Dawes-man

I realise this is a bit of a long shot but I'm hoping that some of you C&V'ers have had a go at cutting a blank TA chainring to your own designs. Failing that, that some of you might have a chainring that someone else cut from a blank. And failing even that, that someone here might have a photo of such a chainring.

Yesterday I cycled over to Hasegawa Jitensha to see if they had a rear rack that would fit my wife's De Rosa. Every bike shop in Tokyo caters to racers, none to tourers, except Hasegawa which is a very old school shop that caters to Randonneur riders, been in business for 40 years since he took over from his father. This is him in the shop:
[IMG]
Mr Hasegawa's Bike Shop - Hasegawa Jitensha by Dawes-man, on Flickr[/IMG]

I found a very nice rack, a Nitto R10, beautifully made by hand, cost just $50, but he also had a couple of blank alloy chainwheel, one made by TA for $45 and one made by Sugino for half that. He told me that 'back in the day' riders would go touring armed with one of these wheels, presumably drilled at home before they set off, and a file, and sit around the campfire filing away as they chatted about all things bicycle.

Now, I remembered seeing this photo of a wheel cut by HR Morris on Classic Lightweights, and thinking, 'Wow!':
[IMG]
hrm-builder7 by Dawes-man, on Flickr[/IMG]

Quite a few Alex Singer and Rene Herse chainwheels are hand-cut, which makes them so collectible, and so expensive. See this:
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/3705714452...ht_6135wt_1141


Mr Hasegawa told me some people would personalise their wheels with their initials, and showed me one such example. I didn't have my camera with me so didn't get a photos but - all very cool, I thought. So I bought the cheaper, Sugino blank for my first attempt... don't want to ruin a perfectly good TA Got it home and late last night started playing around with some paper and a compass to try to see how to do the cutting:
[IMG]
IMG_7735 by Dawes-man, on Flickr[/IMG]

This is by no means what I have decided to do, just some doodling while searching for ideas. I've also dug out a fascinating book that I haven't looked at for a few years now, called 'Geometric Concepts in Islamic Art' which explains how all the intricate patterns traditional to Islamic art are derived from a simple circle and devisions thereof. I don't imagine there are many people who didn't play around with paper and a compass as kids, making flower designs. My interest was re-awoken when I spent 7 months travelling around the Middle East in the late 1970s - all those mosques in Turkey, Syria, Jordan, Egypt, The Sudan and Israel...

A couple pages from the book:
[IMG]
IMG_7736_2 by Dawes-man, on Flickr[/IMG]

This one reminds me of a chainwheel I've seen somewhere... don't know why but Ashtabula comes to mind:
[IMG]
IMG_7737_2 by Dawes-man, on Flickr[/IMG]

This is going to be a time-consuming, and necessarily long-term project, so I'm not about to produce a finished wheel in the next couple of day. But when I do get one done, I'll post the result in the forum. In the meantime, what can anyone show us? Any experiences? Any tips?

dbakl

Cool! How much are the blanks and what sizes do they come?

repechage

Blank chainrings, rarely have seen those before and the ones I have seen were by no means production.

Dawes-man

The Sugino I bought was actually discounted (I've just remembered) to ¥1,500, just under $20 US. I didn't count the TA but the Sugino has 47 teeth. The TA looked about the same, maybe 48. Both were 3/32". I have a 48t TA single on my Hetchins and the gearing is a touch high with the 14/17/20/23/26 freewheel on it. I know... 1 tooth at the front won't make a big difference but every little helps

I would go bigger at the back but the old Gran Sport struggles a little with the 26t cog as it is.

dbakl

Dang, get me a 47!

Dawes-man

Seriously? Could be arranged... TA or Sugino, if they have both in 47? The ¥1500 was a special offer and the Sugino would normally be ¥2000 and the TA ¥4000, or US $26/52 at the present exchange rate. Plus shipping, of course.

Alex Moll

Wow - coool!!!

Does anybody else remember the "Spirograph" from the 70s?

These are neat, and I love the bit about sitting around the campfire with a file, while on a bike tour. Sounds really wonderful - Drillium dude, are you with me? I actually have a cordless Dremel . . .

Anyway, Dawes-man, thank you very much for sharing this. I'm quite tempted. Any idea what shipping to Washington state would cost?

Thanks,
Alex

mkeller234

Those images are really interesting. This is a fun thread, make sure to keep us updated. I like the look of that bike shop, it reminds me of my own mess in my workspace... only his has nicer things.

Dawes-man

Good grief! Yes, indeed, but until seeing it in your post I don't think I've thought about them for 40 years or so. A blast from the past. Anybody could draw perfect patterns with one of those. Thanks for reminding me

No, but I sent 5 CDs in a padded bag to a friend in the US the other day and I think it cost about $8.

