MrBinky

Hi Folks,

I was hit by a car making a left hand turn directly into my path. I was going about 20mph and was able to lay on the breaks but lucky to be alive. My Trek Domane 2017 is toast. Cracked frame, bent from wheel, derailer and shifters toast. Helmet cracked, big torn, just an overall bad day on what was a really good ride. I was on a bike that cost me $5k of hard earned money to allow me to stay sane and do what I love.

I was lucky enough to walk away with just muscle damage but my bike it toast. I used an attorney recommended by my sibling but I do not think they have any experience working with cyclists.

I had PT for about 2 months but my recovery was swift. I went to local Trek bike shop to get a list of items that were damaged/destroyed from the accident. I got a California CHP report and the officer clearly remarked that it was the drivers fault 100%.

Now X months later, I get this response from my attorney on what the insurance agency is willing to give. I think this is robbery but reaching out to folks who know or have others / worked in industry to not get robbed here:

Now, how can I fight these really ****ty claims? I'm down at least $5k not even counting all the additonal equipment in this.

Your feedback is most welcome.. :*(

StephenH

Can you actually buy the bike where they say for that much?
Does that include assembly/tuning/delivery/warranty? If not, add those items in.
Had you upgraded any components (saddle, computer, tires, etc)?

My only experience with this- they didn't worry too much about the equipment end of things because the medical was the major item.

mstateglfr 

what specifically do you disagree with? List what you disagree with and why. List what you think you should receive compared to what they are offering.

I have no idea if what they are offering is insulting or not. If given a guess, it would be that they are lowballing, but that's just based on the long documented history of insurance companies trying to limit what they cover.

If you can buy the exact copy of your old bible in the same condition for what they claim, then why is their offer a bad deal?




Need some actual info from you.

WhyFi

The Pro's Closet sells used bikes, not new. They're referencing a 2015 Domane 5.9 in a size 56 - https://www.theproscloset.com/produc...bike-2015-56cm.

I would expect my lawyer to go for new replacement value, not used/depreciated. And where's the money for the pain and suffering? This is some bull****.

drewtk

Damn, really sorry to hear about this, but sounds like it could have been a lot worse.

I don’t know about the pain and suffering, but, and I hate to say it, insurance is not going to pay you all of your out of pocket expenses on the bike. They’re going to pay you the value of the bike and other equipment on the day of the accident.

Your bike was 2 years old at the time, so they should pay you the fair value of what it would cost in March 2019 to buy a 2017 Domane like yours, not a brand new 2019 Domane. Same for the other stuff on their list. Now, you might dispute what the fair used value is, but they aren’t going to pay you the new value.

Think of it this way: if you caused an accident and totaled a 10 year old car, do you expect to pay the value of a 10 year old car or a new car? You pay for what the item is worth at the time of the incident.

Talk to your insurance company or a lawyer to get a more experienced opinion, but they’ll tell you the same thing.

But most importantly, very glad to hear you’re mostly okay.

Chi_Z

there is big difference between 2015 domane and 2017 domane. Should have gotten a cycling injury lawyer instead

MrBinky

Agreed. I was able to walk away without any broken bones. But still. Their client hit me with their car and I was on a bike....

That being said, I'm trying to grapple with the idea of a bike's value. It's not like a car. There are few moving parts and the value stays relatively high. I guess I need to get ebay/cl posts of others selling the same bike I had. I also has a standard stock kit on the bike. Only main changes were seat and handle post, but it was smooth and worked really well.

All very good points on value and how to get the real value point of view for what I'm agruing.

Question for all: How much does an insurnace company pay for their client hitting you with their 2.5K ton car while they are texting?

rseeker

Just a reminder, anything you say, especially including in an open-to-the-world online forum, can and may be used against you by an opposing attorney.

Sorry this happened to you, and I hope you're made whole and then some.

melikebikey35

Bikes do not hold their value well. At all.

For instance, I had a 2018 Domane and was only able to sell it for half of what I paid, despite it being only 3 months old. And now, I'm trying to sell another bike. It's a year old, was $8k new, and I've had it listed for $3500 for nearly 4 months now...and not a single inquiry about it. I've resorted to parting it out. And have learned my lesson about switching bikes so often.

So, to be honest, I think the $1800 that they are offering for your Domane is a pretty good price. And if they are, in fact, referencing the 2015 that WhyFi pointed out, then you shouldn't have any problems getting a bit more.


I also recommend getting bike specific insurance. The policy I have allowed me to declare the value of the bike/accessories, and they will pay that amount out, in full, if my bike gets damaged.

MoAlpha

I’m no expert, but it looks like pretty reasonable “actual cash value” for your losses. As others have said, you can, and probably should, argue with the quotes, but it’s not going to get you to new prices. Glad you weren’t hurt worse.

Madridjoe

The guy who hit me back in 2012, had no insurance, and nothing of value, I got nothing from him for the damage to my bike, my broken scapula or my messed up back. But my friend who was just in front of me, was killed, so I considered myself fortunate to be still alive and moved on. Have your lawyer make a counter offer and see what happens. You likely are not going to get what you think is fair, but things could have turned out much worse. We were in a dedicated bike lane, and like you, this guy made a left turn right into us. Police also cited him and he was found guilty in court, amounting to a $1000 fine and 2 months loss of license. Not much for what he did ( my friend had not yet died from his injuries at the time of the trial), but the courts rarely identify with the cyclist.

SayWatt

sorry this happened to you. Definitely don’t take the first offer.

UsedToBeFaster

Those guys love a good crash story

Succhia Ruota

You're allowed to negotiate.

eja_ bottecchia

@MrBinky, insurance companies will never compensate you for the true value of your damages/injuries. They are hoping that you take the money and walk away. This is especially true this time of the year, when people are strapped for cash.

