12strings

Take as a given that I can get in 3 rides/week, here is what i generally try to do.
-Monday: 25 mile fast group ride with guys who are stronger than me who like to push the pace (I just take very short turns at the front).
-Weds. or Thurs.: 20-30 minute interval workout of 30-second sprints.
-Saturday: 10 mile/30 minute medium ride with a few bursts to get over rolling hills, but not really pushing myself too hard.
(off days: Core exercises in front of the TV).

For the two solo rides, what would be best way to maximize the fitness gains? Go all-out on both rides and recover off the bike? I feel like my Saturday ride is functioning sort of like a recovery ride, but don't know if I need one since I'm not riding that long or often. Something else I'm not thinking of to compliment the weekly group ride?

I know this sounds like hardly any riding to many of you, but it's gotten me pretty fast, at the same level as the riders who ride really big miles (frequent 50-100 mile rides), but don't do the interval work that I do.

THANKS!

Machka 

What is your goal?

10 Wheels

Get some good lights and ride more at night or early morning.

chinarider

Without knowing goals, it's hard to give specific advice. However, as you say, you aren't riding that much. I'd suggest extending the Saturday ride to around 30 miles at moderate effort. This will help with your general endurance.

12strings

Thanks for the replies.

1. My goal for now would be to increase speed and strength for the Monday night ride.

2. I have lights, but also need to sleep, so probably won't be adding many night rides.

Carbonfiberboy 

If you're looking to maybe do more with the time you have, there's always trying a training program. Buy the CTS book: The Time-Crunched Cyclist.

Machka 

Can you squeeze in any other exercise?

For example, one of the things I found that helped me a lot was climbing stairs. I work in an 11-story building and was (until recently) climbing 30-40 flights a day ... get up at morning coffee and go do a dozen or fifteen ... do another dozen or fifteen at afternoon coffee ... and then just getting up to my floor in the morning and after my lunch walk.

At first I felt like I was going to die just doing 5 flights. But by the time I was up to 40 flights, I could do them with barely any change to my breathing. And as I gradually increased the number of flights I was doing, I started to notice muscle development in my legs. I also started to notice that cycling up hills was easier.

So while I haven't been able to cycle as much as I would like, incorporating the stair climbing throughout my day has helped.



Also ... can you make Saturday's ride any longer?

And don't forget to include some upper body weights with those core exercises.

Jim from Boston

Doing more with less? (time-strapped cyclist)

Quote:

Originally Posted by 12strings

Take as a given that I can get in 3 rides/week, here is what i generally try to do.
-Monday: 25 mile fast group ride with guys who are stronger than me...
-Weds. or Thurs.: 20-30 minute interval workout of 30-second sprints.
-Saturday: 10 mile/30 minute medium ride with a few bursts to get over rollinghills, but not really pushing myself too hard.
(off days: Core exercises in front of the TV).

For the two solo rides, what would be best way to maximize the fitness gains?…

I know this sounds like hardly any riding to many of you, but it's gotten me pretty fast, at the same level as theriders who ride really big miles (frequent 50-100 mile rides), but don't do theinterval work that I do.

THANKS!

Quote:

Originally Posted by chinarider

… However, as you say, you aren't riding that much. I'd suggest extending the Saturday ride to around 30 miles at moderate effort. This will help with your general endurance.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 10 Wheels

Get some good lights and ride more at night or early morning.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Carbonfiberboy

If you're looking to maybe do more with the time you have, there's always trying a training program. Buy the CTS book: The Time-Crunched Cyclist.

Hi 12strings,

Perhaps you recall we have corresponded previously, since I once passed through Madison, IN on a cross-country bike ride, and you lived a while in Boston. I’m replying, not to give advice, but to present my “time-strapped” training program. According to “The Time-Crunched Cyclist,”

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChrisCarmichael

……For a training program to work on fewer than 8 hours a week, you pretty much have to focus entirely on intensity. Make no mistake: The workouts in this program are hard. Very hard. You will be performing some efforts just below your lactate threshold power output and some right at it, but many efforts will be much you the fitness to fully enjoy weekend rides, bike tours, and cycling camps.

However, there are limits to what you’regoing to be able to accomplish on
fewer than 8 hours of training per week. …

Placing your family and career ahead ofyour cycling goals is a wise choice
fo rpretty much anyone who has either a real career or a family, and pretty
much the only choice if you have both...If you’re willing to work hard with the limited time you have… then it’s time to get off your butt and retake your rightful place at the front of the pack.

