curbowman

Hi there! I'm repairing a 1979 japanese Jupiter King bike, and would like to know if I should replace the brake calipers.

They are Dia-Compe Cherry center pull brakes, and after a thorough cleaning and lubing, they are smooth as silk. One cool discovery I made is that this bike has a "quick release" lever on each brake. That feature should make wheel removal as easy as with any modern side pull caliper, so my main concern is about the power.

I've read that modern dual-pivot brakes have more stopping power. But I have also read that center pull brakes have better modulation and that they can be very powerful as well. What are your experiences about this topic? Thanks.

lostarchitect 

For that bike, I would not spend the money on new brakes. Centerpulls if set up well can provide very good braking. I would definitely replace the pads. Kool Stop Continental pads are great and will work with those calipers, but they're a little pricey.

Lazyass

Try these brake pads, they're real grabby. Looks like yours are old, anyway.

https://www.modernbike.com/product-2...u5DxoCJV3w_wcB

SJX426 

I have excellent memory but very short! There was a recent thread discussing brakes in general, or not. there was a discussion on this topic. Center pulls are dual pivot brakes. What may have changed over time is the mechanical leverage at the brake lever. Hopefully someone will chime in with better memory than mine and give you a more definitive answer.


The only reason to "upgrade" would be if you can't stop effectively, but then it would be the pads and not the brake calipers.

Andy_K 

I think it's mostly a matter of what you want from your brakes. Those will stop you as well as dual pivot calipers, you just need to squeeze the levers harder. IMO the modulation is a matter of practice. Dual pivots require a lighter touch, but the flip side of that is that they start slowing you down with just a little lever pressure. New Kool Stop salmon pads will make the brakes you have a bit better. To get the full benefit from dual pivots calipers you'd want different levers than I suspect are on that bike and you can lose the vintage look very quickly.

rhm

I agree, changing the calipers would be a considerable hassle and expense, with a marginal improvement. Changing the brake pads would be easy and might help a lot.

What rims are on the bike? If it has steel rims, then upgrading to aluminum would greatly improve the braking, as well as making the bike lighter and more fun to ride.

noglider 

I have experience with those brakes. They are horrible. Replacing them will almost surely be an improvement.

bulldog1935

not tough to find a used set of Weinmann 610s on ebay for $15.

curbowman

Thank you all, I'll be changing the pads since they are the originals and are hard as a rock. The good old sandpaper trick just reveals more dried-up rubber!

While I'd like to keep it looking vintage, the original brake levers are a mess; so I bought new ones. I wanted to install integrated brake/shifter levers but decided to stay way from that, at least for now. The priority is to put the bicycle on the road ASAP. Improvements will have to wait.

And yes, I bought aluminum wheels and hubs. Great improvement!

AlexCyclistRoch

One thing you DO need to do is this: cut the brake cable to length, ferchissakes!!! Also, put a ferrule on the end (or else tin the ends). All that excess cable looks awful!

lostarchitect 

Putting brifters is a can of worms you probably don't want to open on this low end bike. You'd need the brifters, new cables, new front and rear derailleurs, new rear hub (or whole new wheel), a new cassette, and new cables. Then the new hub / wheel probably won't fit in the frame, so you will need to cold set it. This involves slightly bending the frame so it accepts the hub width, and then you need to realign the dropouts. This is a big job for a very basic bike like this. My suggestion is if you want to go that route, do it on a much nicer bike.

Grand Bois

End cap? It has ferrules.

repechage

These brakes are not my favorites but with extra effort can be tolerable.
The trick is to have them smooth functioning with no play in the pivots.
Not easy.
Yes, new brake blocks which now equates to new pads and holders.
Address the cable runs, there should be a smooth and fair cable run, in one image the rear brake adjuster/ quick release is presenting a kink to the cable run, rotate it to have a straight run to the caliper cable yoke.
Small incremental things will all make improvements to performance.
New Tekro dual pivots would function so much better but, not a sound investment on this bike.

tarwheel 

I put some old Suntour Superbe single pivot brakes on my 1983 Specialized Sequoia, which what originally was spec'd with the bike, and they stop great. I also put Kool Stop salmon pads on the calipers, and that helps. You can find old Suntour brakes on eBay pretty easily but make sure you get the correct reach.

curbowman

I'd like to make clear that the outdoor pictures of the bike were taken the day I got the bike. There are lots of things made wrong in there, but as I said, I'm innocent!!!

tricky 

I like @bulldog1935's suggestion, but putting new pads on the existing brakes first will get your bike on the road faster. New pads can create a dramatic improvement. If you still feel that the brakes are lacking after you ride it for a while (or just want to indulge some upgraditis), buy the cheap Weinmanns since they are better quality than what you have and super cheap. You can even transfer the new pads over to the Weinmanns.

