1967 Raleigh Grand Prix Spoke Protector
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1967 Raleigh Grand Prix Spoke Protector
Does anyone know which spoke protector size a vintage 1967 Raleigh Grand Prix would take?
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Probably the size for a 36 spoke wheel but you should count to verify.
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This bike wil have a freewheel mounted cog set. So a freewheel specific protector is where you start. Next up is the hubshell's seat shoulder for the freewheel and it's dimensional relationship to the spoke flange. Back then this dimension was less then current. So the protectors had little "dish" to their mounting hole WRT the disk portion. A sheet metal core with a plastic outer portion was common as was an entirely all sheet metal type. The current molded plastic versions with a thick hole portion can cause rub on the back side of the freewheel, especially if the freewheel is an older one as they usually had the freewheel body and large cog flush WRT each other.
But this assumes a OEM type wheel (and freewheel). If the wheel and/or the freewheel are more current then the time proven method of fit and see applies.
If you're talking about the outer portion's diameter then about 6" was common. The protector only needs to be slightly larger then the large cog is. Andy
But this assumes a OEM type wheel (and freewheel). If the wheel and/or the freewheel are more current then the time proven method of fit and see applies.
If you're talking about the outer portion's diameter then about 6" was common. The protector only needs to be slightly larger then the large cog is. Andy
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This bike wil have a freewheel mounted cog set. So a freewheel specific protector is where you start. Next up is the hubshell's seat shoulder for the freewheel and it's dimensional relationship to the spoke flange. Back then this dimension was less then current. So the protectors had little "dish" to their mounting hole WRT the disk portion. A sheet metal core with a plastic outer portion was common as was an entirely all sheet metal type. The current molded plastic versions with a thick hole portion can cause rub on the back side of the freewheel, especially if the freewheel is an older one as they usually had the freewheel body and large cog flush WRT each other.
But this assumes a OEM type wheel (and freewheel). If the wheel and/or the freewheel are more current then the time proven method of fit and see applies.
If you're talking about the outer portion's diameter then about 6" was common. The protector only needs to be slightly larger then the large cog is. Andy
But this assumes a OEM type wheel (and freewheel). If the wheel and/or the freewheel are more current then the time proven method of fit and see applies.
If you're talking about the outer portion's diameter then about 6" was common. The protector only needs to be slightly larger then the large cog is. Andy
I wasn't at 10 post before but I just got there so I couldn't post pictures before but here are some pictures of the bike. The top picture is without the spoke protector and the bottom one is with it. I don't really have that many pictures with it because I took it into a bike store to have the tires replaced and they told me that the spoke protector was damaging the spokes and they just removed it without even asking my permission first
Last edited by Simplex05; 06-27-20 at 06:21 PM.
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I'm sorry I don't know what the sizes are named. As above, the freewheel will have to be removed to replace the protector so the bike will have to go back to the shop. They can get one for you if you really want it. Most people remove them. When the plastic ones get old they crack and can get tangled in the spokes, a hazard. That's probably why the shop removed it. Again, the thing is unnecessary so most folks wouldn't spend any more time worrying about it. Nice looking Raleigh, BTW!
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I'm sorry I don't know what the sizes are named. As above, the freewheel will have to be removed to replace the protector so the bike will have to go back to the shop. They can get one for you if you really want it. Most people remove them. When the plastic ones get old they crack and can get tangled in the spokes, a hazard. That's probably why the shop removed it. Again, the thing is unnecessary so most folks wouldn't spend any more time worrying about it. Nice looking Raleigh, BTW!
And thanks so much yeah the body of the raleigh still mint even the paint is still mint some of the stickers need to be replaced.
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If the goal is a show grade result then you'll want the OEM guard, good luck on that one. If you want a period correct one then you already have that. The first photo shows the metal core of the OEM guard w/out the plastic outer portion. This is a mod that i did a few times back in the early 1970s BTW. it suggests that the shop might known more then you give them credit for.
The modded guard covers the needed aspects, the spoke ends, from chain damage. I would be interested in what spoke damage is from the guard. Bent spokes are a result of impacts ot stuff getting caught up in the moving wheel. It's these stresses that also generally cause the rim to become untrue. Not the spokes getting a bend that does this. If the spokes were allowed to loosen that they could become bent more easily, again generally as a result of an incident. But low tension spokes won't support a rim and thus will allow a untrue rim more readily too.