A few weeks ago I posted to this thread on the Fifty-Plus Forum, “What is your training advice to improve aerobic fitness?.”

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim fromBoston

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim from Boston

...last year I developed for myself my" Time-restricted,Personally Ambitious, but Non-competitive Cyclist Training Routine.," as discussed on this Fifty-Plus thread, “Riding versus Training” (also with other good training tips).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim from Boston

About two weeks ago I described a new training routine for myself combining a well-established Ten Week Century Training Schedule of daily mileage goals with a personalized intensity scale based on ”Relative Perceived Exertion (RPE).” My basic premise was that I wanted to get significantly fit, within a busy work/family time-crunched life, but not suffer so much that I would abandon the program.

I do have the advantages of a very nice minimum 14 mile one way commute that iseasily extended; and a high end, very comfortable carbon fiber road bike that encourages riding…

I’m still riding it, and enjoying more thanever.

FYA, follow the links for further detail, including a description of RPE. FWIW, my resting heart rate is 48 bpm, sometimes lower.

Last year I posted to a General Cycling thread, “Cadence”:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim from Boston

I’m a 40+ year cyclist and I ride mainly for fitness. During nearly all of my 40 cycling years, my training has been by mileage. This year though, I decided to go for speed (intensity), and I use the semi-quantitative,standardized, but personally relavant system of (Borg’s) Relative PerceivedExertion (RPE), with my own particular adaptation…. I use cadence to chose gears to maintain my desired exertion.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim from Boston

The RPE scale ranges from 6 to 17, with descriptions of the intensity. Multiply the RPE by 10 is the approximate heart rate. Jim's scale is the equivalent on a 0 to 100 scale, easier to think about:

RPE = 6, resting... Jim's scale = 10 to 20

RPE = 7, very, very light... Jim's scale = 20 to 30

RPE = 9, very light... Jim's scale = 30 to 40

11, fairly light...50 (my usual happy-go-lucky pace without thinking about it)

13, somewhat hard...60 (I have to focus to maintain)

15, hard...70 (I start breathing hard at about 30 seconds)

17, very hard (lactate threshold; breakpoint between hard but steady
breathing and labored with gasping)...80 (my predicted max HR)

19, very, very hard...90 to 100.

My basic training is to ride at my RPE of 50% for six miles to warm up, then cruise at an RPE of 60%, and do intervals (on hills) at 70%. I try to change gears to maintain a cadence of about 85-90 rpm on flats and rolling hills, andabout 60 to 80 rpm on harder hills, to maintain my RPE. Shift up to higher gears as the cadence rises, and shift down as the RPE increases.

As a corollary,

Quote:

Originally Posted by Machka

Can you squeeze in any other exercise?...

12strings

Thanks for the replies, I actually do some upper body exercises along with core work, That's not really the issue. I can do those while watching 2 preschoolers in the house...I can't ride a bike for 3 hours on Saturday while watching 2 preschoolers.

Carbonfiberboy 

The Time-Crunched plan is for exactly what you are trying to do. So buy the frigging book. I have a whole shelf of cycling training books. The more you know, the more you can do. It's usually not an issue of training harder. It's an issue of training smarter.

Machka 

What about getting a trainer and doing commercial intervals while watching cartoons with the kids?

chaadster

"Get a power meter," is the surefire answer, and maximize what you're doing now. I'd even advocate for pulling one of those road rides indoor, on a stationary, so you can really stick your targets.

Use a program, yes, but without a power meter it is everything but gauranteed you're leaving results on the table.

Like you, I can do three workouts a week, and for those I do a fast, 30mi dirt road group ride, an hour long stationary workout, and a long, 50mi high pace road ride.

From October on, I trade a road ride for another 1hr stationary ride, and by late winter I cut that to 45mins but at higher intensity/power targets.

I also use a coach, which is very handy, and would recco one especially to anyone short on time, because analyzing ride data takes time.

12strings

Just an update for anyone interested. I had a good conversation with a friend of mine yesterday, who, while not a cyclist, is pretty knowledgeable about fitness in general, being runner, track coach, and cross-fit coach.

He really thinks that if I'm doing 3 rides/week, and want to see the best gains, There's no need to use one of them as recovery, especially if I am using off-days for core, upper-body, and range of motions work. Rather I should make each of them a hard work-out, either intervals, or hard hill-climbing. So I think I may try that for a few weeks and see if I notice anything substantial.

