New low rolling resistant Airless tires
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New low rolling resistant Airless tires
Thank's to Bridgestone's sponsorship, their new low rolling resistant Airless tires to be used at this summer's Olympics. Would be interesting if this really worked - although with a design like that I wonder how they handle, or how they might work on an ebike.
Bridgestone says these tires have tested to be equally as efficient at rolling resistance as its current Ecopia low-rolling resistance tires.
more: https://jalopnik.com/bridgestone-say...cyc-1841140591
Bridgestone says these tires have tested to be equally as efficient at rolling resistance as its current Ecopia low-rolling resistance tires.
more: https://jalopnik.com/bridgestone-say...cyc-1841140591
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A) what olympic sport is bridgestone going to be supplying to? Or is it just going to be showcased?
B) Bridgestone doesn’t make bike tires. So I’m assuming that these airless automotive tires are “as efficient” as their automotive Ecopia tire. That’s much less difficult considering the insane amount of reinforcement car tires need to not get absolutely shredded by roads and debris. I can’t imagine these will come close to even a gatorskin tire in terms of RR. I’d be overjoyed to be proven wrong.
C) they claim equal cornering grip, which I believe - that’s 100% down to the compound. What I don’t see is how their tire will be able to flex isometrically (am I using that word right?) when cornering. You’d be surprised how hard some commuters whip their bikes. If the tire loses all compliance and essentially becomes a solid rubber tire when cornering, I could foresee this being an issue.
D) Air has the advantage of being infinitely flexible. How much your tire conforms to the road surface is determined heavily by the tire TPI. The higher the TPI, the more the tire can “dig” into crevices for grip. It seems like the airless tire can easily handle macro bumps, but will simply glide over smaller bumps. Equal grip on a smooth surface, sure. Rough surface like chipseal? I’m not convinced.
That being said, air is enough of a PITA that I’d like to see this everywhere that performance isn’t as much of an issue.
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smashndash Bicycle wheels generally only receive a radial load (at right angle to the axle). In fact, spoked bicycle wheels cannot withstand any significant side loading. I am doubtful that these tires will perform as well as pneumatic tires, but I don't see the built-in flex not responding to cornering forces.
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Remember that the Bridgestone Ecopia is a car tire so it will have far more rolling resistance than the worst conventional bicycle tire you could think of.
Consider me unimpressed.
Consider me unimpressed.
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#5
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Just think-- Michelin has been working on the "tweel" since at least 2005 (probably well before) and it's still only suitable for low speed, high load operations like tractors (or lunar rovers.)
If Bridgestone's version has managed to incorporate better compliance without insane weight, I can see it for e-Bike applications where much of the power doesn't come from the rider, or perhaps share bikes, where fleet maintenance is a real issue.
But for the rest of us, the pneumatic tire is up at the top of the best inventions of... ever. We're stuck with it.
If Bridgestone's version has managed to incorporate better compliance without insane weight, I can see it for e-Bike applications where much of the power doesn't come from the rider, or perhaps share bikes, where fleet maintenance is a real issue.
But for the rest of us, the pneumatic tire is up at the top of the best inventions of... ever. We're stuck with it.
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Mostly those wavy gravy spokes.
When they come out with a fat (42+mm), soft, comfy tire that rolls over bumps with nary a jostle to the rider, and has better rolling resistance that a 25mm pneumatic @110psi - then they will have a product that gets attention. That's the trend - fat soft comfy fast and new like old.
Didn't airless tires originally go out of fashion with horseless carriages and the icebox?
When they come out with a fat (42+mm), soft, comfy tire that rolls over bumps with nary a jostle to the rider, and has better rolling resistance that a 25mm pneumatic @110psi - then they will have a product that gets attention. That's the trend - fat soft comfy fast and new like old.
Didn't airless tires originally go out of fashion with horseless carriages and the icebox?
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smashndash Bicycle wheels generally only receive a radial load (at right angle to the axle). In fact, spoked bicycle wheels cannot withstand any significant side loading. I am doubtful that these tires will perform as well as pneumatic tires, but I don't see the built-in flex not responding to cornering forces.
For example, try poking at the corner of your tire tread cap. The tire will perfectly deform around your finger. Will an airless tire do the same?
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Didn't airless tires originally go out of fashion with horseless carriages and the icebox?
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Don't "airless" tires pop up every few years in some new incarnation?
Isn't this like oval chainrings?
I think the industry is going the opposite way - with tubeless tech getting better and better, the need for creative responses to flats is becoming less and less important.
Am I being to skeptical/cyinical?
Isn't this like oval chainrings?
