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Old 06-20-18, 02:36 PM
  #1  
tonyfourdogs
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Brifter compatibility

Hi folks

So I just bought a set of Shimano st2300 levers for my mtb drop bar conversion experiment.

I wanted to ask you if the levers will work with my 90s era exage derailleurs or if I'll need to replace those too? From the reading I've done my canti brakes should be compatible though?

Thanks
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Old 06-20-18, 02:55 PM
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Read back archives yet?, numerous compatibility threads have come and gone before.


Road brifter and road front derailleur from the same era are a safe bet..

MTB RD until the post 9 speed schism, worked on many a touring bike..
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Old 06-20-18, 05:17 PM
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A couple of possible issues- Ft Exage ders weren't the best WRT cage shaping and such. Their tiny lever lengths make for less then ideal trimming sensitivity. And they were never intended to have a specific cable pull ratio. The rear der is not likely future compatible by Shimano's reference. Besides it's being designed to only shift across 7 cogs and not the wider 9 of today's low end the pulleys/cage width is pretty big for the skinnier 9 speed chain. Andy
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Old 06-21-18, 01:36 AM
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Thanks for your replies guys. I did read up on compatibility but the information was contradictory much of the time which is why I posted.

And because my FD is a bottom pull, I wondered if it might behave a bit more like a road derailleur.

So even though my rear mech is a 7 speed and the shifter is 8 speed, I may have fine tuning problems? I'm using modern 8 speed trigger levers at the moment with no issues at all. I was hoping the same would be true of the brifters... Ah well.
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Old 06-21-18, 09:04 AM
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Generically, as the mech changes a cable pull distance into a lateral motion via a parallelogram,
the lengths of those parts pivot to pivot, and actuating arm to pivot

have an effect on the pull ratio, distance moved relative to the cable pull input , per index click..

with friction shifting the input pull distance can be adjusted with every lever motion
Indexing thats fixed, so there is when the mis matches creates issues.
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Old 06-21-18, 09:15 AM
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I run 8 speed trigger shifter on my mountain bike with a 7 speed cassette. Some people just ignore the slight shifting differences, but I sand down the plastic spacers to match the 8 speed cassette.

As for the front, you probably could try a road triple. My wife's road bike is running a Tiagra 4503 or 4603 that works with her 46-39-30 triple. She was using ST2300 but is now using Claris shifters. I'm not sure how it will work with a 24t granny, but was happy that it shifts to th 46t without any issues. Some road front derailleurs are not happy with a smaller large chainring. I have tried an older 7703 and it doesn't work as well.

John
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Old 06-23-18, 04:32 PM
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I’d guess it will work on the back. I’ve used 8 sp brifters with a 7 sp freewheel and it works fine. Just center things on the middle cog and Shimano’s floating pulley will accommodate the minor differences at the top and bottom of the cluster. Just choose which end you want the empty click from the brifters.

As for the triple in front, no experience, but if you need a new f der they’re cheap
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Old 06-24-18, 08:52 AM
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Originally Posted by tonyfourdogs
Thanks for your replies guys. I did read up on compatibility but the information was contradictory much of the time which is why I posted.

And because my FD is a bottom pull, I wondered if it might behave a bit more like a road derailleur.

So even though my rear mech is a 7 speed and the shifter is 8 speed, I may have fine tuning problems? I'm using modern 8 speed trigger levers at the moment with no issues at all. I was hoping the same would be true of the brifters... Ah well.
Complete compatibility and cable pull list with explanations, by equipment type. Done it by myself, (mostly) for myself (in the first place)

Compatibility Archives - Bike Gremlin

Last edited by Bike Gremlin; 08-24-20 at 04:18 AM.
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Old 06-25-18, 03:05 AM
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Originally Posted by Slaninar
Complete compatibility and cable pull list with explanations, by equipment type. Done it by myself, (mostly) for myself (in the first place)

Compatibility Archives - Bike Gremlin
This looks very useful - thanks
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Old 06-25-18, 08:06 AM
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Originally Posted by tonyfourdogs
This looks very useful - thanks
Just be careful about any suggestion that a mountain bike front derailleur is compatible with road brifters. Do your reasesrch.