So this is my new rough weekly plan.
1. 25mi. Fast group ride (including flat pace-lines and about 3 miles of significant climbing).
2. 20-30 minutes of 30-second intervals, alternating high-cadence with high-torque (low-cadence).
3. EITHER: (a). Focus on Hill climbing for about 10 miles, or (b) more interval work, specifically out of the saddle.

I'm fortunate where I live I can ride from my house and within 10 minutes reach any of the following hills I choose:
-.6 mile 11%
-.3 mile 12.5%
- 3 mile 3%
- 4 mile 2%
- 2.5 mile 4%

If I actually stick to it for a few weeks, I'll try to come back and report.

12strings

Also,

-I have no plans to buy a power meter, too expensive.
-I have an indoor trainer that I often use for my interval workout, but it is loud as all-get-out, and so is relegated to the garage.
-I will look up the book...I may put it on my birthday wish-list (September)

chinarider

If you have the time, you could try adding some mileage to the mid week interval workout. For example, doing a 10-15 mile moderate intensity warm up, then the intervals followed by 5 miles easy as active cool down.

12strings

A little less than 2 weeks, but I've done almost 2 rotations of this general routine, and I can report that I am definitely stronger, and even lost a lb. or 2.

Old routine:
1. Fast 25 mile group ride with some moderate climbing.
2. 20 minute Hiit session on trainer.
3. 30 minute medium/easy ride.

For the last two weeks, I've basically replaced #3 with a 8 mile ride that includes a .6 mile 11.5% climb (ranges from 9% to 15%). That has definitely helped my Monday night climbs.

Also, on off days, I've started lunge-walking from my office to the restroom at work...I try to wait till I'm around a corner and no one is around to see me, cuz it looks ridiculous...by it really helps all the cycling muscles!

absoludicrous

I'm sort of in your boat, but I'm able to commute every day of the week and work in a longer ride on the weekends. My typical Monday–Friday averages about 60-70 mi and my weekend rides are 25-55 miles. Averaging around 110 miles/7hr per week.

I started cycling for the first time this spring, and had literally pathetic cardio and muscular endurance. It took me a good 1000 miles before I really felt like I had some lungs and legs. I'm now able to ride the big (50t) ring and I have been doing quite a bit of big-gear work on flats along with repeats—both in and out of the saddle—on short, punchy hills (talking 0.25mi @ 10%+ or 0.25-0.5mi @ 5%). Which I think has helped a lot. Definitely feel the burn on those. The west metro of the twin cities lacks any sustained climbs so this all I can do.

The other couple of things I do are work in 5-7 from-a-stop sprints on the smallest cog (12) and largest ring (50) on my commutes.

Also—I have been doing almost exclusive big gear riding the last two weeks and it's helped immensely. I don't own a PM so I can't tell cadence or power, but I try to push a bigger gear (50/15 or 50/17) slower while maintaining what I perceive to be a cadence at around 75-85 (traveling at 21-23 mph sustained, not bursts), and it's helped a lot. I "feel it" on every ride, where as before, I would tend to ride at a higher cadence, and I couldn't really feel my legs working.

I don't know how you ride, but I think the punchy hill work has developed the power, and the "hill" (I don't ride true hills) work, along with pushing a bigger gear has helped endurance.

The last thing I have to say is that if you can work in 2 long (50+ mile) ride once a month it's going to help. For me it's helped with pacing, and just getting used to spending 3+ hours in the saddle. I try to get in at least once long ride per month that involves 2,000'+ of climbing.

I would say continue to ride the hills and don't abandon the high-intensity work. You want to get that lactate-threshold to rise, that way you can sustain greater efforts, longer. Ride more.

(subscribed to this thread)

RiPHRaPH

Been there. I'd say to change your mindset in the pack. Why not you? After your wam up, on Mondays go full 100%, not holding anything back. If you get dropped then so be it. Playing it safe to get to the end hurts you. Being more aggressive in the peloton has many more beneficial things for you.
Sometimes where you are at turns or knowing where the route so well that you know when the natural slowing and stops are helps a lot.
Being out front during a turn or timing your turn at the front so you aren't pulling during a climb or spot where you can't peel off.
Get in there, get up front and hang. If you can't, keep coming back.