Your lawyer should have already told you this.

If you don’t need the money right away, then force the insurance company’s hand, refuse their initial force and continue to negotiate or take them to court.

Insurance companies are not your friends, never have never will. They profit by collecting high premiums and making low pay outs.

I know this because I am an attorney and have both represented insurance companies and sued them.

Good luck fellow rider.

RShantz

I was hit by a car about 3 years ago. Just a minor accident. Didn't total the bike, but did scratch the wheels and damage the shifters. I also had a good bit of road rash, so the pictures of my body made it look worse than the accident really was.

In any event, I didn't use an attorney as I knew I wasn't really hurt - skin heals. The insurance company gave me full replacement cost on all damaged components, cost for bandages and such for the rash which totaled over $200 (I was shocked at how expensive tegaderm is) and $1k to release them from any further claims. I told them I didn't need the $1k, but they said I had to take that as part of the settlement - consideration for me releasing their liability.

I know folks always say to get an attorney if hit by a car, but based on my experience I don't think that's always the best approach. I think they were so easy to deal with in my situation b/c they knew they did not have to worry about any legal fees on their end or potential litigation. So I say don't use an attorney if you don't have somewhat serious physical injuries.

DOS

Wow, I have never seen an insurance company nickel and dime on bike property claim like that. Just paying retail replacement is going to be cheaper than whatever costs they incur even just to do the accounting much less in litigation. In my case, the insurance company was just happy not to have to pay medical costs so paid me replacement based on a bike shop estimate (my lbs charged $25 for insurance claim evaluation).Doing the whole depreciation thing would have been hard anyway because many of the components on the bike had been upgraded so were newer than the frame.

I suggest you get an estimate of retail replacement component by component, frame included, particularly if you had upgraded or replaced expensive things like the wheels and cranks.Even if LBS just totals the entire bike, retail relacement estimate, even depreciated for a 2017 domane, is gonna be more than that bogus pro closet estimate they used. I have never heard of anyone using online used bike site prices as a basis for an insurance claim. I would push back on that at least.

Greatestalltime

Don’t take less for full price of a new bike. Be willing to go to court. Get a new lawyer if he appears to. It want to go to court. Go to the Dr. and have your injuries reviewed. Something could show up later that you think is minor.

I was hit. T-boned and they replaced my bike after I told them I’d consider signing the waiver after I received my bike. I did then I called a lawyer.

If I had it to do over again I’d use one of those “personal injury” lawyers you see on tv. They seem to have the resources to get what you deserve.

You clearly deserve a new bike. If you have to get it through pain and suffering do that. I didn’t want to and I regret it. I took a settlement that covered my bike and about 2k for pain.

mstateglfr 

1- you claim bikes dont depreciatelike a car, but that isnt accurate. In retail shops, old models are discounted when new, just like cars. On the secondary market, used bikes sell for a lot less than new, just like cars.

2- your last question which you post to all is completely beside the point. You are attempting to insert emotion into the transaction. I also dont even understand the question because there is no one answer to it. How much the insurance company pays is obviously dependent on how much loss there was.
Citing the car's weight is a clear indicator that you are seeing this from an emotional perspective. The car's weight is irrelevant. If it weighed 500# less would that make a difference? Of course it wouldnt. But you cited weight to make it seem worse.



Insurance exists to compensate you for loss and to make that loss whole again.
You were riding a 3 year old stock bike with used clothing.
So if you disagree with their valuation of your equipment, then place a value on it, find ways to back that value up, and counter offer.


It's really quite simple- this is a negotiation. Negotiate until you view the offer as acceptable and enough to make you whole again. But you better have reasons and not just emotion.


I'll not that you still haven't said what you think your stuff is worth and why its worth that. You have only complained about the insurance company's initial offer.
A forum is hardly the place for this, but since the can is open, why not continue to pull out its contents?

soonerrebel

Mr Binky,


I'm glad you are ok but please follow this advice ...PLEASE!!

1. Stay off ALL forms of social media in regards to this incident.
2. If you are not satisfied with your attorney look for another one.

DaveLeeNC

www.bicyclebluebook.com would seem to me to be a rational place to look for a value basis WRT insurance claims. The value change due to differing timeframes and the value of whatever upgrades you had would be add-ons to that I would think.

dave

mstateglfr 

Why would a for profit website that historically has made wild ass guesses at value and has been brutally made fun of for how process dont represent local markets be a rational place to get info?
The site doesnt take into account frame size, time of year, or relative inventory in a local market. Those are critical points of consideration for valuing used bikes.

I wouldnt go close to that site if I were filing a claim.
If I were an insurance company, you bet i would try and use that website.

That should tell you something about the usefulness and value of bbb.

DaveLeeNC

If you don't like the answer - don't use it.

But this is a lot closer to the path that insurance companies are used to.

dave

ps. It is just wrong to think that you are going to get the $ required to find and replace your exact bike from the inventory in your area. Maybe you will get lucky and find it. But "I live in a place where used bikes are hard to find" as a justification for a higher payment - get real. As a justification for part of the 'inconvenience payment' (which I would expect to be part of the final settlement) is fair game.

DOS

Adding to my earlier post, any advice that OP start negotiation from anything but full retail replacement is bad advice. An insurance company offering you depreciated market value of your totaled car or what have you when you are the customer is not the same thing as liability for someone elses loss. They do not want to be sued and they want these things cleared up fast. You may not get every penny but start from a position of strength and get them to negotiate down.

Also, since op was injured, he is entitled for compensation for any costs, including car mileage and time to get to PT, for that. Estimate those and add to the bill.

MrBinky

Thx for feedback folks. It’s good to hear your experiences and points of view. As always stay safe out there and enjoy the ride!