I think the industry is going the opposite way - with tubeless tech getting better and better, the need for creative responses to flats is becoming less and less important.
Am I being to skeptical/cyinical?
#12
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So many questions.
A) what olympic sport is bridgestone going to be supplying to? Or is it just going to be showcased?
B) Bridgestone doesn’t make bike tires. So I’m assuming that these airless automotive tires are “as efficient” as their automotive Ecopia tire. That’s much less difficult considering the insane amount of reinforcement car tires need to not get absolutely shredded by roads and debris. I can’t imagine these will come close to even a gatorskin tire in terms of RR. I’d be overjoyed to be proven wrong.
C) they claim equal cornering grip, which I believe - that’s 100% down to the compound. What I don’t see is how their tire will be able to flex isometrically (am I using that word right?) when cornering. You’d be surprised how hard some commuters whip their bikes. If the tire loses all compliance and essentially becomes a solid rubber tire when cornering, I could foresee this being an issue.
D) Air has the advantage of being infinitely flexible. How much your tire conforms to the road surface is determined heavily by the tire TPI. The higher the TPI, the more the tire can “dig” into crevices for grip. It seems like the airless tire can easily handle macro bumps, but will simply glide over smaller bumps. Equal grip on a smooth surface, sure. Rough surface like chipseal? I’m not convinced.
That being said, air is enough of a PITA that I’d like to see this everywhere that performance isn’t as much of an issue.
A) what olympic sport is bridgestone going to be supplying to? Or is it just going to be showcased?
B) Bridgestone doesn’t make bike tires. So I’m assuming that these airless automotive tires are “as efficient” as their automotive Ecopia tire. That’s much less difficult considering the insane amount of reinforcement car tires need to not get absolutely shredded by roads and debris. I can’t imagine these will come close to even a gatorskin tire in terms of RR. I’d be overjoyed to be proven wrong.
C) they claim equal cornering grip, which I believe - that’s 100% down to the compound. What I don’t see is how their tire will be able to flex isometrically (am I using that word right?) when cornering. You’d be surprised how hard some commuters whip their bikes. If the tire loses all compliance and essentially becomes a solid rubber tire when cornering, I could foresee this being an issue.
D) Air has the advantage of being infinitely flexible. How much your tire conforms to the road surface is determined heavily by the tire TPI. The higher the TPI, the more the tire can “dig” into crevices for grip. It seems like the airless tire can easily handle macro bumps, but will simply glide over smaller bumps. Equal grip on a smooth surface, sure. Rough surface like chipseal? I’m not convinced.
That being said, air is enough of a PITA that I’d like to see this everywhere that performance isn’t as much of an issue.
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What are you talking about there, sonny? My Icebox is just great it will keep a whole head of a cabbage fresh for 4 hours as long as the ice boy is on time and with these new horseless carriages I can get to the market in half the time 6 hours instead of 12 it's a goldern miracle. That rat Dunlop is just trying to kill us all with his exploding tires of doom. Well I gotta go fire up the Victrola and play that new Bix Beiderbecke recording, 23 skidoo!
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I guess it must be an engineering impossibility to design a traditional tubeless tire with an integrated latex or butyl inner layer. Sadly, we can put a man on the moon and condense the entire library of Congress to a microchip, but we just can’t find our way to a practical tubeless bicycle tire.
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No one's put a man on the moon in forty eight years... about the same year as the US bike boom. It's rapidly approaching icebox status.
I can see the attraction of this thing for the manufacturer. A spoked wheel has nearly a hundred parts of a dozen different materials that (unlike chain) must be assembled by hand before going into a very expensive robot for tension and true.
I can see the attraction of this thing for the manufacturer. A spoked wheel has nearly a hundred parts of a dozen different materials that (unlike chain) must be assembled by hand before going into a very expensive robot for tension and true.
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I guess it must be an engineering impossibility to design a traditional tubeless tire with an integrated latex or butyl inner layer. Sadly, we can put a man on the moon and condense the entire library of Congress to a microchip, but we just can’t find our way to a practical tubeless bicycle tire.
-Kedosto
-Kedosto
But I can see this happening in the trucking industry where longevity and reliability are more important than performance.
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Don't "airless" tires pop up every few years in some new incarnation?
Isn't this like oval chainrings?
I think the industry is going the opposite way - with tubeless tech getting better and better, the need for creative responses to flats is becoming less and less important.
Am I being to skeptical/cyinical?
Isn't this like oval chainrings?
I think the industry is going the opposite way - with tubeless tech getting better and better, the need for creative responses to flats is becoming less and less important.
Am I being to skeptical/cyinical?
But yeah, every year that they keep working on airless tires, pneumatic tires get more flat resistant.