Paramount RD Cable Housing Guide - What is Material?
10-10-19, 08:32 AM
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Paramount RD Cable Housing Guide - What is Material?
I'm in a bind. I broke half of the RD cable guide on my bike. I've welding capability and materials but can't figure out what material Schwinn (Reynolds?) used for this braze on (RD cable guide).
It's not steel and doesn't appear to be aluminum.
The frame is on the laser welding mount now.
Any insight?
It's not steel and doesn't appear to be aluminum.
The frame is on the laser welding mount now.
Any insight?
10-10-19, 08:59 AM
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10-10-19, 09:05 AM
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Best I can figure is it's manganese/molybdenum steel alloy. Trying to be sure as using the wrong welding rod leads to a number of other problems.
10-10-19, 09:27 AM
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Well we know the frame is Reynolds 531, right? I would THINK they might use the same material to avoid brazing/welding problems. But that's just a guess. Nervex built the lugs, but I'm not sure if they supplied the braze-on bits.
10-10-19, 09:39 AM
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Its brazed on mild steel.
Dont try to weld it, it will only make it worse.
Option 1 to just go ride: Cable clamp onto frame.
Option 2 to fix pretty well: Cut half a circle, and weld internally with mini-mig (aka "zap") and then carefully clean inside and specifically fit the cable housing.
Option 3 restoration: Carefully remove existing stop. Braze on new one from Nova Cycles (or similar). Rechrome frame.
------------------------------------------------
If it was me, I would machine on a lathe a cable stop replica of stainless steel, polish it, and then cut in half.
Then I would carefully "zap" mini-mig weld (hidden internally) to the existing cable stop ABOVE the brazed chrome stay. (this will prevent the existing braze from overheating)
There may be internal burrs (from the tack welds) by doing this, but they will be hidden by design. The intent is to be as non-intrusive as possible, to avoid any heat messing up the original braze or chrome.
Then, the cable housing could be sanded externally as appropriate to fit by the "burrs", and all repairs would be hidden. The color difference between polished stainless repair and 40 year old will be negligible.
------------------------------------
I just came up with another idea: The cable stop doesnt really need to be "split", so you could weld the same polished stainless repair circle along the top, externally. (this should be done with 0.024 stainless wire).
By doing this, you will avoid internal burrs, and can sand and polish the repair on the top.
Dont try to weld it, it will only make it worse.
Option 1 to just go ride: Cable clamp onto frame.
Option 2 to fix pretty well: Cut half a circle, and weld internally with mini-mig (aka "zap") and then carefully clean inside and specifically fit the cable housing.
Option 3 restoration: Carefully remove existing stop. Braze on new one from Nova Cycles (or similar). Rechrome frame.
------------------------------------------------
If it was me, I would machine on a lathe a cable stop replica of stainless steel, polish it, and then cut in half.
Then I would carefully "zap" mini-mig weld (hidden internally) to the existing cable stop ABOVE the brazed chrome stay. (this will prevent the existing braze from overheating)
There may be internal burrs (from the tack welds) by doing this, but they will be hidden by design. The intent is to be as non-intrusive as possible, to avoid any heat messing up the original braze or chrome.
Then, the cable housing could be sanded externally as appropriate to fit by the "burrs", and all repairs would be hidden. The color difference between polished stainless repair and 40 year old will be negligible.
------------------------------------
I just came up with another idea: The cable stop doesnt really need to be "split", so you could weld the same polished stainless repair circle along the top, externally. (this should be done with 0.024 stainless wire).
By doing this, you will avoid internal burrs, and can sand and polish the repair on the top.
Last edited by Reynolds 531; 10-10-19 at 09:51 AM.
10-10-19, 11:31 AM
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I would use a bolt on stop right in front of the broken one, should be able to get it close and hide the broken one first.
If that doesn't work for you, then I would VERY CAREFULLY remove the broken one with a Dremel or the like, then just the bolt on.
OR you could JB weld a ferule to whats left and backstop it with a stainless "zip tie".
If that doesn't work for you, then I would VERY CAREFULLY remove the broken one with a Dremel or the like, then just the bolt on.
