Why isn't the bike industry selling more lifestyle?
08-24-16, 06:55 AM
#126
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Metro Detroit/AA
Posts: 8,207
Bikes: 2016 Novara Mazama
Mentioned: 63 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3640 Post(s)
Liked 81 Times
in
51 Posts
). I don't find the 32mm (1-1/4") tires that came on them to be unsuitable for most needs, I run them on crappy dirt paths on a regular basis.
IMO, it was too bad that the general rejection of uncomfortable bike boom type bikes did not herald a return to promoting a return of the "English racer" AKA bikes with more comfortable handle bars and riding position that resembled the configuration of the Raleigh Sports but with derailleurs for those who wanted more gears, at a reasonable/competitive price. My 1984 Schwinn World Tourist ($15 at a garage sale) came close . Instead the industry has hyped suspension bikes and high priced lightweight stripped down down bikes without fenders.
08-24-16, 07:24 AM
#128
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: North Central Wisconsin
Posts: 4,624
Mentioned: 14 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2976 Post(s)
Liked 1,182 Times
in
771 Posts
I thought about getting a Subaru. First up I wanted a hatchback. They are practical for many lifestyles. Subaru commercials do a good job of showing people carrying all sorts of stuff. If this car can carry a snowboard, I am sure it'll work for my Ikea run!
The car industry has done an amazing job selling AWD as a nice to have in inclement weather. Subaru has also done a good job of selling safety as well. I also wanted "premium" features (bluetooth and navigation were hard to find in a compact hatchback at the time.) I didn't get a Subaru but it was a contender.
They sold a lifestyle applicable to a bunch of different buyers. Interestingly enough, Subaru decided to target lesbians, indirectly in the 90s. And it is a super popular for lesbians. They were ahead of the curve at specifically going ofter LGQBT community and it paid off.
The car industry has done an amazing job selling AWD as a nice to have in inclement weather. Subaru has also done a good job of selling safety as well. I also wanted "premium" features (bluetooth and navigation were hard to find in a compact hatchback at the time.) I didn't get a Subaru but it was a contender.
They sold a lifestyle applicable to a bunch of different buyers. Interestingly enough, Subaru decided to target lesbians, indirectly in the 90s. And it is a super popular for lesbians. They were ahead of the curve at specifically going ofter LGQBT community and it paid off.
08-24-16, 07:35 AM
#132
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: North Central Wisconsin
Posts: 4,624
Mentioned: 14 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2976 Post(s)
Liked 1,182 Times
in
771 Posts
Most people who want a bike go to their friendly Big Box store and pay at most $200 for the bike that they take home. I believe that only 10% of new bike sales are made by bike shops.
I suspect that most people will never pose questions to bike shop personnel since they are unlikely to ever set foot in a bike shop, especially not a boutique or tony "lifestyle" bike shop, and it is unlikely that they would ever hear, much less care about what such bike shop personnel might tell them they "need."
I suspect that most people will never pose questions to bike shop personnel since they are unlikely to ever set foot in a bike shop, especially not a boutique or tony "lifestyle" bike shop, and it is unlikely that they would ever hear, much less care about what such bike shop personnel might tell them they "need."
08-24-16, 07:37 AM
#133
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: North Central Wisconsin
Posts: 4,624
Mentioned: 14 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2976 Post(s)
Liked 1,182 Times
in
771 Posts
Apologies to all if someone beat me to this but I don't wanna read through a gazillion posts to say this...
INFRASTRUCTURE!!!! All the lifestyle BS in the world won't expand market share without the infrastructure to actually enjoy the lifestyle. Riding bicycles in too many parts of our beloved country is simply too damned unpleasant and dangerous for anyone to want to buy into a "lifestyle."
Unless or until we decide as a country to make room for bicycling, it will ALWAYS be a fringe activity. The ugly reality for too many consumers is that once the bicycle is purchased they realize how poorly our society values cyclists.
BUILD OUT THE INFRASTRUCTURE AND THEY WILL COME. No infrastructure, no "lifestyle" cycling. Make cycling in and around our cities safe and easy for women, children, elderly, and disabled and watch the market explode. Until then it will remain a marginalized activity practiced only by the most determined.
OP suggested an Electra/Chico's collaboration; where in the heck is this fantasy Chico wearing mom supposed to ride? The best, most bike friendly cities in our country are still light years away from providing the kind of cycling environment Chico Mom is gonna want to ride in. Let's assume we can get her past the perspiration and messy hair... she's gonna want to go someplace. She needs a way to navigate her trendy self to her favorite shopping haunts and our ridiculous to non-existent cycling infrastructure guarantees she takes the Range Rover and not the Electra. So the Electra will be gathering dust in the back corner of the garage and Chico Mom and every other person like her (male or female) will be reminded about how and why cycling is dangerous and impractical for their lifestyle.