​​​​​​​John
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Old 06-25-18, 10:53 AM
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Originally Posted by 70sSanO


Just be careful about any suggestion that a mountain bike front derailleur is compatible with road brifters. Do your reasesrch.

​​​​​​​John
And I'll quote:

Shimano road and MTB FDs have different cable pull ratio – that is the amount of FD movement for each mm of cable movement. This means that MTB FDs might not work well with indexed road shifters and vice versa.

With double chainrings, this issue can be fixed with adjusting limit screws and it could be made to work. With triple chainrings, it is harder to get it to work properly. However, FD cage is a lot wider than the chain and triple FDs have just 3 positions, so depending on particular shifter – FD combination, even that can sometimes be made to work OK.

Having said all this and in spite of officially different cable pull, all the FDs almost always work OK with all the shifters, regardless whether it is road, or MTB. One exception are the Shimano 11 speed road FDs – they have a (vastly) different cable pull (and cable anchor arm), so they are not compatible.
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Old 07-08-18, 11:11 AM
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So I finally got around to installing the drops & brifters after a massive faff with the stem (which was resolved by using the existing mtb stem in the end, *sigh*)

I couldn't believe how easy it was. I connected the cables and with a small amount of adjustment, it works, front and back. Works really nicely too. The brakes on the other hand were a massive pita to get right, but that was down to the calipers as opposed to the levers.

If anyone's thinking of trying this, it's a lot of fun. The bike is a really good fun ride now. Thanks again to everyone who replied.

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Old 07-08-18, 06:37 PM
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Picture?

Any chance you could post a picture of the cable path at the front derailleur? I’m trying to do something similar to you. I’ve got a Shimano tourney fd-ty510 front derailleur that I’m hoping to be able to use their st-a073 brifters with.
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Old 07-09-18, 03:14 AM
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Originally Posted by chris3928
Any chance you could post a picture of the cable path at the front derailleur? I’m trying to do something similar to you. I’ve got a Shimano tourney fd-ty510 front derailleur that I’m hoping to be able to use their st-a073 brifters with.
Hey Chris

I can sort some pictures out when I've got myself sorted out computer-wise (I'm using an old spare cos my laptop broke and I haven't got software to resize the pic for upload here)

Basically, the cable comes out of the brifter, through housing to the braze on cable stops at the downtube. Then the cable runs down into the guide under the bottom bracket, and up behind the seattube to the derailleur straight into the clamp. My only issue with this setup is I have no fine tuning, so I'm going to get an inline cable adjuster and install that at some point. I hope you can visualise that ok?
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Old 07-09-18, 01:23 PM
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Originally Posted by tonyfourdogs
Hey Chris

I can sort some pictures out when I've got myself sorted out computer-wise (I'm using an old spare cos my laptop broke and I haven't got software to resize the pic for upload here)

Basically, the cable comes out of the brifter, through housing to the braze on cable stops at the downtube. Then the cable runs down into the guide under the bottom bracket, and up behind the seattube to the derailleur straight into the clamp. My only issue with this setup is I have no fine tuning, so I'm going to get an inline cable adjuster and install that at some point. I hope you can visualise that ok?
Thanks for the description! Sounds similar to my setup. Only difference is that my cable comes up from the bottom bracket, over a pulley/curved guide and then into the clamp.

Also occurred to me that I would need some kind of adjustment ability - where would an in-line adjuster go? Just ahead of the cable stop on the down tube?
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Old 07-09-18, 02:10 PM
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Originally Posted by chris3928
Thanks for the description! Sounds similar to my setup. Only difference is that my cable comes up from the bottom bracket, over a pulley/curved guide and then into the clamp.