OR you could JB weld a ferule to whats left and backstop it with a stainless "zip tie".
10-10-19, 11:36 AM
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There's nothing wrong with a clamp-on cable guide, as @Reynolds 531 suggests. That's what I'd do if it were my bike.
10-10-19, 11:36 AM
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Its brazed on mild steel.
Dont try to weld it, it will only make it worse.
Option 1 to just go ride: Cable clamp onto frame.
Option 2 to fix pretty well: Cut half a circle, and weld internally with mini-mig (aka "zap") and then carefully clean inside and specifically fit the cable housing.
Option 3 restoration: Carefully remove existing stop. Braze on new one from Nova Cycles (or similar). Rechrome frame.
------------------------------------------------
If it was me, I would machine on a lathe a cable stop replica of stainless steel, polish it, and then cut in half.
Then I would carefully "zap" mini-mig weld (hidden internally) to the existing cable stop ABOVE the brazed chrome stay. (this will prevent the existing braze from overheating)
There may be internal burrs (from the tack welds) by doing this, but they will be hidden by design. The intent is to be as non-intrusive as possible, to avoid any heat messing up the original braze or chrome.
Then, the cable housing could be sanded externally as appropriate to fit by the "burrs", and all repairs would be hidden. The color difference between polished stainless repair and 40 year old will be negligible.
------------------------------------
I just came up with another idea: The cable stop doesnt really need to be "split", so you could weld the same polished stainless repair circle along the top, externally. (this should be done with 0.024 stainless wire).
By doing this, you will avoid internal burrs, and can sand and polish the repair on the top.
Dont try to weld it, it will only make it worse.
Option 1 to just go ride: Cable clamp onto frame.
Option 2 to fix pretty well: Cut half a circle, and weld internally with mini-mig (aka "zap") and then carefully clean inside and specifically fit the cable housing.
Option 3 restoration: Carefully remove existing stop. Braze on new one from Nova Cycles (or similar). Rechrome frame.
------------------------------------------------
If it was me, I would machine on a lathe a cable stop replica of stainless steel, polish it, and then cut in half.
Then I would carefully "zap" mini-mig weld (hidden internally) to the existing cable stop ABOVE the brazed chrome stay. (this will prevent the existing braze from overheating)
There may be internal burrs (from the tack welds) by doing this, but they will be hidden by design. The intent is to be as non-intrusive as possible, to avoid any heat messing up the original braze or chrome.
Then, the cable housing could be sanded externally as appropriate to fit by the "burrs", and all repairs would be hidden. The color difference between polished stainless repair and 40 year old will be negligible.
------------------------------------
I just came up with another idea: The cable stop doesnt really need to be "split", so you could weld the same polished stainless repair circle along the top, externally. (this should be done with 0.024 stainless wire).
By doing this, you will avoid internal burrs, and can sand and polish the repair on the top.
10-12-19, 11:16 AM
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10-12-19, 11:23 AM
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You can't weld or braze onto chrome. It will only make a mess.
Either remove the chrome, which is not an easy job, or just use a clamp on.
Either remove the chrome, which is not an easy job, or just use a clamp on.
10-12-19, 11:24 AM
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Found a few Campy versions. $35 for three. Not cheap but I'll try to sell the other two. Thanks for the idea
10-12-19, 11:41 AM
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Its brazed on mild steel.
Dont try to weld it, it will only make it worse.
Option 1 to just go ride: Cable clamp onto frame.
Option 2 to fix pretty well: Cut half a circle, and weld internally with mini-mig (aka "zap") and then carefully clean inside and specifically fit the cable housing.
Option 3 restoration: Carefully remove existing stop. Braze on new one from Nova Cycles (or similar). Rechrome frame.
------------------------------------------------
If it was me, I would machine on a lathe a cable stop replica of stainless steel, polish it, and then cut in half.
Then I would carefully "zap" mini-mig weld (hidden internally) to the existing cable stop ABOVE the brazed chrome stay. (this will prevent the existing braze from overheating)
There may be internal burrs (from the tack welds) by doing this, but they will be hidden by design. The intent is to be as non-intrusive as possible, to avoid any heat messing up the original braze or chrome.
