Dogmama

I have a three month old Madone 6.2 with Di2. I love it but not the bike shop. Having serious problems with their mechanics and now wondering if my bike could be compromised.

I've had rattling in my headset area, problems with installation of rim tape which caused flats (at 35MPH downhill) and recently the crank arm on my left pedal came off (they said a cotter pin wasn't installed - I later found out that cotter pins haven't been used in several decades.) Every time I take it in, I ask them to go over it & they say they did. What I get is a bike with new scratches & eventual problems. I'm having concerns about their initial assembly - especially if they tightened the frame bolts with the correct pressure. I wrote to Trek & they said the warranty dept. would be getting back to me, but nothing yet (it's only been a few days.)

So, here are my questions:

1. How much of the assembly is actually done in the bike shop? If the factory torqued the bolts down & did the major assembly, I would feel better. This is a Concept One store, so supposedly the mechanics have been trained but I really doubt it.

2. At three months old, if the bolts were torqued too tightly, would that have compromised the carbon fiber?

I'm really disappointed, having shelled out big bucks for a bike that I don't feel confident in riding over 30MPH.

Thanks for any & all advice!

I_like_cereal

CF depends on torqued bolts to hold things together. If your headset is rattling then either you have a bearing loose (doubtful because everyone is using sealed bearings) or it is not set correctly.

If things are torqued to tight CR will be weakened as I understand it and could/would crack. I do not ride CF for this reason. It is just too fiddley.

As far as what is assembled at the store. I would guess that a bike is shipped with the frame mostly put together. That is the BB and the headset pressed. The shop would be responsible for final assembly of the other bits.

There is always more than 1 trek store. Find another one to have your ride serviced. If you are going to ride carbon invest in a torque wrench. At least then if you have questions you can check it yourself.

mprelaw

You paid good money for that bike, so it's worth it to have it fixed right. This shop isn't doing it, so I would go to a trusted shop, regardless of what brands they sell. If it costs you a few bucks, it's worth it in the long run.

rhenning

I also wouldn't do a complaint on the internet but would be contacting Trek directly. You will be surprised how hard Trek will come down on the shop. You will get a lot of advice here but none of it will have the effect of direct contact with Trek. Roger

Bianchigirll 

How many miles do you have on your trek in 3 months? How often do you take it in for service?

I seriously doubt anything malicious is happening.

I only have one CF bike and it is not a trek but very little actually gets bolted to the CF frame. the BB bearing races and that is about it. Things can loosen up on a bike but proper torquing usually prevents this however your riding style could also cause things to loosen up. If your very physical (really hammering hard out of the gate, climbing and sprinting hard all the time) and hit lots of bumps and holes things can rattle loose.

If your dissatisfied with the service you have two options.

Find another trek dealer to sevice your machine but you may loose out on any free service benifits the selling shop offered (but frame and component warranty should not be affected)

Or talk directly to the owner. voice your concerns to him and ask if he can recomend a mechanic to work on your bike and only use him, but that may mean leaving the bike a day or two.

WickedThump

A scratched frame is unacceptable. In a shop environment that should not be happening. Eventual problems... well, bikes go through that.
Give Trek a chance to respond. I chose a Trek over several other makes with the same gear for the same money because Trek has a great reputation.
Also, I'll suggest finding a Madone specific forums. They would likely know all about Madone issues and what to do about them.

BikeWise1

My experiences as an independent Trek shop with two Trek Concept stores in driving distance is that the Concept stores don't seem to be run by bike guys, but rather businessmen who know little of what it takes to really do a bike right. I have seen more really shoddy assemblies and fits from Concept stores than other indie shops in the area. Trek makes sure they get all the bling stuff first. but that doesn't mean they know what to do with it or how to make it work.

Sorry you're having trouble with your Madone. They are fabulous machines. Do you have a small indie shop nearby that sells Trek? You might get the attention and expertise you want there rather at the Concept store.

mechBgon

In the case of a Di2 Madone 6.2, the majority of it is done in the bike shop, including torquing just about all the bolts that actually matter. But the rim tape would've been installed at the factory. Of your laundry list, the left crankarm falling off is the most concern. I imagine the assembler simply put the crank on and forgot to fasten it, with a torque wrench or otherwise, before moving on.

I work at a Trek dealership too. I don't see Trek's warranty department providing you any meaningful help here. They're not going to send a technician from Wisconson to your house to check the bike over. If you don't trust the store you bought from, ask around to find out which other local shops have a solid reputation dealing with high-end carbon.

mconlonx

I work in a Trek Concept shop with a bunch of other "bike people" who take pride in their work. Concept shops outside the Madison shops are Independent Dealers.

Your headset: when you say you hear a rattling, do you mean your headset is loosening up to the point that you have flex at the headset -- you're off your bike, you grab the front brake and try to rock it back and forth and you feel the bike move, with a click at the headset? Or, you're riding around, headset is tight, no handling issues and you hear rattling when going over bumps and the like?

With previous issues regarding Trek carbon steerer forks and issues working with carbon in general, I have a hard time believing the shop did not torque your headset/stem to spec. However, you are working with new technology and Di2 internal routing depends on zip ties around the wires to keep them from rattling around in the frame. Carbon frames are notorious for amplifying noise... Could just be the internal wiring needs a bit of futzing and maybe a few more zip ties to wedge it in place in the frame. If the fork is indeed losse, could be the carbon expansion plug used in place of a star nut to tension the bearings is slipping on assembly, but the shop should pick up on this.

Wheels come assembled, with tape, tubes, and tires installed. That was a factory issue. Did the shop charge you for the fix?