I'm certain nothing meaningful around this issue will happen in my lifetime. We're simply too far away culturally. Other countries are already there, but they're too smart to buy into American "lifestyle" marketing.
-Kedosto
INFRASTRUCTURE!!!! All the lifestyle BS in the world won't expand market share without the infrastructure to actually enjoy the lifestyle. Riding bicycles in too many parts of our beloved country is simply too damned unpleasant and dangerous for anyone to want to buy into a "lifestyle."
Unless or until we decide as a country to make room for bicycling, it will ALWAYS be a fringe activity. The ugly reality for too many consumers is that once the bicycle is purchased they realize how poorly our society values cyclists.
BUILD OUT THE INFRASTRUCTURE AND THEY WILL COME. No infrastructure, no "lifestyle" cycling. Make cycling in and around our cities safe and easy for women, children, elderly, and disabled and watch the market explode. Until then it will remain a marginalized activity practiced only by the most determined.
OP suggested an Electra/Chico's collaboration; where in the heck is this fantasy Chico wearing mom supposed to ride? The best, most bike friendly cities in our country are still light years away from providing the kind of cycling environment Chico Mom is gonna want to ride in. Let's assume we can get her past the perspiration and messy hair... she's gonna want to go someplace. She needs a way to navigate her trendy self to her favorite shopping haunts and our ridiculous to non-existent cycling infrastructure guarantees she takes the Range Rover and not the Electra. So the Electra will be gathering dust in the back corner of the garage and Chico Mom and every other person like her (male or female) will be reminded about how and why cycling is dangerous and impractical for their lifestyle.
I'm certain nothing meaningful around this issue will happen in my lifetime. We're simply too far away culturally. Other countries are already there, but they're too smart to buy into American "lifestyle" marketing.
-Kedosto
08-24-16, 07:41 AM
#135
Senior Member
Very US-centric thread here. Plenty of 'lifestyle' options in places where bike commuting is a thing. Bike commuting is not a thing in the US (I know some of you commute. I do. We're a minority), so an effort to sell that type of bike is not made.
08-24-16, 07:57 AM
#136
Other Worldly Member
Join Date: May 2012
Location: The old Northwest Coast.
Posts: 1,540
Bikes: 1973 Motobecane Grand Jubilee, 1981 Centurion Super LeMans, 2010 Gary Fisher Wahoo, 2003 Colnago Dream Lux, 2014 Giant Defy 1, 2015 Framed Bikes Minnesota 3.0, several older family Treks
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 194 Post(s)
Liked 136 Times
in
53 Posts
There's probably a growth market for a bike so butt ugly cheap it'll never be stolen and yet can be ridden back from the grocery store with full plastic grocery bags (containing your favorite beverage) hanging from the bars. I think that guy who bolts a skateboard to a half a front bike is on the right track.
__________________
Make ******* Grate Cheese Again
Make ******* Grate Cheese Again
08-24-16, 08:22 AM
#137
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2014
Posts: 1,532
Bikes: Working on replacing my stolen Soma Buena Vista Mixte
Mentioned: 21 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 417 Post(s)
Liked 95 Times
in
44 Posts
I am not sure how my concerns about biking became a chance to claim I am saying everyone should spend a lot on a dynamo hub bike. It works for me, and I could for it in my budget.
If you are posting on this forum, you do not need to be sold a "bike lifestyle." You are already here.
I think there is a base level of practicality required for "selling" a bike friendly lifestyle to a more general audience that is not a current bike enthusiast, but there are plenty of bikes out there that could use this sort of story telling.
Does it hurt to try and get different people to seek out bikes?
Walmart is about to start building bikes in the US again. Walmart already uses a lot of storytelling in their marketing. Could they tell a story where average people use bikes in their day to day life?
How ever you got here today, you found a story that resonated with you and got you on a bike. Maybe other people need different types of stories to get here tomorrow and it doesn't hurt to try it out.
I suggested a couple of angles for your younger women, parents and middle aged women. I chose these because I know a bit more about these people. There are plenty of demos to choose from outside of the current realm of wanna be racers, middle aged men in Lycra, adventurers, mointain bikers and hipsters.
The hipster/fixie/single speed story created a new market, new brands and more sales. Who says some other ones after other audiences can't have the same impact.
If you are posting on this forum, you do not need to be sold a "bike lifestyle." You are already here.
I think there is a base level of practicality required for "selling" a bike friendly lifestyle to a more general audience that is not a current bike enthusiast, but there are plenty of bikes out there that could use this sort of story telling.
