metabike

Over the years I am fortunate to have scrounged up two pairs of Suntour Command shifters, however the sets I have can only be set to pure index or a lighter version of index, i.e. no true friction mode. Even though I am running a Cyclone derailleur on my Bianchi Volpe, I am "stuck" with a Shimano/SRAM cassette and the indexing performance is not so great. Once upon a time I remember reading something about a way to convert the Command shifters to a genuine friction mode, possibly it had something to do with removing a ball or spring from the detent mechanism. Before I open up the shifter and have a million microscopic parts and springs fall on the floor I was hoping that someone out there could tell me what's involved (if it's even possible) and how to go about accomplishing it.

Thank you in advance for any assistance.

PROBLEM SOLVED - SEE BELOW FOR HOW IT WAS DONE.

Bianchigirll 

Hello these shifters should be listed in the 'hens teeth' thread. I havent seen a pair in so long I can remember just how they work. I thought you just turned something like the bar ends. I also think they only go to a mode like ratchet chifting. can you post a pic of the shifter? you have a '90 or '91 right? what color? I always wanted one of the torquise '87-88 ones but landed a '86 this past fall. great bikes!

metabike

Here's a photo of the shifter in question (ignore the poor bar tape job) and a older photo of the bike in question. The shifter is shown set in the index mode. I believe that the Volpe is a '96 model (dark green, had RSX components when I got it a few years ago). Presently the components are a mix-up of old & new stuff - 99.9% Shimano-free and it has a rack and fenders for commuting.

Bianchigirll 

OK Hopefully Tmar or some one else will help me out here. a shimano spaced freewheel/cassette will almost never index with a suntour shifter. shimano was even spaced and suntour had different spacing on their FWs.

as for index/ friction question I have never heard of removing a part from those shifters. as I stated previously I think by rotating the cover from 7 to F7 you get a ratchet shifting, but no pure friction.

a quick peek showed a few pair of these ($150) on ebay and one had instructions. maybe if you contact the seller he will supply you with a copy.

that is one funky looking Volpe

kludgefudge

I have no idea how the insides of these shifters work, but I do know that if you remove the "spring" from the detent mechanism on campy syncros you can run them pure friction. when you open up a synchro shifter, you don't get that many parts to deal with and worry about either. I would guess your suntour internals, if you can easily get to them (i.e. the whole thing is being held together with one screw a la downtube shifters) MIGHT have something similar that you could remove. my doubts revolve around the Suntour ratchet mechanism, which may in some way hinder you from going full friction, in the traditional sense.

I suggest living with the ratchet/friction mode, it will allow the same variety of FW spacing that friction does. whats the problem with it anyway, don't like the ratchety feeling?

metabike

Nope, the other setting is just a "lighter" setting of the indexing - they might've had that at first, but these must be a later version. I have a set of Suntour's ratcheting downtube shifters and these do not ratchet (I loved the old Powershifters and I wish these had that option!). I'm hoping that someone has fiddled with the internals of the version that I have to get them to be friction shifters and that they will help me out.

I think I'll take that as a compliment...although actually getting slammed by the famous Bianchigirll is also something to add to one's life accomplishments!

Dustintendo

[/SIZE]bro that is one of the nicest looking volpes ive ever seen. mine is similar..2002 burgundy. can i ask what tires you are running?

Sixty Fiver

What is wrong with switching them to the ratchet position ?

Sixty Fiver

PS - Those shifters are really hard to find.

Bianchigirll 

I think I'll take that as a compliment...although actually getting slammed by the famous Bianchigirll is also something to add to one's life accomplishments!

well that color scheme is not for me but I like it.

"What is wrong with switching them to the ratchet position ?"

accordign to the OP they do not actually ratchet but just have lighter 7 spd clicks. at this point I think he needs to see if they are assembled correctly and check witht hat ebay seller for directions.

incase anyone cares here is the original '86 Volpe

fuzz2050

I have a pair too, and I'm following this with great interest. The friction mode isn't friction at all, in fact 'light indexing' is the best way to put it. No ratcheting to be found.

The one thing you can try, run the rear shifter for the front derailer, and the friction front for the rear. It works, it's just confusing.

metabike

They are Kenda Kwik Trax with reflective sidewalls.

Here's the manual, lower right corner of it spells out two options: full index & light index. Both sets I have are exactly the same so they are installed correctly.

I guess I will have to forge ahead blindly and open 'em up.

Exit.

Why don't you just find a suntour cassette and have proper indexed shifting?

Bianchigirll 

these are designed for freewheel. to do that he would need new wheels

metabike

Well, that wasn't so bad. For the edification of future generations, here's how to perform an indexectomy on Suntour Command shifters:

Remove lever.
Remove the small retaining clip holding the lever onto the body.
Pull the lever off the body (don't worry, there are no springs lurking in there waiting to launch across your workshop).
Once inside, look for the two tiny balls that run in the indents - remove the balls.
Fit the lever back on to the body.
Replace the small retaining clip.
(sound of angelic chorus singing alleluias) Friction shifting achieved!

fuzz2050

Are you kidding? I suffered through backwards shifting for 6 months, and this was all it took. Thank you good sir!

mcgreivey

I've happily used Command shifters backwards, as suggested above (7-speed shifter --> 3-speed triple front; ratchet shifter --> 8-speed rear--both Shimano). It works just fine. I'm not doing it at the moment, but I'll bookmark this for future reference.

eshew

Not regularly one to bring back old threads but THANK YOU metabike!

I've been trying to tune for almost 2 hours with no luck only to find out the cog spacing is slightly off from the original Suntour freewheel. Found this & a few minutes it's friction heaven. My goat and I thank you!

The Golden Boy 

From what I remembered about what I've read- (but not actually done)- is that you just flip the indexing ring upside down so that the balls don't slip into the detents. That way it still takes up the same amount of "up down" space, and doesn't lose the friction grip.

To reiterate- the 7 and F7 settings are "Indexing" and "Light Indexing." Hard, definitive click and a softer click- but indexing all the same. There isn't a "friction" or "ratcheting" setting on the rear shifter. The FRONT shifter has the Suntour circa 1985 Sprint micro-ratcheting. It's a much more fine ratcheting action than the old power shifters and barcons. Think if you have... say... 22 ratchet clicks running the shifter thru it's range- this has 35. I totally made the numbers up- but it's a much finer ratcheting. And only on the FRONT shifter.

Also, for you Krayzee Kommand Shifter Kidz... I have a set of the Command Shifters set up for Shimano 10 speed SIS-

https://www.bikeforums.net/19125554-post28.html

https://www.bikeforums.net/classic-v...e-rebuild.html

Kontact 

ENE WING SHIFTER | DIA-COMPE

The Golden Boy 

I've heard of those things coming for 3 years- have never seen them for sale anywhere.