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Perplexed by a small thing

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Perplexed by a small thing

Old 12-04-20, 09:10 PM
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USAZorro
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Perplexed by a small thing

As I'm working (a slight overstatement) on a number of slow-moving projects, I'm at a point where I would like to rebuild a set of wheels for an old Hawthorn Cruiser that was acquired on the cheap for a good friend of my wife. The hubs are fine, but the rims are likely beyond salvaging. So... I turn to the only set of 559 rims (matching the original size) I have in stock - which happen to be laced to their own hubs, but not attached to a bicycle.

I've removed my share of freewheels and cassettes before disassembling wheels before, but the arrangement on the rear wheel has me stumped.



I have a Park FR1 tool which fits the splines perfectly. However, there's a lockring with 8 notches on the outside, which I think needs to be removed before I can remove the freewheel.

I have spent a couple hours online trying to figure out what tool I need to get it off. It has a 47mm outside diameter. The freewheel is a Shimano DX, and I've searched Park's tool listings and also searched for Shimano lockring removers and can't find squat.

If anyone happens to know for certain whether I actually do need to remove this first, that would be helpful. If someone happens to know how to get this off, that would be double helpful.

Thanks,

Z
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Old 12-04-20, 09:18 PM
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Sorry, but what could it hurt to just try removing the freewheel via the splines first? If it doesn't budge, then move on to the lock ring.

If it's actually a freewheel and not a cassette, I don't personally understand how anything on the outside of the body could affect its removal from the threading on the hub. That lock ring is clearly not threaded onto the hub itself.

-Gregory
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Old 12-04-20, 09:18 PM
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That looks exactly like the lock ring on Sunrace freewheels. Never had to remove one to remove the freewheel.
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Old 12-04-20, 09:36 PM
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Yes. It's a freewheel, otherwise my FR1 wouldn't fit. I did attempt to remove using my 10" crescent wrench, and it wouldn't budge - hence the question.

Thanks for the confirmation. I will resort to penetrant and additional force without fear of ruining something.
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Old 12-04-20, 10:06 PM
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Some freewhels are so tight that a 10" wrench isn't enough. Please excuse me if you knew that already.
That Megarange sprocket+small front ring+steep uphill+heavy rider can put a LOT of torque on the freewheel.
I'd try holding the tool in a vise and using the wheel as a lever.
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Old 12-04-20, 10:21 PM
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I've got an old Park HCW5 bottom bracket lock ring tool that looks like it spans 46+ mm and looks like it might work. Do you suppose that's what's intended for the job?
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Old 12-04-20, 10:51 PM
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Originally Posted by USAZorro View Post
I did attempt to remove using my 10" crescent wrench, and it wouldn't budge.
Use a bench vise or hit the end of the wrench with a sledgehammer a few times. Lock the removal tool with the skewer.

I will resort to penetrant and additional force without fear of ruining something.
If you want to reuse the freewheel, and don't plan on overhauling it, don't spray anything in it.
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Old 12-05-20, 03:08 AM
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I always use an 18" adjustable wrench for freewheels, but if they still don't budge then I put the tool in the vise instead of giving myself a hernia.

Those things can be really tight, but I've never used penetrant. There is no access point to the threads except by going in along the axle opening, the axle bearings are likely going to get contaminated with the liquid unless applied sparingly with the wheel nearly vertical.

Don't mess with taking off that lockring unless you're wanting to modify the gearing (I did this to change a 28t cog to a 30t cog), I had to file two deep flats into the hard steel lockring to get it off using the vise. It was a lot of work.

Speaking of a lot of work, this evening I built another Shimano Ultra-6 freewheel using a Dura-Ace 7s freewheel with the small cog removed. I was able to thin down a 6s 600 freewheel dust shield to fit the opening left by removing the externally-threaded smallest cog from the Dura-Ace freewheel. It's actually about a half-millimeter wider than a Suntour Ultra-6 freewheel, but shifts much better.
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Old 12-05-20, 04:46 AM
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That's definitely a freewheel. You don't have to remove the notched ring and remiving it wont' make it any easier to remove the freewheel body. As noted by Reynolds, put the freewheel tool in a vise, put the wheel on the tool and turn the wheel. It provides A LOT more leverage.
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Old 12-05-20, 05:21 AM
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Excuse my ignorance but how would that biggest gear even be useable?

Wouldn't the derailleur have to be so far off the cassete in the mid-range that youd have barely any teeth covered by the chain? But more importantly wouldn't the size of the gear change make coming out of that gear difficult?
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Old 12-05-20, 06:12 AM
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^^^^^^ that configuration, often termed "mega range", was created for mountain bikes with long cage RDs, mostly for BSOs for entry level riders who needed a bail out gear due to inexperience and the shear mass of the bikes. I don't think they were intended for road bikes, let along classic road bikes. During operation of BSOs, crisp, quiet, efficient shifting was not noticed nor expected. If you could bang it into gear and keep going, s'good enough. Suitable for purpose.
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Old 12-05-20, 07:15 AM
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As noted above, the lockring only holds the sprockets to the freewheel body, which as is with all freewheel bodies, threads to the hub.

A number of years ago there was a fellow from Great Britain who made a tool which fits this lockring (but not the Sunrace lockring) but I can't find it listed at the moment.
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Old 12-05-20, 07:25 AM
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USAZorro has been removing free wheels for at least 20 years, so he knows how.
He s being cautious as he’s not seen this lock ring before.
Now that he knows removing it is not required,I’m sure he’ll have no issues.
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Old 12-05-20, 07:35 AM
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I almost always use a bench mount vise. There is something about having the wheel in both hands versus a long handled wrench in one hand. Even the dreaded two prong SunTour or Regina works reliably , provided someone before you hasn’t munched it up.
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Old 12-05-20, 08:34 AM
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Old 12-05-20, 09:22 AM
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Originally Posted by Reynolds View Post
Some freewhels are so tight that a 10" wrench isn't enough. Please excuse me if you knew that already.
That Megarange sprocket+small front ring+steep uphill+heavy rider can put a LOT of torque on the freewheel.
I'd try holding the tool in a vise and using the wheel as a lever.
Yesh. I've had to put the wrench attached to the wheel in a Workmate and brace against that and spin the wheel with all my might.
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Old 12-05-20, 01:21 PM
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Originally Posted by JackR View Post
How would that biggest gear even be useable?
That's a built-in dork disc. Not quite as ugly. Or is it?

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Old 12-05-20, 02:07 PM
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Here's your built-in Dork Disc. 8 speeds in a ~124 spacing.

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