Does it hurt to try and get different people to seek out bikes?
Walmart is about to start building bikes in the US again. Walmart already uses a lot of storytelling in their marketing. Could they tell a story where average people use bikes in their day to day life?
How ever you got here today, you found a story that resonated with you and got you on a bike. Maybe other people need different types of stories to get here tomorrow and it doesn't hurt to try it out.
I suggested a couple of angles for your younger women, parents and middle aged women. I chose these because I know a bit more about these people. There are plenty of demos to choose from outside of the current realm of wanna be racers, middle aged men in Lycra, adventurers, mointain bikers and hipsters.
The hipster/fixie/single speed story created a new market, new brands and more sales. Who says some other ones after other audiences can't have the same impact.
08-24-16, 08:44 AM
#138
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 1,499
Bikes: '88 Bianchi, '94ish Trek
Mentioned: 43 Post(s)
Tagged: 2 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1085 Post(s)
Liked 128 Times
in
58 Posts
I think there is a base level of practicality required for "selling" a bike friendly lifestyle to a more general audience that is not a current bike enthusiast, but there are plenty of bikes out there that could use this sort of story telling.
Does it hurt to try and get different people to seek out bikes?
How ever you got here today, you found a story that resonated with you and got you on a bike. Maybe other people need different types of stories to get here tomorrow and it doesn't hurt to try it out.
__________________
"The mystery of life isn't a problem to solve, but a reality to experience."
"The mystery of life isn't a problem to solve, but a reality to experience."
08-24-16, 08:57 AM
#139
Senior Member
"Why isn’t the bike industry using this idea of aspirational marketing to find new customers?"
Walmart is a lot of things, but aspirational it ain't.
So are you asking why there isn't more marketing for the existing bike lifestyles? Because the existing bikes are marketed and that marketing targets the ways those bikes are used. The reason there isn't more of that is probably because the economics don't support it.
Or are you asking why an aspirational bike lifestyle isn't being marketed?
I didn't get on a bike because of a story. I got on a bike because my wife got a big Christmas bonus and thought it would be healthy for us to ride bikes together. She dreamed that up in her own head with zero marketing influence. I went along with it because hey, free bike.
08-24-16, 09:04 AM
#140
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 1,499
Bikes: '88 Bianchi, '94ish Trek
Mentioned: 43 Post(s)
Tagged: 2 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1085 Post(s)
Liked 128 Times
in
58 Posts
You summed up your OP with:
"Why isn’t the bike industry using this idea of aspirational marketing to find new customers?"
Walmart is a lot of things, but aspirational it ain't.
So are you asking why there isn't more marketing for the existing bike lifestyles? Because the existing bikes are marketed and that marketing targets the ways those bikes are used. The reason there isn't more of that is probably because the economics don't support it.
Or are you asking why an aspirational bike lifestyle isn't being marketed?
I didn't get on a bike because of a story. I got on a bike because my wife got a big Christmas bonus and thought it would be healthy for us to ride bikes together. She dreamed that up in her own head with zero marketing influence. I went along with it because hey, free bike.
"Why isn’t the bike industry using this idea of aspirational marketing to find new customers?"
Walmart is a lot of things, but aspirational it ain't.
So are you asking why there isn't more marketing for the existing bike lifestyles? Because the existing bikes are marketed and that marketing targets the ways those bikes are used. The reason there isn't more of that is probably because the economics don't support it.
Or are you asking why an aspirational bike lifestyle isn't being marketed?
I didn't get on a bike because of a story. I got on a bike because my wife got a big Christmas bonus and thought it would be healthy for us to ride bikes together. She dreamed that up in her own head with zero marketing influence. I went along with it because hey, free bike.
It is for some people.
And that is your story that resonated with you.
__________________
"The mystery of life isn't a problem to solve, but a reality to experience."
"The mystery of life isn't a problem to solve, but a reality to experience."
08-24-16, 09:06 AM
#141
Senior Member
As has been mentioned elsewhere, there really aren't a lot of "lifestyles" in the U.S. that include bicycles. Bicycles can either be accessories, mostly for young people, or toys for the wealthy. As was also mentioned, most cycling involves getting sweaty, which is considered a negative in most "lifestyle" lifestyles."
Commuting by bike for a lot of people in a lot of the U.S. involves a lot of work and some risk, and a lot of compromise (very very few places offer showers, lockers ... forget bike lockers. A lot of places view employees who bike to work as inconveniences, because they are always washing up in the men's room and worrying about safe places to lock their bikes and store their gear ... and on rainy days .... )
.
Commuting by bike for a lot of people in a lot of the U.S. involves a lot of work and some risk, and a lot of compromise (very very few places offer showers, lockers ... forget bike lockers. A lot of places view employees who bike to work as inconveniences, because they are always washing up in the men's room and worrying about safe places to lock their bikes and store their gear ... and on rainy days .... )
.
