KOF MAP S & P Randonneur Review
07-11-20, 12:04 PM
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KOF MAP S & P Randonneur Review
Not sure if I'm posting this in the right place, but I've got an overdue long term review of my MAP rando bike up on my blog here:
2014 MAP S & P Randonneur Project: Kinda Fancy, Pretty Fast, Super Comfy ? The Beautiful Bicycle
2014 MAP S & P Randonneur Project: Kinda Fancy, Pretty Fast, Super Comfy ? The Beautiful Bicycle
07-11-20, 12:12 PM
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Nice bike! Thanks for sharing it.
And I like the word "foppishness".
And I like the word "foppishness".
07-11-20, 12:47 PM
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Nice write up, Scott! That's a great bike.
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07-11-20, 12:56 PM
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Thanks for contributing your review. I'm interested in hearing more about the geometry, if you feel like sharing. Looks like a relatively long headtube for a 61cm frame - which I find appealing.
07-11-20, 01:08 PM
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As I mentioned on PL, great bike and thanks for the review.
My wife has a similar story to yours, as she has quite a few other nice bikes.
They all just sit there, as she only rides her MAP.
My wife has a similar story to yours, as she has quite a few other nice bikes.
They all just sit there, as she only rides her MAP.
07-11-20, 01:11 PM
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Great review, great bike and tx for posting, no way we ever get enough MAP goodness here. 
07-11-20, 01:17 PM
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Soup_Please ,
Thanks for that great review! MAP had been on my “Dream Bikes” list until hearing about his devastating loss from the fire. Interestingly, a L’Avecaise is also still on that list. I’d be interested to hear more about that comparison (just read that review, also your Coho review) as well as the Alex Singer and Tournesol. I’m also a tall, skinny, not powerful rider, so your comments hit home, especially “...goes up hill, like a giant lightweight spring in sync with my body”. Love that feel on the Marinoni SLX, but I’d be fascinated to get a sense of how much better it can be with a more modern tubeset. I’m also significantly older, even less powerful, haven’t dared try L’Eroica and unlikely to become a true randonneur. But I have followed Matt Pendergast on a dirt road. Pretty sure he was holding back so I could keep up.
Your 61cm frame with 650B’s is interesting, since I ride big 62-63cm frames, but my 650B conversion is limited to 38’s, and that bike is more medium-ish trail. I’ve also got a big Waxwing bag on my other, not-650B-able bike with Gugificazione low trail modded fork, front racks, etc. Great bags! Is your self-made aluminum stiffener more than an upper frame? How is the handling with front panniers? Any experience with them in significant winds?
And many of the roads In Oregon you mention are familiar! The Banks-Vernonia Trail was a favorite, explored with OR buddies on a group ride several years ago. Haven’t done the Covered Bridges Trail yet, but will certainly do so eventually since my son’s in-laws are finishing their house right next to it.
Thanks for that great review! MAP had been on my “Dream Bikes” list until hearing about his devastating loss from the fire. Interestingly, a L’Avecaise is also still on that list. I’d be interested to hear more about that comparison (just read that review, also your Coho review) as well as the Alex Singer and Tournesol. I’m also a tall, skinny, not powerful rider, so your comments hit home, especially “...goes up hill, like a giant lightweight spring in sync with my body”. Love that feel on the Marinoni SLX, but I’d be fascinated to get a sense of how much better it can be with a more modern tubeset. I’m also significantly older, even less powerful, haven’t dared try L’Eroica and unlikely to become a true randonneur. But I have followed Matt Pendergast on a dirt road. Pretty sure he was holding back so I could keep up.
Your 61cm frame with 650B’s is interesting, since I ride big 62-63cm frames, but my 650B conversion is limited to 38’s, and that bike is more medium-ish trail. I’ve also got a big Waxwing bag on my other, not-650B-able bike with Gugificazione low trail modded fork, front racks, etc. Great bags! Is your self-made aluminum stiffener more than an upper frame? How is the handling with front panniers? Any experience with them in significant winds?
And many of the roads In Oregon you mention are familiar! The Banks-Vernonia Trail was a favorite, explored with OR buddies on a group ride several years ago. Haven’t done the Covered Bridges Trail yet, but will certainly do so eventually since my son’s in-laws are finishing their house right next to it.
Last edited by Dfrost; 07-11-20 at 02:17 PM.
07-11-20, 04:01 PM
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Good to hear from you Scott and good write up! I assume you did OK in the fires and I’m glad for that. I want a MAP now! Only thing I would think to improve the review would be detail pics - welds, BB, etc.
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07-11-20, 05:33 PM
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I just put added everything I know about the geometry and tubing to the blog entry. For the record, I'm 6'2.5" tall with long arms and legs.
07-11-20, 05:37 PM
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Thanks much for the comment and suggestions. Yes, I should take some more detail pics. I did add some geometry specs. We came through the fires okay, now we just gotta survive the heatwave and hang on until fall. I'm getting too old for 4:45am start times!
07-11-20, 05:41 PM
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Had a similar question from the iBob list, here was my response: "The Lyon was a really great bike, but the fit on the MAP (longer tt and taller head tube) just felt like home from the first time I rode it. Also, I find the the 650b 42mm tires are just more versatile and comfy for bad/dirt roads; the Lyon was limited to 35mm tires with fenders. The Singer just didn't speak to me, I never felt at home on it and it was relatively heavy.The Tournesol was more of a catch and release for me so I can't comment much about the ride as I never got it built up properly. I can't remember who I sold it to now? Likely someone on this list! haha."