Also occurred to me that I would need some kind of adjustment ability - where would an in-line adjuster go? Just ahead of the cable stop on the down tube?
That's a good place for the inline adjuster - although I've seen a couple of folks on youtube put them after the first inch or so of cable coming out of the brifter for easier access. I haven't decided where mine will go yet.

I'll be interested to hear how your conversion goes. Sounds like you've got a top-pull derailleur? Mine's a bottom pull. I *think* they use different pull ratios, but then apparently so do mtb vs road, but it hasn't caused me any problems so far.
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Old 07-17-18, 10:59 PM
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Originally Posted by tonyfourdogs
That's a good place for the inline adjuster - although I've seen a couple of folks on youtube put them after the first inch or so of cable coming out of the brifter for easier access. I haven't decided where mine will go yet.

I'll be interested to hear how your conversion goes. Sounds like you've got a top-pull derailleur? Mine's a bottom pull. I *think* they use different pull ratios, but then apparently so do mtb vs road, but it hasn't caused me any problems so far.
Finally got all the parts in today and spent the evening getting everything installed. Shifters seem to work *almost* perfectly. I was able to quickly get the rear derailleur dailed in, but the front one is being finicky. I can get it to shift between the middle and biggest chainrings but it won’t go down to the smallest. If I set the cable tension etc so it will shift down to the smallest I can’t seem to get it shift to the largest... I’ll keep messing with it and get some help from a friend but I may eventually take it to my LBS to see what they can do.

Only real issue issue is with the brakes. (I may make a separate post in Bicycle Mechanics just to address this topic.) I bought Tektro R559 extra long reach brakes - the nutted version, recessed wouldn’t fit in my bike. They came with two contoured washers for each brake. I was only able to use one of them because the bolts weren’t long enough for me to use both. So right now I’ve got the contoured washer between the brake and frame and a flat washer between the nut frame. Also, the arms on the rear brakes still aren’t quite long enough. The brake pads when set at their lowest position sit at the very top of the rim. With both front and rear brakes adjusted to the best of my very limited ability the braking power is definitely lacking...
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Old 07-18-18, 03:29 AM
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Maybe you're running up against the pull ratio difference between top-pull and bottom-pull derailleurs? Fortunately you can pick up a bottom pull cheaply enough if that's the case. My guess is that if no amount of cable adjustment will make it work for you, the same will likely be true for your LBS.

Let us know if/ when you get it sorted though - good luck!
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Old 07-23-18, 06:36 PM
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Originally Posted by tonyfourdogs
Maybe you're running up against the pull ratio difference between top-pull and bottom-pull derailleurs? Fortunately you can pick up a bottom pull cheaply enough if that's the case. My guess is that if no amount of cable adjustment will make it work for you, the same will likely be true for your LBS.

Let us know if/ when you get it sorted though - good luck!
Had a friend who has been around bikes for a while and does all his own work help me out with the derailleur. It’s dialed in as good as it will get. The chain rubs when in biggest chainring/smallest cog - so the hardest gearing. Not that big of a deal but I may eventually just get the road derailleur that matches the shifters.

Bigger issue is the brakes - the Tektro R559 just don’t have any room for adjustment and the braking power is pitiful. So my next step is to see if Tektro 984 brakes will work... they are technically BMX brakes, but short pull and they have the proper reach I need. If they don’t work they go back to the store and I try mini v brakes (probably Tektro 926). Last resort after all that will be problem solver travel agents as they actually end up being the most expensive option. Beauty of Amazon prime is returns are easy!
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Old 07-24-18, 11:06 AM
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I ran Sora 8 speed brifters with a Shimano 7 speed cassette and Exage RD. Exage FD worked fine too, with two ring Bio- Pace. I had Exage rim brakes, and they worked fine with these levers too. The 8 speed shifter worked the 7 speed fine. The last click just had no gear to go to.

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