08-24-16, 09:11 AM
#142
Senior Member
08-24-16, 09:22 AM
#143
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 1,499
Bikes: '88 Bianchi, '94ish Trek
Mentioned: 43 Post(s)
Tagged: 2 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1085 Post(s)
Liked 128 Times
in
58 Posts
Story: I was referring to the the usage defined in 2a and b.
__________________
"The mystery of life isn't a problem to solve, but a reality to experience."
"The mystery of life isn't a problem to solve, but a reality to experience."
08-24-16, 09:30 AM
#144
Senior Member
Aspirational: Please see 3a and b. Everyone has to start somewhere.
Story: I was referring to the the usage defined in 2a and b.
And no, you said:
"How ever you got here today, you found a story that resonated with you and got you on a bike."
The story I recounted didn't get me on a bike. It is the story of me getting on a bike. You were speaking about marketing stories, and seemed to assume that people only get on bikes due to resonating with some story that was told to them as part of that marketing.
08-24-16, 09:32 AM
#145
Senior Member
08-24-16, 09:35 AM
#146
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 1,499
Bikes: '88 Bianchi, '94ish Trek
Mentioned: 43 Post(s)
Tagged: 2 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1085 Post(s)
Liked 128 Times
in
58 Posts
(FYI, the "story" I defined for you was to correct your own use of the word in Post 142.)
__________________
"The mystery of life isn't a problem to solve, but a reality to experience."
"The mystery of life isn't a problem to solve, but a reality to experience."
Last edited by Jadesfire; 08-24-16 at 09:50 AM. Reason: A little clarification for the obtuse.
08-24-16, 09:43 AM
#147
Banned
Advertising for Cars does the Lifestyle thing. adds $500 to cost of car + its a tax deduction for the car Companies.
08-24-16, 09:46 AM
#148
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 15,491
Bikes: 2015 Workswell 066, 2017 Workswell 093, 2014 Dawes Sheila, 1983 Cannondale 500, 1984 Raleigh Olympian, 2007 Cannondale Rize 4, 2017 Fuji Sportif 1 LE
Mentioned: 144 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7652 Post(s)
Liked 3,478 Times
in
1,836 Posts
Memebag, they (marketing people) simply don't get that some people have independent ideas ... to them, ideas are commercials we make for ourselves, i guess (keep in mind Jade4078 was a person who couldn't figure out that you could carry things in your hatchback car until a commercial told her.)
Being refered to in marketers' terms, having your life defined in marketers' terms, can seem insulting (I feel a little soiled) but it is just their language. We have to translate to our own language instead of taking offense or debating.
To me, my life is too short, slips by too easily, has had a ton of pain and pleasure and some moments I will never forget---some wish I wish I could, some I hope I never do. To Jade408, it isn't my precious, unique, fleeting life, the sum of all I am ... it is my "story." I just have to translate instead of getting offended ....
But seriously Jade, there is no way you keep any credibility if tyou cal Wal-Mart an "aspiriational" store. I don't care if the third or fifth definition in the seventh online dictionary you checked can be squeezed and twisted to fit ... in marketing terms "Aspirational" means an item which is slightly beyond one's current lifetyle/income/"story" which one hopes to work for /save for/borrow for .... like a Porsche for a guy driving his kids around in a mini-van. We all know that, so calling Wal-Mart an "aspirational" store is twisting words and blowing your credibility to win a debate on the Internet. Honor is worth more than and cheap internet debate win or loss.
Anyway ... lots of different ideas and opinions in this thread ... and not a Lot of acrimony. Good thread so far. And good ideas, some of them .... get to work and make stuff happen, Jade408.
Anyway ....
08-24-16, 09:49 AM
#149
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 7,384
Mentioned: 49 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 800 Post(s)
Liked 218 Times
in
171 Posts
08-24-16, 09:57 AM
#150
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Groningen
Posts: 1,308
Bikes: Gazelle rod brakes, Batavus compact, Peugeot hybrid
Mentioned: 85 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5998 Post(s)
Liked 956 Times
in
730 Posts
I like innovation and I like companies who make stuff we didn't know we wanted until it was there. But in case of the bike, there's not that much room for improvement and manufacturers tend to follow the demand rather than create it. Because people who have a bike as part of their lifestyle tend to know what they want.
I believe it's not about the marketing but about the manufactering. Americans do commute or want to, so there must be a market for a bike that's particularly well suited for that. But if weight saving is the main selling point, the main point to distinct it from others, it's not helping commuting. You can't help a commuter with road racer's logic.