ddimick

Thought I'd share my experience. I started cycling last year on a Specialized Sirrus, which is a great bike that I've enjoyed very much. It's more or less a flat bar road bike. I've put about 2,000 miles on it. As I got into the sport I found I liked the idea of endurance events. My first metric century was this past May. The last 20 miles were into a ~10mph wind, and it was tough. I decided then and there to start shopping for a road bike.

I've had a Look 566 relaxed geo road bike for about three weeks now. I completed my first imperial century last weekend. Here are my observations:

Road pro:
Requires less energy to go the same speed. You're more aero, and that makes a big difference as the miles stack up. My friend also completed the same century on his Sirrus and was unable to keep up with the pace. We started cycling at the same time with the same bike, except his has more carbon and nicer wheels than mine. We ride together four or five times a week, so our ability and training is more or less identical. He's shopping for a road bike now although, like me, he still loves his Sirrus.

Multiple hand positions with the drop bars meant my hands never got numb, even after 100 miles. Even with the extra positions offered by Ergon GC3s I would start having hand numbness on the hybrid after about 40 miles.

Road con:
The more aggressive position on even a relaxed-geo road bike is not a small change. There's a price you pay to get out of the wind. Muscles in my triceps and especially neck were sore. It took a day or two before I could turn my head normally. When I finished the century my upper body was done, but me legs could have gone on.

I'm looking forward to a 540-mile 7-day ride next June on my new road bike.

qmsdc15

Congrats on the century! You should consider a recumbent.

Triode

well, I thought about starting a similar thread - although, I haven't been riding as long as you.

Even so, when I went from a Trek 7.3 FX to a Specialized Roubaix Comp - trememndous change for the better.

I know, lighter and more expensive bike.

Easier to get more Aero, different geometry - steers better, handles better - really nice.

I ride only on pavement. I guess the reason I got a hybrid was due to it having more similarities with the bikes I grew up with.

Love the road bike

ddimick

I actually did, along with the trikes. I think if I were touring I'd lean that way, but I live in a pretty hilly area and recumbants don't climb well. They'll blow you away on descents and flats, though.

Talldog

LOL .... you're mean (aka facetious) .... but funny,too.

Talldog

Did you win ... ?

Lexi01

I'm about to do the same - pick it up today actually.

I've had a my new Hybrid for about 6 months and have been doing 99% road kms...so I've decided to buy a road bike as well and save the hybrid for shorter river and trail rides.

I've ordered a 63cm SuperSix 5.

It was good to read the OP saying the difference is noticeable. I've had a nagging fear in the back of my mind that I'm about to spend a lot of cash for not a lot of benefit. I've been doing 50-75km rides most weekends for a few months and my back tends to get a bit stiff and i stop for a little stretch near the end...I'm hoping the road bike will equal less effort and longer rides - after I get used to the position...although my position on the hybrid (due to my height) isn't exactly upright!

Talldog

Really, the difference is neglible unless you are averaging 20mph or more already. Then the pure road racer would pay bigger dividends. Otherwise there is a large placebo effect methinks. If it is just hand position that is the problem there are other options. To me the drop bar thing about long range comfort is just a myth. They were designed for racing after all, not comfort. I've got both and prefer the flat bars. Everybody is different though. Best to borrow one and try it before you drop a lot of coin.

The Chemist

I've ridden about the same distance on my Giant FCR3500 that I bought in April, which is also pretty much a flat bar road bike, with bar ends. I have also ridden several metric centuries on it and just rode my first imperial century on it this week, but unlike you I won't be switching to a full road bike. Why? Because I've ridden a drop bar road bike before and I really don't like the posture of riding in the drops. I find that bar ends give me an aerodynamic enough position to cut through headwinds reasonably well, without forcing me to bend over as much as drop bars do.

And really, I just don't think that a full on road bike would give me many advantages over my hybrid. The roads here are pretty bumpy and I wouldn't want to be running any narrower tires than the 28s I've got on my bike now. Further, I don't think I'd get that much faster with a full road bike, as I can cruise relatively easily at over 30km/h on flat roads without a headwind.

Everybody is different, of course, but that's my $0.02.

ColinL

There is a significant difference enough to where noticing it and preferring one or the other isn't a placebo. If you upgrade some part of your bike and lose 100 grams, noticing a significant difference is probably a placebo. But flatbars, even with bar ends, are not the same as drop bars.

What makes them comfortable is having a lot of places to put your hands. I haven't looked for pics of your bike, Talldog, but I would bet money you have bar ends. Plain flat bars cause hand fatigue because you can only grip them normally, or very shallow with your fingertips and then you can't shift or apply the brakes.

