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Catching the draft... how close is too close?

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Catching the draft... how close is too close?

Old 07-13-20, 04:46 PM
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upthywazzoo 
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Originally Posted by Bah Humbug
Who died and made you thread king?
Originally Posted by noodle soup
who are you to be telling anyone where something should be discussed?
Okay, fair enough. I'm not the OP nor a mod.
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Old 07-13-20, 04:57 PM
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Originally Posted by big chainring
In all my years of riding I never ran into a problem. And usually meet some nice people out on the road. They seem to welcome me. Perhaps its my superlative supplesse stylings that win them over. Could be good old Midwestern hospitality. Are most of you guys from the coasts or something? We on the third coast welcome all. Gabba Gabba Hey.
Wheel sucking is so ubiquitous on Sheridan Road everyone who rides there is used to it and expects it. There are so many riders that it's pretty much unavoidable. Just let people know you're there and follow at a reasonable distance (feet not inches). If they don't want you there they will either tell you or more likely just put in a hard effort and drop you.
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Old 07-13-20, 05:03 PM
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Just curious, as I have an aunt who used to live on N. Sheridan Road across from Hollywood Beach at the end of LSD. It's been years, but my recollection is that Sheridan is pretty busy and not really great for riding. Does it open up farther north?
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Old 07-13-20, 05:06 PM
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Originally Posted by kingston
Wheel sucking is so ubiquitous on Sheridan Road everyone who rides there is used to it and expects it. There are so many riders that it's pretty much unavoidable. Just let people know you're there and follow at a reasonable distance (feet not inches). If they don't want you there they will either tell you or more likely just put in a hard effort and drop you.
Might be inconveniently far from you but I've found the Skokie Valley Trail to be good for short efforts (maybe 2x20?). On weekdays it's pretty empty, save for the occasional triathlete.
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Old 07-13-20, 05:09 PM
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Originally Posted by caloso
Just curious, as I have an aunt who used to live on N. Sheridan Road across from Hollywood Beach at the end of LSD. It's been years, but my recollection is that Sheridan is pretty busy and not really great for riding. Does it open up farther north?
North of Calvary Cemetary (where the trail begins to enter Evanston and the fancy residential neighborhood) is where traffic begins to clear up. Once at the Bahai temple, the trail really opens up and you can basically go full gas, with only a few stoplights.
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Old 07-13-20, 05:19 PM
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Originally Posted by kingston
If they don't want you there they will either tell you or more likely just put in a hard effort and drop you.
or just brake really hard
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Old 07-13-20, 05:50 PM
  #82  
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Originally Posted by upthywazzoo
We can both be right. OP and person in front can be elite riders--but that doesn't make it safe. If person in front does not know OP is there, then it is doubly unsafe.
This is my thinking. Having done a bit of group riding, I know that my behavior in a group is much different from when I'm riding solo. In a group I scrupulously hold my line, maintain the pace the group's running at, call out hazards, signal when I'm slowing, etc.

Riding solo, I might sit up for a stretch, weave slightly to avoid the bumps I know are there from riding the same roads on and off for a couple decades, spit, blow snot rockets. Sometimes I'll be pounding along in the drops into a headwind and I'll just sit up and say "T'hell with this!". None of this would I do if someone were behind me.
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Old 07-13-20, 06:12 PM
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Originally Posted by upthywazzoo
We can both be right.
Nope.
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Old 07-13-20, 06:32 PM
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Originally Posted by WhyFi
Nope.
Alright, fine by me.
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Old 07-13-20, 06:34 PM
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I usually ride 25 mph alone on flat with my TT bike

if someone jumps on my wheel I crank it to 28 mph for 2 minutes, if he holds my wheel he is worthy of taking his turn upfront and I will trust his wheel.
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Old 07-13-20, 06:49 PM
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Well this thread turned into a mish mash of nothingness. Really weird how anyone into the road bike scene when I was a yute, was kinda on the same page. Similar backgrounds, similar interests, knew how to ride, was into Eddy. This thread just shows me how opinionated and disjointed the cycling culture is. Thanks for your responses, though very few addressed the issue. A lot of senseless bickering....oh yeah, its bikeforums.
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Old 07-13-20, 07:10 PM
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Originally Posted by dr_max
I usually ride 25 mph alone on flat with my TT bike

if someone jumps on my wheel I crank it to 28 mph for 2 minutes, if he holds my wheel he is worthy of taking his turn upfront and I will trust his wheel.
This is interesting. Don't you feel more at risk drafting in a TT position?
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Old 07-13-20, 08:10 PM
  #88  
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Originally Posted by WhyFi
Along these lines, and in the spirit of gaming the system a la Nike/Kipchoge, has there been any discussion of playing with the venue to further this effect and break records? Or are venue parameters fairly well locked down?
I have never looked to know exactly, cause it isn’t something I need worry about, but there are venue requirements for a performance to considered a record. The track is full requirements for records
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Old 07-13-20, 09:06 PM
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I don't draft nobody 'cause I don't trust nobody. Safe distance? Three bike-lengths? Five? I'm passing 'em at the next light anyway.

People sucking my wheel? Happens all too often, frankly. Makes me uncomfortable. I used to think irrationally so, but maybe not.

The only person authorized to hang out in my admittedly... sizeable draft is my wife.
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Old 07-13-20, 09:41 PM
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Originally Posted by RChung
Yes, you can feel the difference even at one bike length. However, Cycling Weekly understates "the benefit." We've measured drag reduction much farther than 20 meters. It's just that the benefit, although there, is too small to feel. How far? During hour record attempts on 250 meter velodromes, we've measured the rider drafting themselves. That's cuz even a straw can stir a bathtub.
I always wondered how riders could lap the field several times in a points race. Always thought they must have huge aerobic engines, which they probably do, but I imagine if use that knowledge correctly, it could be a big advantage. Especially on an 250 meter track.
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Old 07-13-20, 10:09 PM
  #91  
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Originally Posted by Wooderson
I only ride on people's wheels that I know on group rides. There are some people that I won't draft behind (they don't ride smooth enough, or they don't communicate hazards properly).

