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Gravel Tire Comparison/Recommendation/Advice?

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Gravel Tire Comparison/Recommendation/Advice?

Old 01-08-20, 11:20 PM
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samuraiben
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Gravel Tire Comparison/Recommendation/Advice?

Hello Everyone,


A couple months ago I got my first bike - a 2019 aluminum diverge. It comes with 30mm slicks, and I want wider tires. Online it says my frame has a clearance for 38mm (but it looks like I could go a little more, especially in the front, but I'm new and don't really know anything). I'm trying to decide which gravel tires to get. I've narrowed down my options, and am looking for a comparison. I realize these are fairly different tires, but I'm mostly trying to decide between:

- Specialized Trigger Pros (38mm) (though I've heard they run quite narrow)
- Schwalbe G One Allround (38mm)

Can any experienced riders tell me a little bit about how these will handle differently for me? What should be my deciding factors?

Some context:
- I'm new to cycling and just do it casually, for the enjoyment of being outside and for some exercise.
- Where I live there is a LOT of rain (though I mostly ride on sunnier days) and SO MANY HILLS. Hills everywhere, and I'll be riding them.
- I'm not riding tubeless. I know it's better, yada yada, and maybe I'll change my mind later, but riders in my area aren't and don't recommend it. I'm not morally against it or anything, but don't try to convince me.
- I will be riding probably 80/20 mostly roads, with some forest trail and gravel roads
- Even though I will probably stay on mostly roads, I really really have enjoyed the trails and could definitely see myself moving more towards 50/50 in the future.
- As I'm not into racing, I'm not all about speed. I understand that there are trade offs, and I don't want to struggle on the pavement (especially on those hills) but I'm new and not sure how much I'll notice a little trade off in that department. My philosophy in looking for these new tires is kind of "get a little more traction that I need, just to be safe." I'd rather be slightly slower and slightly more confident. But being new, I'm not sure how much I should really be giving stock to this philosophy as I will still probably ride mostly pavement.


Of note - I'm also considering, (but much less so) these tires:
- Panaracer Gravelkings SK+. I have heard they are awesome and they look cool. The new "+" is supposed to help with previous problems with punctures, but I've heard they might throw pebbles at my frame and ride a little sluggish. I don't know.
- Specialized Trigger Sport (NOT PRO) - I'm not sure how much the Endurant Casing and GRIPTON rubber that the pro has will help, but perhaps I'm wrong it it's essential. The main reasons I'm considering these alongside the Trigger Pro is that
1. They're cheaper.
2. These come in size 42mm, which the Trigger Pro does not. My bike frame says 38, but I've read that Triggers runs up to 2mm narrow, and I'm interested in 38-40ish instead of 36.


Thanks!

P.S. Sorry if this post is too long or I gave too much info.
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Old 01-09-20, 08:15 AM
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- Get tires that for sure fit your bike. There is no benefit to having tires that fit, but only 2mm of clearance and end up sandpapering your chainstays due to grit that inevitably gets picked up when riding, even if the road is dry.
- Tubeless has less rolling resistance, but if you don’t often get flats, there just isn’t any benefit to the maintenance of tubeless for a beginner rider. A tube can be used for years and years without any maintenance, compared to the periodic management of tubeless sealant. Simpler is often better for new cyclists. You not wanting to mess with tubeless right now is understandable.
- Since you ride when its dry, keep in mind that tread is of minimal benefit. It can help a bit when the dry road has a loose dust covering, for example, but a smooth tire will work perfectly fine for a new rider in dry gravel conditions. This could mean lower rolling resistance for you(faster riding/less effort), especially since 80% of your riding will be on pavement to begin.

Tires are consumable and meant to be changed, so this first(new) set of tires can help you decide what you want in your next set. If you get 38mm slicks and find them to be good overall, then great. If you like the 38mm slicks for all instances but gravel because your tire loses traction on climbs(for example), then you now know what to look for in your next tire.

Personally- I would not go wider than what your frame can handle. Measure the chainstays where the tire is and subtract 10mm from that width. This is the largest tire size I would get if I were you. You need to also make sure there is the same clearance between the new tire and the chainstay bridge as well as between the new tire and the seat tube. 6mm on each side is what companies are supposed to account for, and you will have 5mm on each side. If you want something wider, you have the wrong bike.