Then, the cable housing could be sanded externally as appropriate to fit by the "burrs", and all repairs would be hidden. The color difference between polished stainless repair and 40 year old will be negligible.
------------------------------------
I just came up with another idea: The cable stop doesnt really need to be "split", so you could weld the same polished stainless repair circle along the top, externally. (this should be done with 0.024 stainless wire).
By doing this, you will avoid internal burrs, and can sand and polish the repair on the top.
Dont try to weld it, it will only make it worse.
Option 1 to just go ride: Cable clamp onto frame.
Option 2 to fix pretty well: Cut half a circle, and weld internally with mini-mig (aka "zap") and then carefully clean inside and specifically fit the cable housing.
Option 3 restoration: Carefully remove existing stop. Braze on new one from Nova Cycles (or similar). Rechrome frame.
------------------------------------------------
If it was me, I would machine on a lathe a cable stop replica of stainless steel, polish it, and then cut in half.
Then I would carefully "zap" mini-mig weld (hidden internally) to the existing cable stop ABOVE the brazed chrome stay. (this will prevent the existing braze from overheating)
There may be internal burrs (from the tack welds) by doing this, but they will be hidden by design. The intent is to be as non-intrusive as possible, to avoid any heat messing up the original braze or chrome.
Then, the cable housing could be sanded externally as appropriate to fit by the "burrs", and all repairs would be hidden. The color difference between polished stainless repair and 40 year old will be negligible.
------------------------------------
I just came up with another idea: The cable stop doesnt really need to be "split", so you could weld the same polished stainless repair circle along the top, externally. (this should be done with 0.024 stainless wire).
By doing this, you will avoid internal burrs, and can sand and polish the repair on the top.
-------- Original message --------From: Richard Schwinn gmail richard.waterfordbikes@gmail.comDate: 10/10/19 1:02 PM (GMT-05:00)To: Andy Newlands andy@strawberrybicycle.com,messina57@comcast.netSubject: Re: 531 Braze-Ons - What Material Are TheyHi Mark and Andy,
Split cable stops were produced by Schwinn. They would have been machined at the factory by the millions. Made with a mild steel they on all derailleur bikes for all the reasons we love them today. Up to the mid-70's Schwinn used the Campy cable guide clamps unless requested otherwise, after which they became standard.
Thanks,
Richard
On 10/10/2019 11:05 AM, Andy Newlands wrote: Hi Mark,Thanks for your email. All the braze-on’s I have are mild steel or stainless steel. Can’t say for Paramounts but Richard may be able to enlighten.Best regards,Andy On Oct 10, 2019, at 8:16 AM, mark m <wordpress@www.reynoldstechnology.biz> wrote: From: mark m < messina57@comcast.net>
Subject: 531 Braze-Ons - What Material Are They
Message Body:
Hi,
I broke my RD cable housing braze-on on my 1975 Schwinn Paramount. frame is Reynolds 531. Do you know what the brazed on RD cable guide on the chain stay is made of?
Thanks
Mark
--
This e-mail was sent from a contact form on Reynolds Technology ( https://www.reynoldstechnology.biz)
Andy Newlandsowner/framebuilderandy@strawberrybicycle.comTerra Nova Cycles LLC1535 SW 17th. Ave, Portland, OR 97201 503-224-1215www.strawberrybicycle.comwww.torchandfile.com
[/QUOTE]
10-12-19, 11:43 AM
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^^^^
That said, I've just purchased a set of three of the Campy guides/ clamps Richard mentioned. Won't look as clean but I can live with it and it's period correct.
That said, I've just purchased a set of three of the Campy guides/ clamps Richard mentioned. Won't look as clean but I can live with it and it's period correct.
10-12-19, 11:46 AM
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$8.25 shipped
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Shimano-Bic...ss!93722!US!-1
If you prefer Italian.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/CAMPAGNOLO-...IAAOSwPEhcc1jw
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Shimano-Bic...ss!93722!US!-1
If you prefer Italian.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/CAMPAGNOLO-...IAAOSwPEhcc1jw