Don't be surprised if the shop won't relace new spokes with that old rim. Their reputation and your acceptance and the long term reliability is dependent on the rim's condition with no spoke tension obscuring the rim's natural condition. Replacing the spokes will mean the wheel isn't original any longer anyway. Before I would suggest a new rim and spokes (which a shop should be willing to do) I strongly suggest opening up the hub and assessing the axle, cones and races conditions. Andy
The modded guard covers the needed aspects, the spoke ends, from chain damage. I would be interested in what spoke damage is from the guard. Bent spokes are a result of impacts ot stuff getting caught up in the moving wheel. It's these stresses that also generally cause the rim to become untrue. Not the spokes getting a bend that does this. If the spokes were allowed to loosen that they could become bent more easily, again generally as a result of an incident. But low tension spokes won't support a rim and thus will allow a untrue rim more readily too.
Don't be surprised if the shop won't relace new spokes with that old rim. Their reputation and your acceptance and the long term reliability is dependent on the rim's condition with no spoke tension obscuring the rim's natural condition. Replacing the spokes will mean the wheel isn't original any longer anyway. Before I would suggest a new rim and spokes (which a shop should be willing to do) I strongly suggest opening up the hub and assessing the axle, cones and races conditions. Andy
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If the goal is a show grade result then you'll want the OEM guard, good luck on that one. If you want a period correct one then you already have that. The first photo shows the metal core of the OEM guard w/out the plastic outer portion. This is a mod that i did a few times back in the early 1970s BTW. it suggests that the shop might known more then you give them credit for.
The modded guard covers the needed aspects, the spoke ends, from chain damage. I would be interested in what spoke damage is from the guard. Bent spokes are a result of impacts ot stuff getting caught up in the moving wheel. It's these stresses that also generally cause the rim to become untrue. Not the spokes getting a bend that does this. If the spokes were allowed to loosen that they could become bent more easily, again generally as a result of an incident. But low tension spokes won't support a rim and thus will allow a untrue rim more readily too.
Don't be surprised if the shop won't relace new spokes with that old rim. Their reputation and your acceptance and the long term reliability is dependent on the rim's condition with no spoke tension obscuring the rim's natural condition. Replacing the spokes will mean the wheel isn't original any longer anyway. Before I would suggest a new rim and spokes (which a shop should be willing to do) I strongly suggest opening up the hub and assessing the axle, cones and races conditions. Andy
The modded guard covers the needed aspects, the spoke ends, from chain damage. I would be interested in what spoke damage is from the guard. Bent spokes are a result of impacts ot stuff getting caught up in the moving wheel. It's these stresses that also generally cause the rim to become untrue. Not the spokes getting a bend that does this. If the spokes were allowed to loosen that they could become bent more easily, again generally as a result of an incident. But low tension spokes won't support a rim and thus will allow a untrue rim more readily too.
Don't be surprised if the shop won't relace new spokes with that old rim. Their reputation and your acceptance and the long term reliability is dependent on the rim's condition with no spoke tension obscuring the rim's natural condition. Replacing the spokes will mean the wheel isn't original any longer anyway. Before I would suggest a new rim and spokes (which a shop should be willing to do) I strongly suggest opening up the hub and assessing the axle, cones and races conditions. Andy
I don't really think it would be possible to find a original spoke protector unless you were lucky in like a metal scrap yard. I think if I could buy a new one it would be best as it wouldn't be dried out
Would something like this work?
https://www.amazon.ca/Baosity-Protec...32463037&psc=1
Last edited by Simplex05; 06-27-20 at 09:40 PM.
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Some have said that these disks serve no purpose. I'd suggest that with a Simplex derailleur that's that old, they DO serve a purpose in keeping a bent or broken RD from putting the chain in between the freewheel and spokes.
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So your unable to get a new protector? What do you mean they aren't interchangeable? I know that you have to take off the free wheel
Thanks for your help
Thanks for your help
Last edited by Simplex05; 06-28-20 at 10:00 AM.
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Interesting I believe the one in the first picture was the one that came on the bike. There are old pictures from like 1970s with the bike in it being plastic, The bike has been in our family since new
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The spoke protectors I am familiar with will work regardless of spoke count.
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Where are you located? If there is a co-op near you they might have one. I have several but believe all mine be plastic. Metal ones aren't rare, though some have value. I think Randy Jawa offered to give away a Sekine one. Those are nice as they have "Sekine" stamped into them.
Perhaps you could seek one on the trade thread in the C & V forum.
Perhaps you could seek one on the trade thread in the C & V forum.
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What cities are you near??
For example Hamilton, Ontario has New Hope and most other major Canadian cities have one, some require memberships and other allow anyone in on a pay as you go basis. If you can email them a photo of the one you are seeking they might have one.
For example Hamilton, Ontario has New Hope and most other major Canadian cities have one, some require memberships and other allow anyone in on a pay as you go basis. If you can email them a photo of the one you are seeking they might have one.
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I'm in Toronto