As for the specific tires- .
- Schwalbe does an insane thing and offers multiple tires in each model. There are 5 types of G One Allround tires. Or if you look further into the details, they offer 4 G One Allround tires in 38mm size. Which are you looking to buy? https://www.schwalbetires.com/bike_tires/g-one-allround
- I know almost nothing about Specialized tires because I don’t buy Specialized products. This review has them at 3mm narrower than claimed when mounted to a pretty typical width rim on stock bikes. That’s narrow and would be an issue for me. https://www.cxmagazine.com/specializ...ss-tire-review
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Old 01-09-20, 08:59 AM
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Sounds like you would be good with some slicks or the Schwalbe G One Allround you mentioned. The G One rolls pretty well on all surfaces and 38mm is good size to start with. Have fun!
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Old 01-09-20, 09:06 AM
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I can speak to the Specialized tires - don't even think about the Trigger Sport, the Pro version is worth it. They don't run small on my wide-ish rims. They might run true to 38mm on narrower rims. I don't know why people are saying they run 36mm, that's not been my experience. For your riding conditions I would recommend the Pathfinder Pros instead, with their flat center strip. You'll definitely notice the difference between a 30mm road tire and a 38mm gravel tire on the pavement.
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Old 01-09-20, 10:58 AM
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Originally Posted by samuraiben
Of note - I'm also considering, (but much less so) these tires:
- Panaracer Gravelkings SK+. I have heard they are awesome and they look cool. The new "+" is supposed to help with previous problems with punctures, but I've heard they might throw pebbles at my frame and ride a little sluggish.
GravelKing SKs do throw more pebble than most I think, but that's really just part of gravel riding - even slicks will throw pebbles to some extent. Best to protect the frame with clear tape if you're worried about that.

You can get regular GravelKing SK (not "+") for $30, and IMO that's a great deal and a good middle-ground starting point.
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Old 01-09-20, 11:49 AM
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Originally Posted by tyrion
GravelKing SKs do throw more pebble than most I think, but that's really just part of gravel riding - even slicks will throw pebbles to some extent. Best to protect the frame with clear tape if you're worried about that.
Sort of. The SKs are horrible for throwing pebbles. It's literally non-stop and 1 of 2 reasons I switched to Terreno Drys.
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Old 01-09-20, 01:29 PM
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I have the G-One all-arounds in 38mm on my gravel bike, and I'm running tubeless. My riding on them was probably about 80/20 road/dirt until I got a separate wheelset for road tires.

For your intended use, I'd recommend them, they roll pretty well on the road and I never had a problem keeping up on club road rides. They are good on fire roads and decent trails. I find that I can't climb hills over 22%, because with the gearing on my bike I need to stand up at that point, and then the back tire loses traction and spins. I've also gone through some spots of loose sand where I wished for a bit more aggressive tread, but these spots are few and far between.

Don't write off tubeless. I probably have 3,500 miles on my All Arounds, I've had a few punctures in both but I've never had to dismount the tires to fix them, nor stop riding due to a flat, the sealant has taken care of them.
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Old 01-09-20, 03:00 PM
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mstateglfr Thanks so much for the detailed response. And thanks for understanding why tubeless isn't worth it for me, at least for now. I'll make sure to keep to the tire width recommendation. I don't so much want a tire wider than 38 than I just don't want one that is SUPPOSED to be 38, but measures 36 or something. I figured maybe 39s were okay, but I'll take the advice. Oh, and I think I'm interested in the Microskin, TL Easy tires. Is this a good choice?

shoota My bike came with Axis Sport Disc wheels, which I think have an interior rim width of 21mm. That's good to hear they probably don't run as small as people say. Do you think that will hold true for 21mm rim interiors? As for the Pathfinders. I was seriously considering them (they do seem like exactly what I'm looking for), but I read multiple review where people said that the center strip is raised so much that it feels like you're about to fall off when you transition between that strip and the grip on the edges. So any leaning is out. As much as I would love what they are trying to do, I want confidence from my wider tires. Any experience with them though? Should I reconsider? I'm worried because my local bike shop doesn't have any for me to get a feel for them.

jimincalif I'm not opposed to tubeless, I just don't feel ready for them now. I will definitely look into them more as I keep riding. I don't know what percentage my hills are, just that there are a lot and they are a variety of steepness levels, some quite steep. Do you think your troubles with them had more to do with your gearing? I tend to stay in the saddle when climbing, but I definitely stand sometimes. Is this a drawback of the Schwalbes?