However, if you don't have much weight on your hands due to supporting yourself primarily with your core, that will definitely help both (more correctly, ALL) bar types reduce hand and wrist fatigue.


Flexibility matters a lot. I cannot and will not get into the crazy positions that pro road racers do, seat 8+ inches above their bars. More reasonable for average riders is around 2-3" drop. Some folks ride road bikes with bars even or above their seat, and some flatbar road bikes are much lower. Bar alone doesn't make the positioning, of course!

Very smart advice. Borrow a friend's bike that is approximately the right size (no more than 1 size small), or rent one from a LBS.

My hybrid is still very useful to me because I bought one that is nearly a hardtail MTB, with a very good suspension fork. Before getting a road bike, I was very concerned about maintaining a balance between on and off-road tire performance. Now I have very aggressive 35mm cyclocross knobbies on it, and they're terrible on the road but they're quite good on technical singletrack. I only ride that bike on the road if I'm doing a short ride (under 15 miles) with friends & family who have hybrids or MTBs, and they ride slowly between 10 and 15 mph.

There is absolutely no contest between my road bike and hybrid on the street, even when I had street-biased tires. (Caveat: I never ran 25mm true road tires on my hybrid.) It's significantly lighter, more hand positions, shifts better*, and I have many logged rides where I can prove that for the same perceived rate of effort on the same path I was going faster on a road bike. My hands and wrists feel better because I have a lot more hand positions and I switch them every few minutes. I ride in the drops going into the wind or downhill-- I actually use everything the bars have to offer.


Anyway, none what I've written should be controversial. We're all here because we love bikes and want to discuss them and learn from each other. Pick the best bike for you, your budget, and your riding conditions! Better yet, have several bikes that are optimized for different types of riding.


*Footnote: my hybrid has Shimano Deore drivetrain and it isn't nearly as smooth operating as my road bike's SRAM Rival. However, my wife's hybrid now has full SRAM X9 and it is really good. So, no, road drivetrain isn't always better than MTB. And some hybrids do have road drivetrains.

qmsdc15

Lex, has it been six months already? Should I feel guilty for encouraging you to purchase the Scott?

I don't see the need for two bikes for recreational riding unless you ride off road, in which case, a road bike and a mountain bike makes more sense than a road bike and a hybrid.

Perhaps you could put a rack on your hybrid and use it as a utility vehicle. Commuting to work and or getting groceries, etc.

I was purely a utility biker for many years before I started participating in the hybrid forum. Since then, I've been inspired by reading about the rides of other hybrid riders and have begun doing occasional recreational rides of between 100 and 200 miles in length. My average speed is slow, but I can't blame my bikes. If I really wanted to go faster, I'd rent a car.

qmsdc15

That bumper under your head tube has got to help with the comfort thing.

The Chemist

Indeed it does. I have no idea why more hybrids don't come with something like that, especially hybrids that are more road-oriented. It's far lighter than a regular suspension fork, and if you aren't doing a lot (or any) off road riding, it's got enough travel to soak up pretty much any bump.

qmsdc15

Cannondale had a short travel Headshok on some of their road bikes years ago, but I guess it didn't sell. Roadies eschew comfort. "HTFU"

https://www.bikepedia.com/quickbike/B...iple&Type=bike

I coveted a Silk Road when they were new. I didn't see the downside. I guess it added a little weight.

Talldog

I my case I have never found that to be true. Obviously, others may have different experiences. But my hands go numb more quickly while on my road bike than on my flat bar bikes (don't use bar ends, you would have lost money by betting, LOL). And yes, the roadie is sized correctly. The point I was trying to make is that having more hand positions (especially the positions available on a drop bar) will not necessarily make everyone more comfortable by using them in lieu of flat bars. Anyone who has been riding a long time knows there are many ways to position one's hands on a flat bar to relieve potential stress. The other point I was trying to make is that a road bike does not significantly increase one's speed or decrease one's level of effort unless that rider is already at a a very, very high fitness level and is interested mostly in going as fast as possible (ie, in excess of a 20mph average). One could do more simply by adding aero bars to his flat bar if that is what is wanted. That would increase aero efficiency way more than drop bars ever could. And nobody actually rides in the drops unless they have too, even racers. The normal position is on the bar tops or on the hoods, or in the vicinity thereof, because riding in the drops is just not comfortable. The biggest thing is that a road racer feels different and feels faster. But perceptions to the average rider are rarely the same as blunt reality, even if this perception causes the rider to up his tempo or cadence as a result. (ie., the placebo effect)

ddimick

I really cannot agree about the placebo claim. On the 60-mile ride on my hybrid I average 15.0mph with 3,000 feet vertical. On the 100-mile roadie ride I averaged 15.7mph with 4,000 feet vertical. On the flats speed was between 18-20mph most of the time. Longer, more difficult, yet still faster. The engine is the same, the bike is not. Whatever placebo effect there might have been was long gone by the time I finished.