Dawes-man

Just for you, mkeller, here are some more I must take my camera with me next time as they've tidied the place up since I took these:
[IMG]
Mr Hasegawa's Bike Shop - Hasegawa Jitensha by Dawes-man, on Flickr[/IMG]

Mrs Hasegawa - she makes the coffee and takes the money:
[IMG]
Mr Hasegawa's Bike Shop - Hasegawa Jitensha by Dawes-man, on Flickr[/IMG]

[IMG]
Mr Hasegawa's Bike Shop - Hasegawa Jitensha by Dawes-man, on Flickr[/IMG]

[IMG]
Mr Hasegawa's Bike Shop - Hasegawa Jitensha by Dawes-man, on Flickr[/IMG]

You can just see part of a blank chainwheel in this shot, under the bbig blue bag:
[IMG]
Mr Hasegawa's Bike Shop - Hasegawa Jitensha by Dawes-man, on Flickr[/IMG]

Loads of small frames, too, and a huge stock of Honjo mudguards:
[IMG]
Mr Hasegawa's Bike Shop - Hasegawa Jitensha by Dawes-man, on Flickr[/IMG]

Okay, Dawes man... THAT'S enough!

Drillium Dude 

Roger all!

Damn, that is some interesting stuff! And the pics of the shop - I wonder if I can squeeze in a two-year unaccompanied DOD tour in Japan before I retire....

DD

you

That's cool. So were the teeth part of the blank chainwheel, or was that part of the filing? My bud was telling me about an Ohio "bicycle hero" who created his own chainring out of a piece of sheet metal for a Raleigh that he outfitted with a homemade derailleur and fenders made out of plastic waterbottles that he shaped with a heat gun. I'll post a link when I figure it out again.

you

Here's a link to the photoset for that bicycle hero, named Chuck Harris. Looks like the chainwheel may have been a blank, but that derailleur is something else, for sure!
https://home.earthlink.net/~mike.web/CH.html

Dawes-man

Fabulous! Thanks for the link to Chuck Harris' photos. Reminds me of an elderly BMW rider I know in Tokyo, owns Ku****ani leathers, who made his own handlebar heaters by diverting the engine oil through his handlebars. He told me it was a huge PIA to do but it was back before anyone made handlebar heaters for bikes. His bike looks horrible but he's ridden it every day since buying it new in 1979.

The blank leaves the factory with teeth. I think Mr Harris' did, as well. They look like standard TA wheels, albeit the outer rather large. I count 66 teeth. I can't think where he might have used that.

Dawes-man

Someone needs to review the censoring software - that should read Kushi tani. And what is the software supposed to save us from? Anyone been in the army?

Drillium Dude 

For about 9 months in Afghanistan, 2009 - and I've been active duty Navy for going on 24 years; I've heard it all - at least twice - and I'm still a nice guy

DD

Dawes-man

BTW, this is the chainwheel I thought was made by Alex Singer (URL in my first post) but I misread the description. The seller, rhclassics, says "Alex Singer etc" so I guess it was made by someone else... IF it's not a factory wheel. I assumed it wasn't as I'd never seen one like it. Anyone recognise it? It sold for $528 US:
[IMG]
seller rhclassics eBay by Dawes-man, on Flickr[/IMG]

Dawes-man

My point entirely.

realestvin7

I may be down with getting some of those Suginos, Dawes-man. Are there any other 50.4 BCD options over there? About as affordable, or more so, than the blank Suginos? Cut-out rings are fine. I'd like some spare rings for my 50.4 cranks. Thanks!

Dawes-man

By 50.4, do you mean 5-bolt, Stronglight 49D size?

realestvin7

Yep. That very one. Some folks call it "5 pin" as well.

Dawes-man

If you're looking for 2nd hand, he sells new stuff.

Otherwise, singles? Doubles? Triples? TA? He has a lot of stuff.

rhm

I did this last year. Original Raleigh RRA cranks and chain rings are unobtanium, and have a distinctive look; so I got a solid aluminum disk BMX chain ring and did this to it:



The crank is a Constrictor from the 30's or 40's. The solid chain ring cost about $10 shipped, and it's a full 6 mm thick (!). I did this entirely by hand, using an electric drill and an electric jigsaw, and a lot of filing; and the imperfections show. I also used a router to thin the area where the ring attaches to the crank. The ring is very strong, I could remove quite a bit more material without weakening it much. I mean to go back to it with a file and thin some parts of it to make it look more like the original, and to engrave the lines around the herons' heads, eyes, waves, &c.

I think there's more information in this thread.

photogravity

As soon as I saw this thread, I thought of this chainring and figured you'd be posting it here. It is very nicely done atmo.

I have a feeling that I will be going this route with my Hercules Kestrel since the chainrings are incredibly rare as with the RRA and countless other bikes.

rootboy 

This is really cool stuff Dawes-Man. And the pics of the shop: classic. I love shops like that. They don't seem to exist anymore here. All the clutter, the crap piled everywhere. Love it.