Thanks to everyone for the great feedback! Any other advice to help me decide?
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Old 01-09-20, 03:07 PM
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tyrion That price tag is tempting. What has been your experience with their speed on gravel? I've read they might be slow for their category, and have a hum or sound.
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Old 01-09-20, 03:27 PM
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Originally Posted by samuraiben
tyrion That price tag is tempting. What has been your experience with their speed on gravel? I've read they might be slow for their category, and have a hum or sound.
I can't really comment on speed - my subjective guessing wouldn't be useful. Plus I'm running 50mm ones, different than your potential 38s. They do hum on pavement, and that means wasted energy.

I was thinking: start with this all-around inexpensive tire to help you figure out what you really want. Maybe you want bigger knobs, maybe something smoother, maybe something lighter, maybe something stronger. It takes some trial and error to figure out what really works for you.
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Old 01-09-20, 05:22 PM
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Originally Posted by samuraiben
jimincalif I'm not opposed to tubeless, I just don't feel ready for them now. I will definitely look into them more as I keep riding. I don't know what percentage my hills are, just that there are a lot and they are a variety of steepness levels, some quite steep. Do you think your troubles with them had more to do with your gearing? I tend to stay in the saddle when climbing, but I definitely stand sometimes. Is this a drawback of the Schwalbes?
My low gear is 1:1 (34/34), it's a gravel bike, not a mountain bike, so doesn't have super low gearing. On a bike with lower gearing, yes I could stay seated on steeper climbs and keep weight on the back tire.

I wouldn't call it a drawback of the Schwalbes, it's a trade-off. The dot-style tread works well for the intended use - "All Around". They are a compromise, they roll better on the road than a knobby tire, but will have less traction off-road than one with a big aggressive tread. For your intended 80/20 use, IMO they would be a good match. Worst case you walk and push in a spot the tires can't handle. If your off-road use is 20%, and you have to walk 1% of the 20%, that's 0.2% of your total distance. A lot better than pushing a big knarly tread on pavement 80% of the time.
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Old 01-09-20, 06:56 PM
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Originally Posted by jimincalif
My low gear is 1:1 (34/34), it's a gravel bike, not a mountain bike, so doesn't have super low gearing.
I don't see why it "not being a mountain bike" ought to have anything to do with how you gear it. If you have use for lower gears, you have use for lower gears.
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Old 01-09-20, 07:11 PM
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I have two sets of the pathfinder pro. 700x38 and 650x47. I do not notice the center when transitioning into a lean. They seem like a good all round tire. I ride blacktop and limestone mostly.
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Old 01-10-20, 10:53 AM
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I have those tires. They are pretty similar - don't think you would notice much of a difference. The Schwalbe's are pretty quality tire though - good ride, excellent traction (as appropriate), very low rolling resistance. Dang impressive in the snow.
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Old 01-10-20, 06:24 PM
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Originally Posted by chas58
I have those tires. They are pretty similar - don't think you would notice much of a difference. The Schwalbe's are pretty quality tire though - good ride, excellent traction (as appropriate), very low rolling resistance. Dang impressive in the snow.
Just to be clear, you have both the triggers and the g-ones? Interesting that there might not be much of a difference between them as they look pretty different to me, but I don’t really know. If they are similar, I might just go with the triggers because they are cheaper. That, and the philosophy to have slightly more tread than I need.
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Old 01-11-20, 12:04 PM
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I had some time so I measured the Trigger Pros for you.


They’d be right at 38-39mm on your 21mm ID rims. Once you get to this point I seriously doubt you’ll notice a difference of 1-3mm. The tire tread itself will matter way more than the width.
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Old 01-11-20, 01:20 PM
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Give a look at the Ritchey Alpine JB. The non-tubeless is competitively priced, and they work far better than I had anticipated when off-road. On pavement, they behave like a slick.
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Old 01-11-20, 07:52 PM
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Or wait for the 35mm Terreno Drys to come out.
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Old 01-11-20, 07:59 PM
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The 700x35 Terrno Dry is already out (I have one mounted) and it's wildly unimpressive. The 35 mounts to about 37 on a 19mm interna wheel, and rolls like it's about 5mm wider with much bigger knobs. It's a good looking tire and I had high hopes, but it rolls slow.

The Terreno Zero is the least true-to-size tire I've ever encountered. The 700x35 mounts to just over 40mm wide. I wouldn't recommend the Zero or the Dry, they both have to be run 5-10psi higher than a comparable tire or they just wallow everywhere.

