Help with Rossin ID
03-29-20, 01:29 AM
#1
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Help with Rossin ID
I am breaking this down for paint, in preparation to sell it, as it has a horrible rattle can job, but cannot figure out what I have. No serial numbers of any kind. Portacena drop outs, braze on shifter lugs, but none for the front derailleur or the top tube cables, which are old school clamp on, recessed brake fittings. It was kitted with full panto Super Record, 1982 on the cranks, 83 on the rear derailleur. Clamp on Super Record fronts are not all that common, but it has one. I would expect a full set of braze ons in 1983, and a serial number of some sort. It has all the earmarks of a 1983 Super Record, but even as early as the 1980 catalogue, there should be top tube braze ons. I have sanded the paint up top, and no evidence that they have been removed.
any ideas?
any ideas?
03-29-20, 03:58 AM
#2
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I'd go with a Super Record model from the very early 80's as my guess. I'd also assume the frame was Columbus SL as well. I think the routing of the cables under the bottom bracket points to this and the use of a portacatena rear dropout would go along with the early '80's guess as they still found their way onto early '80's frames. I don't think the lack of cable guides on the top tube is a real problem identifying this frame. I know I have had Italian bikes, Daccordi and Bianchi, from the early 80's that don't have these top tube guides yet they have under BB cable routing and still use clamp-on front derailleur hangers.
As you know doubt know, removing top tube guides is pretty easy before a (rattle can) repaint but, I have found, where the guides are removed a small flat is left on the round top tube where the guides are located (not always the case). With no evidence of the presence of the top tube guides it would be my guess that your frame didn't have these guides originally.
You could always braze-on three cable guides - just a thought. They do pop-up occasionally on ebay.
I used to swap and change Campy SR/NR front derailleur clamps/no clamps when the need arose - just saying.
With a fresh paint job and the re-fitting of those fabulous Campy components, it will be a fantastic bike. Best wishes for the re-build if that's the direction you take?
As you know doubt know, removing top tube guides is pretty easy before a (rattle can) repaint but, I have found, where the guides are removed a small flat is left on the round top tube where the guides are located (not always the case). With no evidence of the presence of the top tube guides it would be my guess that your frame didn't have these guides originally.
You could always braze-on three cable guides - just a thought. They do pop-up occasionally on ebay.
I used to swap and change Campy SR/NR front derailleur clamps/no clamps when the need arose - just saying.
With a fresh paint job and the re-fitting of those fabulous Campy components, it will be a fantastic bike. Best wishes for the re-build if that's the direction you take?
Last edited by Gary Fountain; 03-29-20 at 04:48 AM.
03-29-20, 04:19 AM
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Who is going to paint it? Personally I think you should sell it as is and leave a blank slate for the next owner. What is it worth now? $250? $300? If you sink $400+ into a professional repaint can you realistically sell it for $700+?
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03-29-20, 08:01 AM
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Does it have the fork? If it doesn't, I can assure you that it won't get much. I just posted about a Rossin Record project (Raffaela Rossin), and in it's shape, original and Patina-ed, I paid $90ish for the frame with what I I am pretty positive is not an original fork.
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1987 Crest Cannondale, 1987 Basso Gap, 1992 Rossin Performance EL, 1990ish Van Tuyl, 1985 Trek 670, 1982 AD SLE, 2003 Pinarello Surprise, 1990ish MBK Atlantique, 1987 Peugeot Competition, 1987 Nishiki Tri-A, 1981 Faggin, 1996 Cannondale M500, 1984 Mercian, 1982 AD SuperLeicht, 1985 Massi (model unknown), 1988 Daccordi Griffe , 1989 Fauxsin MTB, 1981 Ciocc Mockba, 1992 Bianchi Giro, 1977 Colnago Super
03-29-20, 09:14 AM
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Does it have the fork? If it doesn't, I can assure you that it won't get much. I just posted about a Rossin Record project (Raffaela Rossin), and in it's shape, original and Patina-ed, I paid $90ish for the frame with what I I am pretty positive is not an original fork.
