups from pinkjersey.com I recently tried a SRAM 10-36 cassette with the campy 12 drivetrain and it worked great, but does require a 1 inch longer chain than recommended for the Campy 11-34. Campy has specific chain length requirements, depending on chain stay length. With 406mm chain stays, a 55 inch chain is needed. The change to a SRAM cassette required very little readjustment of the RD. Those who have taken accurate measurements of the two cassettes have found that the 12 speed cassette spacing is closer, between the brands, than 11 speed.
I also recently switched to SRAM force axs electronic about 3 weeks ago, but use my campy 48/32 crank and rim brakes. I converted my campy zonda wheels to sram with an xdr freehub body that cost $65 from competitive cyclist. The 48/32 crank is the only one that makes much sense with SRAM's 10T first sprocket. The 48/10 gear is the same as a 53/11.
I also recently switched to SRAM force axs electronic about 3 weeks ago, but use my campy 48/32 crank and rim brakes. I converted my campy zonda wheels to sram with an xdr freehub body that cost $65 from competitive cyclist. The 48/32 crank is the only one that makes much sense with SRAM's 10T first sprocket. The 48/10 gear is the same as a 53/11.
Last edited by DaveSSS; 09-01-20 at 04:59 PM.
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09-01-20, 06:21 PM
#11
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Thread Starter
I've been using Campy chorus 12 for over a year. It works with an axs chain. Campy is only brand making a 12 speed mechanical group. I got my complete groups from pinkjersey.com I recently tried a SRAM 10-36 cassette with the campy 12 drivetrain and it worked great, but does require a 1 inch longer chain than recommended for the Campy 11-34. Campy has specific chain length requirements, depending on chain stay length. With 406mm chain stays, a 55 inch chain is needed. The change to a SRAM cassette required very little readjustment of the RD. Those who have taken accurate measurements of the two cassettes have found that the 12 speed cassette spacing is closer, between the brands, than 11 speed.
I also recently switched to SRAM force axs electronic about 3 weeks ago, but use my campy 48/32 crank and rim brakes. I converted my campy zonda wheels to sram with an xdr freehub body that cost $65 from competitive cyclist. The 48/32 crank is the only one that makes much sense with SRAM's 10T first sprocket. The 48/10 gear is the same as a 53/11.
I also recently switched to SRAM force axs electronic about 3 weeks ago, but use my campy 48/32 crank and rim brakes. I converted my campy zonda wheels to sram with an xdr freehub body that cost $65 from competitive cyclist. The 48/32 crank is the only one that makes much sense with SRAM's 10T first sprocket. The 48/10 gear is the same as a 53/11.
If this works, it means I can get exactly what I am looking for. The 10-26 cassette (really flat or gently rolling hills where I live) for really close gears, and not have to at for etap. Nothing against electronic gears, just not quite ready to pay that price tag and have yet something else on the bike that is battery-powered. And have that gorgeous looking flat top chain.
Not to worried about the freehub body as I will need to build up some new wheels anyway.
09-01-20, 11:59 PM
#12
Senior Member
Thread Starter
I've been using Campy chorus 12 for over a year. It works with an axs chain. Campy is only brand making a 12 speed mechanical group. I got my complete groups from pinkjersey.com I recently tried a SRAM 10-36 cassette with the campy 12 drivetrain and it worked great, but does require a 1 inch longer chain than recommended for the Campy 11-34. Campy has specific chain length requirements, depending on chain stay length. With 406mm chain stays, a 55 inch chain is needed. The change to a SRAM cassette required very little readjustment of the RD. Those who have taken accurate measurements of the two cassettes have found that the 12 speed cassette spacing is closer, between the brands, than 11 speed.
I also recently switched to SRAM force axs electronic about 3 weeks ago, but use my campy 48/32 crank and rim brakes. I converted my campy zonda wheels to sram with an xdr freehub body that cost $65 from competitive cyclist. The 48/32 crank is the only one that makes much sense with SRAM's 10T first sprocket. The 48/10 gear is the same as a 53/11.
I also recently switched to SRAM force axs electronic about 3 weeks ago, but use my campy 48/32 crank and rim brakes. I converted my campy zonda wheels to sram with an xdr freehub body that cost $65 from competitive cyclist. The 48/32 crank is the only one that makes much sense with SRAM's 10T first sprocket. The 48/10 gear is the same as a 53/11.
09-02-20, 06:14 AM
#13
Senior Member
Campy will eventually offer some cassettes starting with a 10T, but it will be awhile. They have the new freehub body ready to go with the new Ekar 1x13 group that has cassettes starting with a 9.
Last edited by DaveSSS; 09-09-20 at 02:46 PM.
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09-03-20, 04:20 PM
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Random thought, probably wrong...
Given the tiny differences in cog spacing, maybe swapping out the upper pulley in the derailleur with one with a bit more float might be enough to make it work?
I've done this in the opposite direction... making 9-speed friction shifting work without ghost shifts by putting in Bullseye-type pulleys, which didn't have any lateral play. So maybe a 9 or 10 speed pulley would have a bit more float, enough to accommodate the difference in spacing?
--Shannon
Given the tiny differences in cog spacing, maybe swapping out the upper pulley in the derailleur with one with a bit more float might be enough to make it work?
I've done this in the opposite direction... making 9-speed friction shifting work without ghost shifts by putting in Bullseye-type pulleys, which didn't have any lateral play. So maybe a 9 or 10 speed pulley would have a bit more float, enough to accommodate the difference in spacing?
--Shannon