Mind you, my experience is only with them mounted tubeless-- but I can't imagine that adding a tube would make them any better.
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Old 01-12-20, 05:52 AM
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Also see: https://www.bikeforums.net/cyclocros...vel-tires.html
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Old 01-12-20, 11:01 AM
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Originally Posted by DrIsotope
The 700x35 Terrno Dry is already out (I have one mounted) and it's wildly unimpressive. The 35 mounts to about 37 on a 19mm interna wheel, and rolls like it's about 5mm wider with much bigger knobs. It's a good looking tire and I had high hopes, but it rolls slow.

The Terreno Zero is the least true-to-size tire I've ever encountered. The 700x35 mounts to just over 40mm wide. I wouldn't recommend the Zero or the Dry, they both have to be run 5-10psi higher than a comparable tire or they just wallow everywhere.

Mind you, my experience is only with them mounted tubeless-- but I can't imagine that adding a tube would make them any better.
Have you ridden other sized Terreno Drys before? I'm not going to lie, I'm shocked at your review. The Dry is one of the better tires I've used so I was pretty pumped to see a 35mm width.

Also, where are you finding them for sale? I haven't seen any.
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Old 01-12-20, 11:10 AM
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Originally Posted by DrIsotope
Give a look at the Ritchey Alpine JB. The non-tubeless is competitively priced, and they work far better than I had anticipated when off-road. On pavement, they behave like a slick.
Have you tried the 35mm tubeless version? I'm curious what those measure when mounted on a wide gravel rim. Thanks for the heads up on these, I hadn't seen them before.
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Old 01-12-20, 11:12 AM
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My mistake, it's apparently the Terreno Dry 700x33. I was fooled because it mounted to 37. Vittoria does not know how to spec a tire width. The "700x35" Zero is also a really, really tall tire, which I think could explain some of the wallowiness.

Originally Posted by shoota
Have you tried the 35mm tubeless version? I'm curious what those measure when mounted on a wide gravel rim. Thanks for the heads up on these, I hadn't seen them before.
I'm running the tubeless right now-- which purchasing was an ordeal, as sellers are frequently listing the TLR and normal versions as the same tire. The skinwall is tubed, the blackwall is TLR. I don't even know how I stumbled across them initially, but they've been very good so far. No report on longevity yet, I'm still under 1k miles.
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Old 01-12-20, 11:27 AM
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I'll recommend the Hutchinson Override 700x38

Size: 700x38, about 39mm wide, about 400 grams each.
Tread pattern: minimal file tread pattern in the center, progressively larger file tread on the shoulder.
Construction: 127 tpi, flat protection included, tubeless
Performance on pavement is excellent, like most road bike tires
Performance on firm gravel is excellent with very good cornering grip on a hardpacked fine gravel
Performance on deep or soft gravel is acceptable, float and traction is sufficient due to the wide footprint and supple construction.
Durability: good so far
Ride: super smooth and plush

The tire was eventually easy to install tubeless with a standard floor pump. I did pre-fit the tire using a tube and let it take shape at 80psi for 48 hours. This allowed the tire to seat quickly and hold air with 30 ml of sealant.

The Hutchinson Override is lightweight and very fast rolling. The Override helped me nearly produce the same kind of speeds I experience on my road bike on pavement with 700x25 Rubino Pro tires. Performance on a wide range of dry surfaces is excellent. Firm gravel, dry grass, dry single-track are all traveled with speed and confidence. Soft and rutted single-lane gravel roads require focus and skill, but can be covered quickly with sufficient traction. Wet gravel and pavement are acceptably easy to travel if the rider avoids any excessive banking during turns. I avoid wet earth and grass, it's not the right tire for those conditions.

PS;
I've covered more miles and completed the 50 miles Cuba Gravel Crisis with the Override. I continue to be highly impressed with the tire. Traction, durability, reliability all continue to remain at a high level. I'm unable to break the rear tire loose on soft sandy trails, unless it's a very steep climb and I stand while mashing the pedals. Simply sitting on the saddle re-establishes traction. The front tire also maintains traction well on flatter routes. However, I'll install a knobby tire, like the WTB Riddler, on the front if I expect faster downhill sections that require urgent braking and cornering. No need to remove the Override from the rear. It rolls fast with a surplus of traction.
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Old 01-12-20, 11:32 AM
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Originally Posted by DrIsotope
My mistake, it's apparently the Terreno Dry 700x33. I was fooled because it mounted to 37. Vittoria does not know how to spec a tire width. The "700x35" Zero is also a really, really tall tire, which I think could explain some of the wallowiness.
Ok that makes way more sense. I think the 35mm Dry is going to be an awesome tire.
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