03-29-20, 09:21 AM
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My plan is a quality repaint, then sell it as a complete bike, unless someone throws a number at me first, which sticks.
03-29-20, 10:32 AM
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if I sell it all off right now, I can do way better than $250-$300. Super Record pedals, front and rear DR, headset, brakes with good hoods, bottom bracket and seat post. Record hubs laced to Nisi tubs, Rossin panto shifters, stem and a Super Record crank plus Turbo saddle. This alone tops $300 with no problem, and the frame isn’t even included!
My plan is a quality repaint, then sell it as a complete bike, unless someone throws a number at me first, which sticks.
My plan is a quality repaint, then sell it as a complete bike, unless someone throws a number at me first, which sticks.
Why not keep it? Beautiful steed!
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1987 Crest Cannondale, 1987 Basso Gap, 1992 Rossin Performance EL, 1990ish Van Tuyl, 1985 Trek 670, 1982 AD SLE, 2003 Pinarello Surprise, 1990ish MBK Atlantique, 1987 Peugeot Competition, 1987 Nishiki Tri-A, 1981 Faggin, 1996 Cannondale M500, 1984 Mercian, 1982 AD SuperLeicht, 1985 Massi (model unknown), 1988 Daccordi Griffe , 1989 Fauxsin MTB, 1981 Ciocc Mockba, 1992 Bianchi Giro, 1977 Colnago Super
1987 Crest Cannondale, 1987 Basso Gap, 1992 Rossin Performance EL, 1990ish Van Tuyl, 1985 Trek 670, 1982 AD SLE, 2003 Pinarello Surprise, 1990ish MBK Atlantique, 1987 Peugeot Competition, 1987 Nishiki Tri-A, 1981 Faggin, 1996 Cannondale M500, 1984 Mercian, 1982 AD SuperLeicht, 1985 Massi (model unknown), 1988 Daccordi Griffe , 1989 Fauxsin MTB, 1981 Ciocc Mockba, 1992 Bianchi Giro, 1977 Colnago Super
03-29-20, 10:38 AM
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if I sell it all off right now, I can do way better than $250-$300. Super Record pedals, front and rear DR, headset, brakes with good hoods, bottom bracket and seat post. Record hubs laced to Nisi tubs, Rossin panto shifters, stem and a Super Record crank plus Turbo saddle. This alone tops $300 with no problem, and the frame isn’t even included!
My plan is a quality repaint, then sell it as a complete bike, unless someone throws a number at me first, which sticks.
My plan is a quality repaint, then sell it as a complete bike, unless someone throws a number at me first, which sticks.
__________________
“One morning you wake up, the girl is gone, the bikes are gone, all that's left behind is a pair of old tires and a tube of tubular glue, all squeezed out"
Sugar "Kane" Kowalczyk
“One morning you wake up, the girl is gone, the bikes are gone, all that's left behind is a pair of old tires and a tube of tubular glue, all squeezed out"
Sugar "Kane" Kowalczyk
03-29-20, 11:34 AM
#9
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I own a 79 Record Professional, no top tube cable guides, same fork, same BB shell, same short point seat stay caps, different long point lugs, different rear brake bridge, different chain stay bridge, different braze on FD bracket, different chromed Campagnolo rear drop outs. I also have 1982 Telaio da Corsa Rossin Record same BB shell, same short point lugs, same chain stay bridge, different internal rear brake cable, different braze on FD bracket, different fork, different long point seat stay caps, different Columbus rear drop outs, different rear brake bridge.
The Record series of SL frames seem to be all over the map around this time, similar too many Italian manufactures, very difficult to find exact time frames as to when they were built, they built with what they could get a hold of and sell. The Super Record, Professional and Record all the same frames, the real differences were in the components bolted on. The companies production bikes at this time seemed to only provide needed income for their racing interests.
As a keeper paint it, painting and trying to sell is only going to be a loosing exercise, you are not going to get your time and money out of the bike. To many other more collectable Rossin's like the Ghibli and Prestige frames.
They do ride wonderfully, however, you don't seem to be too interested in their ride qualities currently.
