Seattle Forrest

Who's going to give you a bike for your liver?

Still have their number...?

roadwarrior

That must be why the on line guys are cheaper. They can't tell who the idiots are...unlike at the store. That's pretty easy to do...

Stucky

AHhh! Thank you. That's what I like to hear. (Not that you crashed, but that you had the integrity to resist the lawyer and do the right thing!)

Gotta love the modern legal-system's logic- "Sue the parking lot owner because he had the nerve to not have rabid gorillas to prevent people from riding a bike in their lot; and for having the NERVE to allow some grains of sand to accumulate! They should have known that someone would ride a bike there, and crash!". And "Sue the shop, because they didn't have a dwarf running a few feet in front of you to clear the way" (And if they did have such a dwarf, then the lawyer could have sued them for exploitation!).

oldbobcat

The shop is not necessarily liable, but they are covered. Most business liability policies have medical payments coverage for anybody except employees injured on business premises or using business related equipment (like test riding a bike). Liability for an injury would be treated on a case-by-case basis. Circumstances and statutory rules for liability would be considered.

Generally, insurance for customer-damaged merchandise is not used. It would be expensive, it would require deductibles and depreciation, and the business would have to allow the insurer the right to recover the loss from the customer that caused it. Filing a claim for a $2000 bicycle that probably cost the retailer $1300 would be a waste of time, money, and good will. Damage to merchandise, like theft of merchandise, is "shrinkage."

kbarch

Sounds like an experienced business owner talking there....
Perhaps it would make a difference if the salesperson offered the test ride and told the customer where to take it, or the customer asked for it and took it wherever he wanted?

oldbobcat

Nah, several years in the insurance claims business.

The only business theft claims I handled were for embezzlement and business property, like tools, motor vehicles, and equipment. Insurance, especially in business, is for low-frequency big losses--fire, storm damage, damage from equipment failure, lawsuits, etc. For instance, a bursting water pipe caused damage to a warehouse full of electrical components. The components were covered, the cause of the damage, the pipe, was not. If the loss is high-frequency, coverage is too expensive. If the loss is small, coverage is still expensive relative to the cost of the loss. On an incidence basis, shrinkage is a high-frequency low-cost loss.

Regarding liability for a test ride crash, most shops do everything it takes to keep from getting sued by the customer, which includes quietly absorbing the damage to the bike. On the other side, if the customer is only mildly injured, they seem to be mostly embarrassed and hopeful the shop will not try to collect for damage to the merchandise. Still if the injury requires hospitalization and lost wages, or some degree of shop negligence played a part (like the bike not tuned properly or sending an inexperienced rider down Dead Man's Curve), you can bet the threat of a claim rises.

grwoolf

Took a road bike for a test ride about 8 years ago. I brought my MTB shoes and they slapped on some pedals and off I went. I got to a place where I had to stop and I could not clip out. I fell over into the grass/weeds. I'm laying there and I am still struggling to get unclipped and finally get out. Slight mark on one of the shifters was the only damage.

I get back to the shop and get one foot out before stopping but the other shoe was stuck on the pedal and I had to take the shoe off and the guy eventually got it off the bike. I don't know what was going on with those pedals, but I didn't feel too bad laying their bike down.

Here's the worst part - I ended up with serious poison ivy from falling into the "weeds". It sucked so bad...

2TriMaster2

Rented a bike once in Tuscon. Probably went all of about half-mile and slid out on some loose gravel. (Seems to be a lot of that in AZ). Anyway - I was pretty upset about it and was ready to pay up to fix the scraped up brake levers but the guy at the store just said 'Hey man, it's a rental. No worries.' Pretty cool.

TimothyH

Wait a minute.... You are going to waste the shop's time, test ride a bike you can't afford and have no intention of buying?

That's extremely unethical.

StanSeven

Most shops like for people to come and browse. If they aren't busy, I see lots of instances where they suggest customers try bikes out. I would be upfront and tell them you don't intend to buy tight now.

BillyD

Oh puleeze!

Trsnrtr

I bought a Serotta Colorado years ago that had been involved in a car/bike crash during a test ride. As far as I know, the shop didn't charge the owner to have it fixed (TT dent) by Serotta.