Soup_Please ,
Thanks for that great review! MAP had been on my “Dream Bikes” list until hearing about his devastating loss from the fire. Interestingly, a L’Avecaise is also still on that list. I’d be interested to hear more about that comparison (just read that review, also your Coho review) as well as the Alex Singer and Tournesol. I’m also a tall, skinny, not powerful rider, so your comments hit home, especially “...goes up hill, like a giant lightweight spring in sync with my body”. Love that feel on the Marinoni SLX, but I’d be fascinated to get a sense of how much better it can be with a more modern tubeset. I’m also significantly older, even less powerful, haven’t dared try L’Eroica and unlikely to become a true randonneur. But I have followed Matt Pendergast on a dirt road. Pretty sure he was holding back so I could keep up.
Your 61cm frame with 650B’s is interesting, since I ride big 62-63cm frames, but my 650B conversion is limited to 38’s, and that bike is more medium-ish trail. I’ve also got a big Waxwing bag on my other, not-650B-able bike with Gugificazione low trail modded fork, front racks, etc. Great bags! Is your self-made aluminum stiffener more than an upper frame? How is the handling with front panniers? Any experience with them in significant winds?
And many of the roads In Oregon you mention are familiar! The Banks-Vernonia Trail was a favorite, explored with OR buddies on a group ride several years ago. Haven’t done the Covered Bridges Trail yet, but will certainly do so eventually since my son’s in-laws are finishing their house right next to it.
Thanks for that great review! MAP had been on my “Dream Bikes” list until hearing about his devastating loss from the fire. Interestingly, a L’Avecaise is also still on that list. I’d be interested to hear more about that comparison (just read that review, also your Coho review) as well as the Alex Singer and Tournesol. I’m also a tall, skinny, not powerful rider, so your comments hit home, especially “...goes up hill, like a giant lightweight spring in sync with my body”. Love that feel on the Marinoni SLX, but I’d be fascinated to get a sense of how much better it can be with a more modern tubeset. I’m also significantly older, even less powerful, haven’t dared try L’Eroica and unlikely to become a true randonneur. But I have followed Matt Pendergast on a dirt road. Pretty sure he was holding back so I could keep up.
Your 61cm frame with 650B’s is interesting, since I ride big 62-63cm frames, but my 650B conversion is limited to 38’s, and that bike is more medium-ish trail. I’ve also got a big Waxwing bag on my other, not-650B-able bike with Gugificazione low trail modded fork, front racks, etc. Great bags! Is your self-made aluminum stiffener more than an upper frame? How is the handling with front panniers? Any experience with them in significant winds?
And many of the roads In Oregon you mention are familiar! The Banks-Vernonia Trail was a favorite, explored with OR buddies on a group ride several years ago. Haven’t done the Covered Bridges Trail yet, but will certainly do so eventually since my son’s in-laws are finishing their house right next to it.
07-11-20, 08:02 PM
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Had a similar question from the iBob list, here was my response: "The Lyon was a really great bike, but the fit on the MAP (longer tt and taller head tube) just felt like home from the first time I rode it. Also, I find the the 650b 42mm tires are just more versatile and comfy for bad/dirt roads; the Lyon was limited to 35mm tires with fenders. The Singer just didn't speak to me, I never felt at home on it and it was relatively heavy.The Tournesol was more of a catch and release for me so I can't comment much about the ride as I never got it built up properly. I can't remember who I sold it to now? Likely someone on this list! haha."
After reading your several reviews, I guessed that your comparison would be about the tire size and fit differences, since you certainly seemed quite enamored with the Lyon in your review. Surprised that a Singer would be relatively heavy.
About tire sizes, what’s your perspective on the relative “nimbleness” of 700x35 versus 650Bx42? Jan Heine in a recent blog post mentioned this In describing why he’d selected 650B for his PBP bike. If I were to go down the dream bike path at this point in my 71YO life, that’s the biggest quandary I’d have to confront.
And if anyone else wants to add their thoughts on that subject...
Last edited by Dfrost; 07-11-20 at 08:06 PM.
07-11-20, 09:52 PM
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On my newest bike I’m running 700 x 38mm Compass/RH tires set up tubeless. On my most ridden bike, which Soup_Please hasnseen in person, I’m running 700 x 35mm Compass/RH tires with tubes. I really thought the 35s were ideal, great balance of cush and speed. At first, the 38s felt sluggish, but after about a 100 miles, I realized my avg speed was a tick faster, and the overall smoothness of those fatties is really terrific. It’s not quite an apples-to-apples comparison (though the newest bike was based on the specs of the other one), but a bit of a breakthrough for me.
07-11-20, 10:07 PM
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Lovely review. And that you sold such classics to save space for your MAP!
I attempted Mt. Lemmon this morning (traveling this week) but was turned back by the sheriffs. Some of my approach was smooth on my 23 gp4000s but about half was rather rough and 28s would be my preference if that was local to me. The temp was only 40 degrees warmer than I'm accustomed to for a morning ride.
I attempted Mt. Lemmon this morning (traveling this week) but was turned back by the sheriffs. Some of my approach was smooth on my 23 gp4000s but about half was rather rough and 28s would be my preference if that was local to me. The temp was only 40 degrees warmer than I'm accustomed to for a morning ride.
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I don't do: disks, tubeless, e-shifting, or bead head nymphs.
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