But 'how close?' is an interesting question. I find myself continually closing in to ~2". I have to consciously back off the gas to get to my desired 6"-12". Then before I know it, I switch back to cruise control, and I'm just 2" off again. WTH?

What sucks is when the rider in front of you stands up to hammer.. their bike shoots back about 4" in that instant (relatively speaking), which always creates an 'oh ****' moment. Yes, this is completely my issue, and this is why I try to shoot for a 6" - 12" gap. It just doesn't come naturally to me.
a number of riders I know will call out “Standing!” before they stand, to give drafting riders the heads up. However, I think if you do it right, essentially giving the bike a shove forward just as you stand, you can maintain steady forward motion and avoid freaking out the guy a couple of inches off your wheel. Another thing that people forget is that, if they’re climbing and they stop pedaling, they will actively decelerate, much to the consternation of the guy behind. Unlike stopping pedaling on level road, where you continue to coast
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Old 07-14-20, 12:44 AM
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Originally Posted by DrIsotope
The only person authorized to hang out in my admittedly... sizeable draft is my wife.
Yeah, no.

I'm more nervous having my wife try to keep up with me then a stranger.

If she crashed because of my mistake, I'd NEVER hear the end of it!
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Old 07-14-20, 02:28 AM
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Originally Posted by big chainring
Well this thread turned into a mish mash of nothingness. Really weird how anyone into the road bike scene when I was a yute, was kinda on the same page. Similar backgrounds, similar interests, knew how to ride, was into Eddy. This thread just shows me how opinionated and disjointed the cycling culture is. Thanks for your responses, though very few addressed the issue. A lot of senseless bickering....oh yeah, its bikeforums.
Yep. This thread sums up internet forums.
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Old 07-14-20, 03:30 AM
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Originally Posted by big chainring
Well this thread turned into a mish mash of nothingness. Really weird how anyone into the road bike scene when I was a yute, was kinda on the same page. Similar backgrounds, similar interests, knew how to ride, was into Eddy. This thread just shows me how opinionated and disjointed the cycling culture is. Thanks for your responses though very few addressed the issue. A lot of senseless bickering....oh yeah, its bikeforums.
What this thread has clearly shown is that many cyclists think it's unsafe or untoward to draft someone you might happen upon during your ride. So the response consensus here is; drafting someone you don't know is "too close" whether it be 2" or 2'.

It's the internet, people are going to argue about whether it's daylight or dark and at least one of them will claim to be an engineer. If you don't expect that you're going to be disappointed over and over again. Arguing is the coin of the realm on enthusiast forums, as is people who ask questions and have already decided what they want the answer to be.

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Old 07-14-20, 03:55 AM
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Originally Posted by SurferCyclist
Yep. This thread sums up internet forums.
Bikeforums seems to be on the pointy end of the bell curve, TBH. As is Slowtwitch, for that matter.
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Old 07-14-20, 04:46 AM
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Originally Posted by big chainring
Well this thread turned into a mish mash of nothingness. Really weird how anyone into the road bike scene when I was a yute, was kinda on the same page. Similar backgrounds, similar interests, knew how to ride, was into Eddy. This thread just shows me how opinionated and disjointed the cycling culture is. Thanks for your responses, though very few addressed the issue. A lot of senseless bickering....oh yeah, its bikeforums.
What really happened is you asked a question, didn't like the answer, and decided to ignore that answer. And the bickering was, again, directly about your question.
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Old 07-14-20, 05:53 AM
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Originally Posted by colnago62
I have never looked to know exactly, cause it isn’t something I need worry about, but there are venue requirements for a performance to considered a record. The track is full requirements for records
So a hermetically sealed oval tube (with regulation flooring of course) seems would be conducive with no stands, and no center of the track area.
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Old 07-14-20, 05:59 AM
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Originally Posted by big chainring
Well this thread turned into a mish mash of nothingness. Really weird how anyone into the road bike scene when I was a yute, was kinda on the same page. Similar backgrounds, similar interests, knew how to ride, was into Eddy. This thread just shows me how opinionated and disjointed the cycling culture is. Thanks for your responses, though very few addressed the issue. A lot of senseless bickering....oh yeah, its bikeforums.
Yes
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Old 07-14-20, 06:06 AM
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Originally Posted by Bah Humbug
What really happened is you asked a question, didn't like the answer, and decided to ignore that answer. And the bickering was, again, directly about your question.
No summary of this thread is complete without mentioning the proud Fredery.
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Old 07-14-20, 06:08 AM
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I guess I didnt realize the uniqueness of the North Shore scene. This past weekend Three guys passed me and I jumped on their wheel. With the four of us total age probably exeeded 250 yrs. I allowed them to rotate the lead, I hung in the back. We were all similar build so I was getting an excellent draft. When they picked up the pace is when I tucked in close to the wheel in front of me to get maximum draft effect. I only ride on weekends so my conditioning is not the best. So riding really close can make my effort considerably less. And thats when I started thinking, hmm how close is too close?

Maybe its the abundance of riders with abundance of experience that makes it accepted to draft at will. Or maybe its the parade-like atmosphere. So many riders all with somewhat the same intention. Its just commonplace to jump in to any group that passes. From responses this is not the norm. Here in my neighborhood its just what we do.
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