Spring Water

Literal is for people that can't think outside of the box and lack creativity. Literal exists in a court, it also exists outside of a court room but unlike a court room there is also something called context out here in the real world.

I may punch a guy in the face for telling me that my mamma is fat, but really i'm punching him because he's a ****** bag.

And since you're being a dweeb about the wikipedia link, here's some more reading. Next time correct my spelling and comma use as well.

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/jonath..._b_591660.html
https://www.nydailynews.com/topics/Jeff+Novitzky
https://blogs.bettor.com/Jeff-Novitzk...nemesis-a39962
https://topics.nytimes.com/topics/ref...zky/index.html
https://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/201...ong/index.html

Novitzky hunts and catches professional athletes that cheat. He'll use any means necessary, including fraud involving government money.

Tulex

And why do we care if athletes cheat?

Define cheat. By the rules, or in fairness? Which matters more?

Spring Water

Generally I don't, at least not enough to justify my government to interfere. However, Lance Armstrong has gained too much at the expense of too many while hiding behind a holier than thou attitude and a "I didn't cheat" stance. The real tragic part is the same reason people think he should be spared.

Someone in my life just passed away from lung cancer and her husband is having a very difficult time with this, then I see all the lance armstrong books he's reading and can't help but think what a lie it all is.


Without rules you don't have sport.

gsteinb

that's just one in a litany of reasons.

ravenmore

Thanks for agreeing with me on the literal issue and how it applies to the court. Also, I try to be a dweeb at least once a day so thanks for the opportunity to meet my quota.

Tulex

To me, it's only as important as a sport is to a person. Some people say set clear rules, and as long as you follow them, it's cool. I don't see it that way.

What hurts the sport more?

Shaun White having his own private halfpipe hidden in the mountains, or his competitor taking a banned substance to recover faster from an injury? Different people will have different answers to that. For me, Shaun followed the rules, but has an unfair advantage over the guy recovering, even with the banned substance.

Spring Water

You're missing the point. If Lance Armstrong goes to jail, it'll be because he's a doping cheat. His prison time will be because of financial fraud. That's what will literally be written on his court documents, but the reason is ultimately because he's a doping cheat.

Spring Water

Doping is ok because everyone is doing it.

Tulex

So, if doping wasn't banned, and was well known, would the sport die?

Spring Water

I don't know, but you'd probably have a lot of 3 eyed children walking around.

Don't confuse the tool of the body with the tool of the athlete. Sport is and has always been about the human body winning over another human body. That's why sports fans don't like substance abuse. It's one thing to have a half pipe in the mountains, it's another to swallow 30mg of Adderall an hour before your halfpipe run.

It's different to use a super-secret aerodynamic negative weight bike up a mountain than it is to take EPO.


If you can't distinguish the difference then I'd argue you've never really truly enjoyed the beauty of sport.

gsteinb

You can't have something illegal be well known. Why do you feel the need to couch your positions in imaginary realties?

Spring Water

There is this too...

Tulex

You mean like pot?

gsteinb

And where is pot use encouraged and supported as part of a sport?

Spring Water

I don't know too many pot heads that light up a bong for the purpose (and with the result) of getting an edge over myself.

Tulex

You do realize that that sports does exactly this, creating imaginary realities? When batters caught up to pitchers, they raised the mound. When the scores got too low in BB, they added the shot clock. When QBs started getting hurt, they changed the rules to protect him. All of this to make the sport something other than what it could be.

It's where you decide to draw the line. And, the point is to make it legal, then known.

Tulex

That was my literal reply to not being able to have something illegal and well known.

gsteinb

You've clearly but inside too long. Crack a window or something.

Spring Water

The examples you listed are attempts by the businesses (of sport) to try and make their sport more compelling. They all worked, except for the QB thing, which if you listen to any sports radio station you'll hear plenty of fans complaining.

Your assumption is that if you make doping legal in cycling that cycling fans won't mind, I think you're wrong.

gsteinb

You're talking on one hand about something being encouraged and deemed 'acceptable' by a sports governing body that is illegal. To bolster your argument you bring up the usage of an illegal recreational herb which isn't deemed acceptable by any sports governing body.

Daytrip

In a bongathon, of course.

Tulex

Could be. My point is simply that sports draws lines and modifies those lines based on how it best suits the sport. That I don't think some things matter nearly as much as some people think, and that most of these things would work themselves out without outside interference. That tradition in sports is fabricated. I also believe that just as I should not HAVE to wear a seatbelt but choose to on my own, I should be able to take any drug I want, regardless of what it does to me, yet be able to choose not to.

The idea of it being important to go after the pros to stop the trickle down of these drugs to armatures and children, yet I can smoke and drink in front of my children, well, that's just moronic.

And if the government is truly doing all of this to get to Lance for what happened 10 years ago, and can't see that it's only important to them, well, that speaks clearly about them and what they think of others.

Tulex

No, I think the fans will regulate it. At some point, the money won't be there for dopers. You can either give the fans the sport you think they want, or let the fans choose the sport they want.

z90

I don't agree. This hit pretty close to home when I watched the tour with my seven year old and he became a big Contador fan. It was fun sharing the sport with him. It's not so fun trying to figure out how (or whether ) to explain to him what Clenbuterol is. I'm seriously contemplating not watching next year.

z90

I agree with you, springwater.