Also! Post a full driveside pic of the bike! I haven't heard of this brand before. Pinarellos and Colnagos are obvious rehab candidates and pop up plenty often around here, but I love to see people showing these love. I think you can have just as much fun with something like this. Plus, I like the colors!

arex

+1.

T-Mar

New brakes will provide better modulation. However, you can make a dramatic improvement in the modulation of the old brakes by installing new cables with Teflon lined housings. As suggested by others, new brakes will make a drastic improvement in stopping power. The Jupiter King is not a bicycle that I would sink a lot of money into. It's probably closer to 1970 than 1979.

Hudson308 

I suspect you'll be happy with the brakes you have, once you install new Kool Stop pads and Teflon-lined cable housings as suggested. And yes, please post more pics! Looks like an interesting bike.

crank_addict

Use what brakes you have but absolutely trash those pad inserts. Kool Stop salmon inserts will suffice. A 4 dot pad is good.

Next, it appears one brake is aluminum and the other steel. The steel arms will flex more than the aluminum type. Majority of the stopping power is done at the front so install the more rigid / hence powerful aluminum up front. While at it, properly mount them with attention to the center bolt not to have sloppy movement under braking. Should have radius washer / spacers etc..

During the usual and proper setup, pay attention in keeping the arm bushings to a very close tolerance, but not binding tight. Obviously and also set a proper toe-in direction for the pads. With the wheels trued, set the pads close as possible. If you wank a rim out while riding, then flip the release lever just slightly to allow enough clearance.

Lastly, evaluate your cables and setup. Significantly can affect brake operation and power.

curbowman

[it appears one brake is aluminum and the other steel.[/QUOTE]

They are both steel. But one is shown as it was when I got the bike and the other is already cleaned up. Kind of a "before/after" picture to show how dirty they were.

I couldn't get Teflon lined cables, but I already bought new brake & shifter cables with their housings. I also bought new brake levers.

I'm pretty sure the bicycle is from 1978 because both the brake levers say "01-78" and in the handlebar it reads "E-78", so that shuld mean January and May 1978 respectively.

The shifters and derailers are Suntour. Funny how the front derailer says Suntour SPIRT instead of SPIRIT. I thought about installing STI brifters, but then I realized the entire group might cost more than the bike itself, so I'll ride her a while before doing that big investment.

And yes, the color scheme is stunning. It doesn't shine, though, but I haven't cleaned it either. The good part is that after dismantling it I found no corrosion at all!

John E

There is no magic in a bicycle braking system. The variables are caliper leverage, handle leverage, pad-to-rim coefficient of friction, mechanical losses such as cable-to-housing friction or pivot drag, pad toe-in, cable housing compression, slop in the caliper pivots, and flex in the caliper arms. The others have already provided excellent advice on brake pads and cable housing, as well as stepping up to a higher-quality caliper (Weinmann Vainqueur 999 in either 610 or 750 length, or the DiaCompe equivalent). If you want to boost your braking force by another 10 to 15 percent and can accommodate the 10 to 15 percent longer lever travel that comes with the territory (No Free Lunch), switch to aero brake handles. My Bianchi has the often-excoriated early-generation Campag. sidepulls, which provided unsafely lousy braking when equipped with non-aero levers and Shimano pads. Changing to Shimano aero levers (sorry, Italian purists, but they fit my hands) and KoolStop salmon pads made a huge difference in safety.

uncle uncle

Hey Lazy... do you have experience with these brake shoes? I'm always looking for cheap good bike replacement parts. I'm not really sold on the local bike shops cheap brake shoes; they're okay, and seem to be an improvement over 20+ year old dried out ones, but not significantly.

Lazyass

I have them on one of my bikes.

ramzilla

In the days of my youth, when I was shopping for my first real road bike I settled on a nice brand new 1972 Peugeot PX-10. It came equipped with center pull brakes. Back then, center pull brakes were considered superior to side pull brakes. At some point along the line by around 1979 or 80 center pull brakes disappeared completely. I always wondered what was up with that.