The Record series of SL frames seem to be all over the map around this time, similar too many Italian manufactures, very difficult to find exact time frames as to when they were built, they built with what they could get a hold of and sell. The Super Record, Professional and Record all the same frames, the real differences were in the components bolted on. The companies production bikes at this time seemed to only provide needed income for their racing interests.
As a keeper paint it, painting and trying to sell is only going to be a loosing exercise, you are not going to get your time and money out of the bike. To many other more collectable Rossin's like the Ghibli and Prestige frames.
They do ride wonderfully, however, you don't seem to be too interested in their ride qualities currently.
Last edited by m_sasso; 03-29-20 at 12:13 PM.
03-29-20, 11:45 AM
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If you went through the trouble to keep everything original, paid for a quality paint job (I wouldn't powdercoat a restoration), you might be surprised that someone luckily wants one, or conversely, the market is soft and you aren't getting bites...
Why not keep it? Beautiful steed!
Why not keep it? Beautiful steed!
03-29-20, 11:53 AM
#11
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I own a 79 Record Professional, no top tube cable guides, same fork, same BB shell, same short point seat stay caps, different long point lugs, different rear brake bridge, different chain stay bridge, braze on FD bracket, different chromed Campagnolo rear drop outs. I also have 1982 Telaio da Corsa Rossin Record same BB shell, same short point lugs, same chain stay bridge, different internal rear brake cable, different braze on FD bracket, different fork, different long point seat stay caps, different Columbus rear drop outs, different rear brake bridge.
The record series of SL frames seem to be all over the place, very difficult to find exact time frames as to when they were built, Super Record, Professional and Record all the same frames, the real differences were in the components bolted on. The companies production bikes at this time seemed to only provide needed income for their racing interests.
As a keeper paint it, painting and for sale is only going to be a loosing proposition, you are not going to get your time and money out of the bike. To many other more collectable Rossin's like the Ghibli and Prestige frames.
They do ride wonderfully, however, you don't seem to be interested in their ride qualities currently.
The record series of SL frames seem to be all over the place, very difficult to find exact time frames as to when they were built, Super Record, Professional and Record all the same frames, the real differences were in the components bolted on. The companies production bikes at this time seemed to only provide needed income for their racing interests.
As a keeper paint it, painting and for sale is only going to be a loosing proposition, you are not going to get your time and money out of the bike. To many other more collectable Rossin's like the Ghibli and Prestige frames.
They do ride wonderfully, however, you don't seem to be interested in their ride qualities currently.
I am pretty experienced at buying and selling bikes, so I appreciate the information on this one, and am pretty confident about selling it and doing just fine!
03-29-20, 11:56 AM
#12
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too small for me and too new for my interest. I flip quite a few bikes to pay for my serious, vintage bike addiction, so I am aware of the issues with selling. I don’t need to sell it immediately, but this down time is a good time to peck away at it. I have 4 serious keepers I am working on as well, and selling bikes like this makes the hobby pay for itself.
03-29-20, 12:14 PM
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I'm currently in the process of restoring what I believe is an 83' or 84' model Rossin Record. Original paint and decals are still on my frame, but it looks just like yours except mine does have the top tube cable braze ons. Same super record 82 crank and 83 rear derailleur. I did notice a stamp of B 121 on the non-drive side dropout?
03-29-20, 12:17 PM
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I have been doing this quite a while, and so far am cash positive. Last week I sold a Dave Moulton, before that a Somec, before that a Falcon San Remo, before that a Gitane Super Corsa, before that a couple PX 10’s etc., all for a profit. This is how I pay for the bikes I keep. Buy at the right price, then sell at the right price. Not a big problem for me.
03-29-20, 12:32 PM
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I'm currently in the process of restoring what I believe is an 83' or 84' model Rossin Record. Original paint and decals are still on my frame, but it looks just like yours except mine does have the top tube cable braze ons. Same super record 82 crank and 83 rear derailleur. I did notice a stamp of B 121 on the non-drive side dropout?
maybe a funky custom build?
