indyfabz

if you ask my advise.

gregf83 

You'll notice in that video the rider was already lifting his rear wheel with rim brakes so discs wouldn't have helped. A better line and less speed through the previous turn on the other hand...

smarkinson

No brake in the world was going to stop him at that approach speed.

Wingsprint

I will not engage in a rim vs disc debate, but I will say this is an example of why road disc brakes may not be replace rim brakes for a very long time. At the extreme limits, the tire grip is the main factor in braking performance, more braking power in this situation would probably result in the tires losing traction thus negating the additional stopping ability of disc brakes.

Rowan

I do have to stop and consider whether the guys who had trouble getting around this corner, including the main guy and the other two who crashed and a few others, might have run out of brakes on the previous corners. The speed at which the guy who got injured went into the corner was insanely fast... much too fast for what he simply must have seen happening ahead of him.

coachboyd

I had said this on Facebook but will post it here too.

Disc brakes would not have helped him. If that car hadn't been there he would have ridden 8 miles into the woods and gotten eaten by a bear. He was that out of control.

bruce19

Question.....in races do they not have "corner workers" at those corners as in motorcycle races?

esskay1000

Oh lord, really? All of the other riders with rim brakes seemed to do fine on that turn. He was approaching a sharp turn doing 40+, he screwed up. Can disc brakes help PRO riders at the highest level - perhaps yes, especially in wet weather. Does the average Joe or weekend warrior road rider need disc brakes - hell no. Does even a CAT 3 racer need them - hell no.

indyfabz

The force is strong in this one.

elcruxio

I would imagine braking overall would be better and easier with discs thus making cornering safer overall. Pulling the brake lever more certainly doesn't make braking safer as you lose control the more you need finger strength to brake. On long descents this is actually an issue since even with very good Mini-Vees and cool stop pads (possibly the most powerful rim brake system available for a road bike or actually CX configuration so even a lot more powerful than a road bike systems ever could be) my hands get really tired on longer descents. I do not get this problem with my MTB however, even though braking is more frequent and aggressive and descents last longer.

That said, I don't know what happened to that dude before the accident. He was coming in way too fast and at the last moment it looked like his brakes grabbed big time so something must have gone wrong. Would discs have helped? Possibly, or not, it is impossible to say with this little info.

indyfabz

Like that poor fellow hiking in Yellowstone. I went to school with his ex.

It really could happen. Saw this fellow on a ride a few weeks ago:



"Cyclists! Nom Nom Nom"

RJM

Disc brakes aren't going to help someone who is out of control and taking extreme risks on a mountain descent to catch back up to the peloton. Sometimes you just over-cook it and misjudge. Notice he locked the front wheel up quite a ways from the turn and is beginning an endo...traction is the ultimate factor here.

Although, if disc brakes will provide an advantage in racing it is probably a mountain descent.

Marcus_Ti

Bri Smithy, Eurosport commentator and Gen Manager of MTN Qhubeka, has noted a couple times during Eneco Tour that the component sponsors are heavily leaning on the teams and the UCI to make discs the standard...in large part they fell just to sell more bikes/parts by making stuff that works "obsolete".

indyfabz

What about the other two guys who crashed, or did you not watch the entire clip?

Marcus_Ti

Disc brakes, like race radios, do not make up for the need for remedial bicycle handling school.

Seriously, all 3 of those crashers way overcooked that corner and were coming in way too hot before the turn even began. Were it not for the vehicles breaking their trajectory, they would have conducted an experiment in projectile motion off that mountain.

exime

They already are

roadwarrior

Disc brakes on road bikes makes blood shoot out of my eyes.

I have disc brakes on my cross bike because the rims get full of mud and the disc brakes help with control.

That's not an issue with my road bike.

Disc brakes do not overcome bad riding skills or mistakes on descents.

Argh.

merlinextraligh

Not in a road race.

merlinextraligh

This. He's using the maximum grip, the front tire had. You could put 15" cross drilled 6 piston Brembo's on and it would not change the fact any more brake is going to just skid the front wheel, or flip him. At the point that your rear wheel is off the ground, your problem is not lack of available braking power.

In addition to a bad line, and too much speed, he could have done a better job pushing his weight back, and braked a little faster. Still would have plowed the car though.

If you look at a couple of riders before him that overcooked the turn, they've got their weight much further back, to eliminate the nose wheely.

billyymc

I think it's awesome that they let guys who have clearly never ridden before enter this race. WTF was that guy thinking - there was no way he was ever going to make that turn.

There were a lot of ****ty lines through that corner even before the crash occurred.

The guy on the motorcycle shouldn't have blocked the inside lane.

What a cluster fk.

PepeM

Just perused the statistics. No one riding a bicycle with disc brakes has ever overcooked a corner and crashed.

merlinextraligh

Didn't watch the Tour of Utah, [damn DVR didn't record it] and don't know where in the stage this happened.

But the fact that he's amongst the Team cars means he's off the back. Presumably he's bombing it in an effort to get back on the main, or front group.

Making his way up through the team cars, he doesn't have the luxury of a clear road, and may not have access to the best line.

Obviously he was pushing it to hard, but given that he's a professional bike racer, I tend to think he got himself caught in a bad situation, as opposed to being completely unable to descend.

merlinextraligh

If you look at Brammeier's Palmare's, he obviously know how to ride a bike. He's been a pro for a long time, been on Pro tour teams, has track experience. Made his national team for Worlds, and has won the Irish National Road Race championship. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matt_Brammeier

Pretty certain he knows how to descend.

From the Youtube comments, and based upon the riders having trouble with the turn before him, it appears this turn comes up very quickly surprising the riders. (And realize the first time you see this turn is when you're racing through it.)

So Brammeier's pushing it too hard to catch back on, goes too wide on the previous turn, messing up his line for this turn, has to deal with team cars that are cutting off his options, and **** happens.

Obviously, he messed up, but I think there's a bit more to it, than just proclaiming him an idiot.

dnslater

Yes, my guess was that this corner was somewhat blind.

billyymc

Not that day.

There was no line that was going to take him through that turn at that speed.


In the video 7 riders went around the corner before he did, as well as a few cars. Seems like an experienced rider could have looked ahead in almost any situation and seen that happening.