Tips to build wheel quickly?
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Tips to build wheel quickly?
Hello,
I want to build a new rear wheel for my Brompton by reusing the spokes + BWR gear hub, as it's about 10x cheaper than buying a whole, new wheel.
I've already done it for the front wheel, and did an OK job but it took a bit long.
If you have good experience building wheels, what would be your top tips to get the job done in less than an hour and reasonably well — ie. a professional wouldn't be happy, but good enough for the (rim) brakes to do their job — ?
Thank you.
I want to build a new rear wheel for my Brompton by reusing the spokes + BWR gear hub, as it's about 10x cheaper than buying a whole, new wheel.
I've already done it for the front wheel, and did an OK job but it took a bit long.
If you have good experience building wheels, what would be your top tips to get the job done in less than an hour and reasonably well — ie. a professional wouldn't be happy, but good enough for the (rim) brakes to do their job — ?
Thank you.
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Unfortunately, practice...
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Why the rush? Ever hear: "there's never enough time to do it right but always time to do it over"?
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The slower I build wheels, the sooner I'm done.
Tension up slower than you need to and recheck often.
"Final" truing is very minor, and I'm usually within +/- 5kgf of same side spokes.
BTW, old "crusty" threads will make your effort difficult to do right. You need "feel".
Use new nipples and wire brush the spoke threads well.
That will go strides toward making a less crappy wheel.
Tension up slower than you need to and recheck often.
"Final" truing is very minor, and I'm usually within +/- 5kgf of same side spokes.
BTW, old "crusty" threads will make your effort difficult to do right. You need "feel".
Use new nipples and wire brush the spoke threads well.
That will go strides toward making a less crappy wheel.
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All the good advice above ^^!
I've built 4 or 5 wheels for my Dahon and Tern folders, and a couple for my full-size road bike. I seem to get pretty good results in a couple hours of work. But it's easy work, and it isn't necessary very often... it's not as if I'm making my living building wheels.
Slow down and enjoy the process!
I've built 4 or 5 wheels for my Dahon and Tern folders, and a couple for my full-size road bike. I seem to get pretty good results in a couple hours of work. But it's easy work, and it isn't necessary very often... it's not as if I'm making my living building wheels.
Slow down and enjoy the process!
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Hello,
I want to build a new rear wheel for my Brompton by reusing the spokes + BWR gear hub, as it's about 10x cheaper than buying a whole, new wheel.
I've already done it for the front wheel, and did an OK job but it took a bit long.
If you have good experience building wheels, what would be your top tips to get the job done in less than an hour and reasonably well — ie. a professional wouldn't be happy, but good enough for the (rim) brakes to do their job — ?
I want to build a new rear wheel for my Brompton by reusing the spokes + BWR gear hub, as it's about 10x cheaper than buying a whole, new wheel.
I've already done it for the front wheel, and did an OK job but it took a bit long.
If you have good experience building wheels, what would be your top tips to get the job done in less than an hour and reasonably well — ie. a professional wouldn't be happy, but good enough for the (rim) brakes to do their job — ?
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Yup. And don’t overthink it. It’s not as daunting as many people make it out to be.
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want to speed it up use a small handheld screw gun, unthread each nipple about 3 turns, then tape the two rims together. Unthread a spoke with the screw gun, set the new nipple and thread till there's about 2 threads still showing. You can do this all the way around. Note, if you could see any part of a thread on the original wheel you'll need to adjust the visible threads. Something like the cyclus nipple driver
https://www.bike24.com/p2242915.html will also speed up the whole process. Var and a couple other brands make similar and they cost 15-30 each but totally worth the cost if you do this often enough. With this and a bit of practice you can build a wheel in half an hour.
https://www.bike24.com/p2242915.html will also speed up the whole process. Var and a couple other brands make similar and they cost 15-30 each but totally worth the cost if you do this often enough. With this and a bit of practice you can build a wheel in half an hour.
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Thanks for the tips.
A digital tension meter seems to help a lot to get it right and fast — I assume it's how wheels are machine-built in the factory —, but it's way too expensive for non-pros.
I'll also get some linseed oil for the threads. I've seen it recommended here and there.
A digital tension meter seems to help a lot to get it right and fast — I assume it's how wheels are machine-built in the factory —, but it's way too expensive for non-pros.
I'll also get some linseed oil for the threads. I've seen it recommended here and there.