Bruces

A few years ago Arctic Cat brought two tractor trailers worth of snowmobiles to the field beside my house for a test ride day .All the manufacturers have done this each winter for many years .Anyways ,they take people out in a group of about 10 riders on a trail ride for 30 minutes .A friend of mine ,was in the rear of a group ,when some ass clown nailed the throttle ,cruised by the entire group at over 100 mph,then ran it into a telephone pole .The clown not only got taken away in an ambulance ,he bought himself a busted up $12000.00 sled that day ,and the police charged him with dangerous driving .They did have to sign their lives away before they got on the sleds .

TimothyH

In my industry we call that a fishing expedition. People invite us in, ask all kinds of questions about technology, how this and that works, how much does this cost, can you do a demo, can we get a 30/60/90 day eval unit, can you extend the eval unit until next march, can we get a proof of concept, etc., with absolutely no intention of buying anything, with no intention to spend even a dime. We have families to feed. It's a complete waste of our time.

If the OP intends on buying something, a lower model bike maybe or even a nice handlebar, then yeah, go for it. They Ford dealership let me drive a Focus ST when I bought my Focus SE. If the OP has no intention of buying anything then it isn't right. He's wasting the shop owner's time. It isn't an amusement park.

StanSeven

Yeah but a test ride of a bike doesn't involve substantial investment of time and money by the LBS. The bike is just sitting there. The only thing wrong is spending a lot of time with a sales person at a busy time where it detracts from other customers. Probably during a slow time, the LBS welcomes any interest by anyone.

FLvector

Note that topslop1 stated, "Mostly I'm personally interested in trying DI2 just as a knowledge point." Although the bike he was "thinking" about test riding might have been above his price point, he wanted to try out DI2 to experience what it's like. If during this test ride he thinks DI2 is something he must have on his next bike which might be purchased from the same shop, then it was certainly worth his time and the shops time. Certainly not unethical.

Wheever

Before I bought my Domane 4.5 disc, the bike shop dude made me try a Di2-equipped Domane, and offered me a good price. I wasn't impressed. even though it was heavily discounted, I really just found nothing compelling about it. (I really enjoy mechanical shifting. Part of the whole experience for me.)

vfrjo

A few years ago, lbs had a Felt demo day. Not sure which frame it was, but a fellow on a test ride hit a pot hole hard enough to endo flip. Taco'd the front wheel, and broke the nds chainstay, along with a few more dents and scuffs. Rep was only concerned with if he was okay, need med attention etc... I think he was fine, save for a few scrapes and bruises, busted helmet.

topslop1

If someone test drives a Porsche when they're 22, be it owned by a friend or a dealership, then shows up 20 years later to purchase one; unethical that they test drove one when younger knowing that they could not afford it at the moment?

topslop1

Who's going to give you a bike for your liver. Lol, they probably could find a healthier and or less used one that's for sure.

StanSeven

As far as bicycle damage, what's the worse that can happen in the practical sense - damaged bars, damaged frame, bent wheel, etc? So the shop builds up another bike with the good parts and just writes off the damage at dealer cost. Sure they could file with their insurance company but as mentioned, the money they get out isn't that much.

I usually go to two LBS and both specialize mostly in high end bikes. Customers often take bikes out for long test rides including several hours. I asked one about customer damage from test rides. My is response was one time a customer damaged a tubular tire. His complaint was having to get a vehicle to pick up the customer and bring him and the bike back.

So it doesn't seem like a big deal at all.

canklecat

Ditto, at a Harley shop in Grand Prairie back in the 1980s. I showed up on a Honda Ascot VT500. Just looking around on a lark and a tricked out Sportster caught my eye. Not something I'd have bought, but the shop owner had tricked it out himself for drag racing at a nearby strip. "Take the keys," he said, "see what you think." Just like that.

I never rode a motorcycle so carefully in my life.

It was sweet. Definitely not your average Skirtster. I didn't really open it up, but it rolled on with serious authoritah.

Looigi

No. Insurance would cost more than the loss, which is how insurance companies make money. They do have liability insurance because a single event could put them out of the business, even though the likelihood of a business ending event is very small, which is what the insurance companies know and use to calculate the premiums.

Andy Somnifac 

I've laid down a demo mountain bike while riding, but I think that was to be expected. I took more bumps than the bike did.

topslop1

Test rode an Yamaha FZ1 (150hp) when I was used to riding my Gs500 (45hp) at the time. I cracked the throttle when I shifted into second gear (at 70mph with another few thousand rpm to go to redline mind you) and the bike wheelied on me. I almost **** my pants. I have no interest in owning a 1000cc sport bike, ever.