Crank falling off is an assembly issue on the part of the shop. The "cotter" the shop could be talking about is the safety tab in the slot at the end of the crank arm which should key into a matching hole on the crank spindle/axle. Sounds like they did not torque down the two bolts at the end of the crank.

Scratches on your bike while in for service is indeed a service issue...

Dogmama

Thanks for the replies! My main concern is if an overtightened bolt, 3 months old & ridden about 2,000 miles can compromise the frame.

This is my first CF bike, so I got the 6.2 because I am a little leery. Trek says this is their best CF. I do have a torque wrench but can't tell if things are too tight because the click sounds when it is tight enough - not when it's too tight - right? In any case, I'm not a mechanic & am definitely headed to another indie Trek shop. At this point, I really don't care if I have to pay to get another mechanic to go all the way through it (although I do think Trek should reimburse this...grrr...) But if I'm looking at CF possible failure, I'd like to know before I hit the mountains.

Regarding the headset - I weigh 120 pounds and stick to smooth roads. One of the reason I got CF is because I have arthritis in my hands & need the shock absorbing qualities. But, I'm still waiting for a CF stem that has "been on order" for over three months. The shop changed out the original CF stem, put in a regular metal stem to make sure it fit, then supposedly ordered the CF stem. There has been no rattling, so far, from the headset.

Talking to the owner is a joke. He's never there or "in a meeting." I'm dealing with the shop manager. Oddly enough he was more than available when I was making the decision to buy the bike.

Trek may have a good reputation but so far you can't prove it by me. I sent another email asking for a response. Pretty soon, I'll have to pick up the phone (gasp) but I prefer email so that I have a written record.

KevinF

Torque wrenches "click" when the pressure you are applying to the handle exceeds the torque the wrench is set at. i.e., if you're tightening a loose bolt, then it'll click when the bolt is properly tightened. If you're trying to test an already-tightened bolt, it won't tell you anything -- it'll just "click" immediately, before the bolt turns again.

mconlonx

Sounds like an independent shop problem, not a Trek problem...

MooCow

Find another shop, pronto. I've found service in bike shops to be pretty inconsistent. I've had poor results from bling-bling shops, and good service by selecting the right person even at a chain store. I try different mechanics and when I find one who stands out, I stick with him. The guy I'm using now is very detail-oriented, patient, and listens to my concerns. He takes pride in his work and mentally he is his own boss, in terms of deciding how to do the work and when it's done. I pretty much try to tell him he has a blank check and do whatever it takes to do the job the best way possible (he doesn't take advantage of this).

You need someone who knows how AND wants to take care of your machine properly. The eternally-absent bike shop owner is a red flag.

DiabloScott

Yeah I was thinking safety tab too - essentially it just makes sure the left arm is on correctly before you tighten down the clamp bolts. But "cotter pin"??? What kind of mechanic would use that term to describe anything on a modern crank? And the clamp bolts should be checked after a shakedown period but if the arm came loose he could've damaged the whole crank. This is scary bad.

FastJake

+1

This isn't Trek's fault, but rather the shop's fault.

I agree, some of the things the shop has said/done is downright scary. I'd do anything possible to return the bike and buy one from a different shop.

Otherwise, have a competent shop go over the bike and never go back to the place you bought the bike from again.

fietsbob

Maybe the shop is old school and not comfortable with the bikes on the cutting edge.

But responds to customer demands for the latest stuff anyhow..

Back 20+ years ago when Campagnolo came out with new stuff, they sent tech reps

to a major metropolitan area and ran a seminar, Paid for lunch,etc.

now they expect dealers to attend Interbike in Vegas,
to get up to speed with the engineers latest creations...

Dogmama

I agree it is basically a shop problem. But the shop is a Trek custom dealer - they sell only Treks. So, it is easy to extrapolate the problem to the entire line. They still owe me a CF stem and new stem cap (that they scratched up.) There is another indie shop that sells & services Treks. I've received good reports on one particular mechanic, so I'll be paying him a visit.
I got a message from a Trek representative, so I'll be reporting back.

NoTrail

Trek makes a good bike, but even the best bikes aren't very good if they aren't put together right.

If you have a favorite mechanic from another shop (even if they don't sell Trek) they should be able to work on the bike for you. I'd be real tempted to have a mechanic you trust go over the entire bike to check things like that. Might cost a little bit ... but it would be money well spent.

WickedThump

X2
There are known issues, and possible issues based on what's transpired. "I'm worried that it might..." is a legit concern, but there needs to be an inspection to reveal what actually needs to be corrected.

mconlonx

\

Why did you buy from the concept shop instead of the indy shop with the decent reputation...? If you're willing to extrapolate the problem to the entire line, how is a different shop going to help with the issues?

Get the stem from the shop where you ordered it but have the other shop do the install, ask for their opinion of initial assembly; or at this point, cancel the order and order it from the indy shop.

Dogmama

I didn't mean to suggest that the entire Trek line is bad. They build some great bikes.

I bought from a concept shop because I had decided to buy a Madone & thought the concept shop would be the best place, since they specialize in the brand.

BikeWise1

I understand the logic, but it's not sound. In many cases, a smaller shop has more to lose by not doing things right than a big concept store where you might be the 4th (yawn) Madone buyer of the day....

And who the heck talked you into a carbon stem for its supposed shock absorbing properties? CF stems are stiffer! If you have the RXL (Race X Lite) you already have the preferred stem. 5 psi less in your tires and some nice Lizard Skin bar tape and you'll be all set.

ultraman6970

If you are in DC metro area, bring me the bike i'll take a look to it and teach you how to fix the usual stuff.