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I like to tape the spokes together at the crossings and then I can remove the old rim and swap in the new one. I put all of the nipples on and then go around and run all of them down the end of the threads. I put my thumbnail against the last thread and run the nipple down until it hits my thumbnail. Then I go around the wheel and tighten each nipple the same amount of turns until it starts to get some tension. At that point, it goes in the stand and gets dished and trued before further tightening.
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Thanks for the tips.
A digital tension meter seems to help a lot to get it right and fast — I assume it's how wheels are machine-built in the factory —, but it's way too expensive for non-pros.
I'll also get some linseed oil for the threads. I've seen it recommended here and there.
A digital tension meter seems to help a lot to get it right and fast — I assume it's how wheels are machine-built in the factory —, but it's way too expensive for non-pros.
I'll also get some linseed oil for the threads. I've seen it recommended here and there.
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Picking the Scablands. Washington and Oregon, 2005. Pie and spiders on the Columbia River!
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#13
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Thanks for the tips.
A digital tension meter seems to help a lot to get it right and fast — I assume it's how wheels are machine-built in the factory —, but it's way too expensive for non-pros.
I'll also get some linseed oil for the threads. I've seen it recommended here and there.
A digital tension meter seems to help a lot to get it right and fast — I assume it's how wheels are machine-built in the factory —, but it's way too expensive for non-pros.
I'll also get some linseed oil for the threads. I've seen it recommended here and there.
You seem to make a lot of assumptions or go off an tangents because you read "something somewhere".
You have obviously never measured the tensions on a machine built wheel. They are all over the place.
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Swapping rims by taping the rims together and moving spokes one at a time is a time honoured and fool-proof way to do it. But it is the slow way to do it. Much of the time comes from unthreading each nipple and reinserting and rethreading in the new rim.
To do a faster wheel build, in my experience, you need to have the spokes out and sorted by length (usually drive-side/non-drive-side), then make sure you find the correct hole in the rim to get everything lined up to start, then drop all the spokes in to one side of the hub from one direction, lace them into the rim, then repeat this three more times.
When I regularly built wheels in an LBS I would not reuse spokes as unthreading and inspecting and cleaning cost more in shop time than a new set of DT P.G. spokes. Maybe the calculation would work out different if the spokes were more expensive.
To do a faster wheel build, in my experience, you need to have the spokes out and sorted by length (usually drive-side/non-drive-side), then make sure you find the correct hole in the rim to get everything lined up to start, then drop all the spokes in to one side of the hub from one direction, lace them into the rim, then repeat this three more times.
When I regularly built wheels in an LBS I would not reuse spokes as unthreading and inspecting and cleaning cost more in shop time than a new set of DT P.G. spokes. Maybe the calculation would work out different if the spokes were more expensive.
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I like to tape the spokes together at the crossings and then I can remove the old rim and swap in the new one. I put all of the nipples on and then go around and run all of them down the end of the threads. I put my thumbnail against the last thread and run the nipple down until it hits my thumbnail. Then I go around the wheel and tighten each nipple the same amount of turns until it starts to get some tension. At that point, it goes in the stand and gets dished and trued before further tightening.
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Unless you have a bunch of wheel builds under your belt, I think that an hour is an unrealistic time objective. Most of the time required to build a good wheel has to do with tensioning and final truing.
My trick is to stick my thumb nail into the last spoke thread and tighten every spoke to that level. That gives me an even place for starting a round wheel. From that point on I count turns as I gradually tighten each spoke. I usually start with two full turns, then one full turn, then fractional turns. Start at the valve hole and tighten every spoke by the same amount. This may not be the fastest way to do it but, if you are meticulous, it will keep the wheel round as the tension builds and radial truing is the hardest to correct afterward. As the wheel approaches final tension, I do the finish truing by tightening and loosening opposing pairs of spokes by an equal amount. That keeps the absolute tension as even as possible.
I once built up a 40 spoke tandem wheel using this method that required no truing, either lateral or radial, at all.
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This^^^^
Unless you have a bunch of wheel builds under your belt, I think that an hour is an unrealistic time objective. Most of the time required to build a good wheel has to do with tensioning and final truing.
My trick is to stick my thumb nail into the last spoke thread and tighten every spoke to that level. That gives me an even place for starting a round wheel. From that point on I count turns as I gradually tighten each spoke. I usually start with two full turns, then one full turn, then fractional turns. Start at the valve hole and tighten every spoke by the same amount. This may not be the fastest way to do it but, if you are meticulous, it will keep the wheel round as the tension builds and radial truing is the hardest to correct afterward. As the wheel approaches final tension, I do the finish truing by tightening and loosening opposing pairs of spokes by an equal amount. That keeps the absolute tension as even as possible.