I am nowhere near being an elite athlete. I'm a 40-year-old man with bad joints and a Lipitor prescription. But I'm not trying to convince anyone to do anything, just wanted to share my experience in my quest for a bike that suites my goals. I have no agenda.

I spent perhaps 15% of the time in the drops during descents and sometimes on flats when I wanted to change positions. About 15% on the bars when climbing or wanted to change positions. The remainder on the hoods. If you're able to ride a flat bar for that distance without any hand issues, that's great. I wasn't able to and the road bar took care of that issue for me, so I'm happy.

qmsdc15

It's possible you could ride 60 miles now without the hand problems. I've found that problems I had during my first century resolved themselves simply by riding more. You (and your hands) are in better condition now. An increase in average speed of less than 1mph may also be due to the fact that your conditioning has improved.

Whether your increased speed is due to improved fitness, placebo effect or a faster bike, or quite possibly all three, you're riding longer and faster and enjoying it more.

Not for everybody, but I wouldn't mind having one.

giantcfr1

You've got room for another one. Go on.

ColinL

Me either. I'm pretty sure Talldog said he has a road bike and hybrid and he prefers his hybrid, but I don't know if he has a cheap roadbike with a poor fit, awesome hybrid with the right fit, has a lot more seat time on the hybrid, or he rides both a lot but is just that much more at home on his hybrid.

I found your comparison compelling. Considerably more distance, faster. That's objective. Much easier and more comfortable-- subjective, but hardly a placebo.

Talldog

That's a nice bike. I especially like the look and tube design of that bike (no pun intended).

Talldog

Probably that, LOL. My main "hybrid" is a Trek 7.9FX (2009) and my road bikes are a Gary Fisher Cronus (2010) and a Trek Pilot 5.2 OCLV (2006). I guess I'm just an old motocross racer who likes flat bars for all the right reasons.

PS: I know how to fit bikes.

However, I have been thinking about this a little more though and I think you are probably right .... sort of, LOL. In the end, everything is relative. I tend to relate everything to my own situation, which is less than ideal for various reasons. Plus, I am inherently cantankerous, opinionated, and argumentative. I have tried to change but it is futile ...

ColinL

A 7.9FX is a heck of a bike... a flatbar carbon road bike more than a hybrid, IMHO, but that's neither here nor there.

PS dirtbiker here too, still ride now and then. Mostly enduro but I scare myself on my 2007 yz 250 a few times a year.

Talldog

Two stroke I hope. I had a KTM 250SX thumper a few years ago and was underwhelmed. I'm from the 2 stroke era. Still have a "03 KDX 220 and a Yamaha DT200R road/dirt bike but my riding has wound down. Could never warm up up to the thumpers really, so the SX, although a technical marvel, was short lived. This is a bicycle forum so I will cut it short at that, as I could talk about dirt biking all day (at least from the retro perspective ... I'm from the DeCoster, Mikkola, Hannah era). Closing thought ... off road dirt biking was the the most rewarding and fun sport I have ever participated in, bar none ... my biggest lament is that I can no longer do it due to age (sigh), time, and lack of accessible riding areas.

ColinL

As a five year-old I had a massive poster of Bob Hannah at Unadilla. But yes-- 2 stroke yz250. My enduro is a XR650R, beast of a machine but no motocrosser.

Lexi01

Mate...don't feel guilty at all. I still love my Scott! I tend to agree with you about the mtb + road being a better combo than a hybrid + road. Though I've taken the scott on offroad trails and its performed beautifully...wasn't a fan of the jumps (bit hard on the bum) but I do that sort of stuff once in a blue moon.

With regards the other comments about speed between hybrid and road bikes...I took the new supersix on its maiden voyage yesterday - an 80km loop of the bay that I've been doing for the last month on the Hybrid. The result: 2:44 vs. 3:23 the previous week on the hybrid. An average speed of 29.2km/h vs. 23.6km/h...I reckon that's more than a placebo effect. The SuperSix is carbon and weighs a bit over 5kg less than the hybrid. Thinner tyres too...dunno if that helps or not (Iv'e read conflicting posts on that one).

My back was a little sore after it though - nothing major. I was on the hoods about 75% of the time and on the bars a lot towards the end...never once reached for the lower bars...felt too much of a stretch.

With reference to the seat to bar drop someone else was talking about I have a pic of my bike setup for me with a pretty sever drop. Seems pretty aggressive to me...but this is more a result of being 6ft 5 rather than wanting a particularly aggressive riding position.