I once built up a 40 spoke tandem wheel using this method that required no truing, either lateral or radial, at all.
Unless you have a bunch of wheel builds under your belt, I think that an hour is an unrealistic time objective. Most of the time required to build a good wheel has to do with tensioning and final truing.
My trick is to stick my thumb nail into the last spoke thread and tighten every spoke to that level. That gives me an even place for starting a round wheel. From that point on I count turns as I gradually tighten each spoke. I usually start with two full turns, then one full turn, then fractional turns. Start at the valve hole and tighten every spoke by the same amount. This may not be the fastest way to do it but, if you are meticulous, it will keep the wheel round as the tension builds and radial truing is the hardest to correct afterward. As the wheel approaches final tension, I do the finish truing by tightening and loosening opposing pairs of spokes by an equal amount. That keeps the absolute tension as even as possible.
I once built up a 40 spoke tandem wheel using this method that required no truing, either lateral or radial, at all.
Ben
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I learned to build wheels with the old Robergel spokes. The spokes out of a sealed box were far from uniform. There was no reference to start with. It would take me probably an hour to get a loosely spoked wheel with some semblance of round and true. (Spoke lengths were not uniform, Depth of threading likewise. Gauges varied, 3 spokes/wheelset would just break in the early miles. I used the very light butted galvanized Sport spokes. Well built and after those bad spokes broke, those wheels went forever and were the weight of the modern DT Revolutions. Building my first Wheelsmith spoked wheel in the '80s was a revelation! Round to start with!
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#21
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I learned to build wheels with the old Robergel spokes. The spokes out of a sealed box were far from uniform. There was no reference to start with. It would take me probably an hour to get a loosely spoked wheel with some semblance of round and true. (Spoke lengths were not uniform, Depth of threading likewise. Gauges varied, 3 spokes/wheelset would just break in the early miles. I used the very light butted galvanized Sport spokes. Well built and after those bad spokes broke, those wheels went forever and were the weight of the modern DT Revolutions. Building my first Wheelsmith spoked wheel in the '80s was a revelation! Round to start with!
Ben
Ben
It was an OMG experience!
I had purchased a TS-8 stand & tension meter. a couple years before when I was flipping bikes for side money. Make $20, buy $30-35 worth of tools kind of profit.
My ACTUAL REASON was trying to get those damned Huffy wheels straight enough so I could get the brake pads really close so they had at least some braking.
I quickly learned the limitations of Huffy's & TS-8's.
I had cannibalized a few wheels for parts, so I had "built" a couple "used" wheels. Even with new nipples, a complete pain.
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My trick is to stick my thumb nail into the last spoke thread and tighten every spoke to that level. That gives me an even place for starting a round wheel. From that point on I count turns as I gradually tighten each spoke. I usually start with two full turns, then one full turn, then fractional turns. Start at the valve hole and tighten every spoke by the same amount. This may not be the fastest way to do it but, if you are meticulous, it will keep the wheel round as the tension builds and radial truing is the hardest to correct afterward. As the wheel approaches final tension, I do the finish truing by tightening and loosening opposing pairs of spokes by an equal amount. That keeps the absolute tension as even as possible.
I started by screwing each nipple until the end showed through and the screwdriver could no longer work.
At that point, I got a somewhat oval rim, and I wondered: Should I tigthen the few spokes around the section and move the rim closer to the hub, or conversely should I loosen those involved to move the rim away from the hub?
But anyway, after getting a reasonably round wheel, it took only minimal adjustment to correct the lateral wobble.
It's not perfect, but the brakes work fine.
Thanks everyone.
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Put enough tension in the wheel (110 kgf rear drive side) and it will stay true until crashed or bent on a road obstacle. Zinc anti-seize is ideal since that corrodes preferentially to aluminum, although plain grease works well.
Insufficiently tensioned wheels can taco hitting bumps when the rim bends enough to slacken the spokes, without lateral support the rim shifts sideways, and the rim springs back while still off center.
While sticky stuff stops loose nipples from turning so wheels stay straight, it doesn't fix the underlying problem which you're better off knowing about.
Wheelsmith developed Spoke Prep to cut warranty returns from heavier riders using under tensioned machine built wheels which wouldn't stay true.
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Thanks for the tips.
A digital tension meter seems to help a lot to get it right and fast — I assume it's how wheels are machine-built in the factory —, but it's way too expensive for non-pros.
A digital tension meter seems to help a lot to get it right and fast — I assume it's how wheels are machine-built in the factory —, but it's way too expensive for non-pros.
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I got an even cheaper one from China.