Machka 

He's right ... they can.

ogmtb

Using that "logic" - handlebars, quick release levers, brake levers, ball point pens, butter knives and screw drivers can also pose "serious physical injury risk."

It's very funny, in a ridiculous kind of way.

Bob Ross

Y'know how I know you've never owned a bike that came with hydraulic disc brakes that weren't perfectly adjusted at the time of purchase?

wphamilton

Depends on what he means by that.

Read it as: (serious physical injury) risk , it's true. Cutting your leg on that spinning disk could be a serious injury. "Serious" applies to "physical injury"

Read it as: serious (physical injury risk), debatable. It doesn't happen that often so it depends on how seriously you take it. "Serious" applies to the risk.

Phil_gretz

^this. 100%. Although Giant has some better values. I'd rather extract my own teeth than talk with a Trek or Specialized dealer. But that's just me...

bruce19

I have no idea what YOU need. But, I have two rim brake bikes and one mechanical disc brake bike. Disc brakes are better. As has been said, it's not about age.

Ogsarg

If you're buying a new bike, why not give the new technology a try? Not wanting disc brakes or a frame suspension system doesn't make you old, but refusing to even try it might.

350htrr

Because, I have managed to get across in my posts that I just love my hydraulic disk brakes, and would not even consider any another type, or lower quality than I have...???

Biker395 

For me it's because it would be incompatible with all of my other bikes.

I tried mechanical discs when they first came out, and they were definitely a PITA to deal with. Hard to adjust, the pads wore quickly, were hard to replace, and weren't interchangeable. I had a rack on the back of the bike (an MTB) and had to get a special rack to clear the rear caliper. Discs are already a greater PITA to reinstall the rear wheel, but with the added difficulty of that rack (the rear attachment point was the axle, so you had to align the wheel, the disc in the caliper, and the rack in the dropouts at the same time), it was much worse.

For all those reasons, I was not impressed, and I wished I had just gone with v-brakes.

I'm not against trying them again, perhaps even hydraulics ... but I'm not aching to do so.

KraneXL

On the other hand, everything that's more advanced is also more complicated. Try considering functionality first before complexity or repair.

Biker395 

Can't say I agree with that. Sometimes, advancement is a matter of new materials allowing construction to be simplified, not made more complex. And not all technical "innovations" are about better functionality. Sometimes, they are all about consolidating product offerings, and are sold under the guise of an improvement using the Emperor's new clothes marketing strategies.

The real advantage of electronic shifting? That they'll be able to introduce more speeds with only a software change.
The real reason triples are being phased out? They don't like building and supporting two separate product offerings.
The real reason disc brakes are being pushed? Because they have definite advantages with MTBs, and e-bikes, and they don't want to be spending money to develop and support multiple system types.

VHS was actually inferior to Betamax. It prevailed because it had more companies behind it (as they didn't want to pay Sony's licensing fees). Rear entry boots were heralded as the latest improvement in ski boots to the point where it was hard to find anything else. They later completely disappeared. I know this stuff ... it's my business to know it.

I see the advantages of discs for people who ride a lot in the rain, weigh more than average, or ride tandems. There are also advantages for someone like myself that does not ride in the rain, weighs an average amount and doesn't ride tandems. but for me at least, they aren't enough to justify the more difficult maintenance and complexity (which I do myself). So for me, disc brakes are a "meh" at best. Neither a plus or a minus in terms of a purchase decision. It would be different if I rode in different circumstances.

350htrr

Cost, VHS was crap, & still Is crap, but cost won out...

Cost, that is about the ONLY REAL, factor, why hydraulics are failing to gain ground in all the different bicycling types of bicycles, &... Companies Intentionally have been being dumbing it down to make it more "affordable" Like cable actuated, like vegetable oils used instead of DOT3 brake fluid, and the system freezes or boils under normal use... Like cheap hydraulic lines and fittings that end up leaking.. and so on and so on...

SHBR

The OP bought a bike.

/end thread

I don't quite understand the need for motor vehicle style brakes on a bicycle.

I'm sure someone has built an antilock and anti-endo braking system for those that haven't figured out how to stop.

The masses will buy this *cough* new technology in droves, for safety reasons of course.

Biker395 

Betamax was no more expensive to produce than VHS.

Hydraulic brakes were adopted in autos because hydraulic multiplication permitted more force to be applied to the braking surfaces. That's not relevant for most bicycle applications ... certainly not mine.

It's pointless to argue, really. There are people ... and I'm one of them ... for which discs don't provide enough advantages to offset their disadvantages and make a switch. Its not because I'm afraid or ignorant of them ... its because for me, they offer a solution to problems I don't have at the cost of greater complexity and cost, and less interchangeability with the bikes I already own.

If they work for you, that's great.

Planemaker

Personally, any future bike I will purchase will have hydraulic brakes.

When I want to stop fast I can
Thru axel makes changing lining wheels up easy

LesG

20+ years ago I used to ride bikes a lot then I got out of it for various reasons. Then several circumstances this year came together and I ended up buying a Trek DS3 about 5 months ago... got about 700 miles on it now. Being away from biking for so long I consider myself a newbie, although one with past experience. With that in mind here's my 2C worth about the entry level hydraulic brakes on the DS3... remember, you get what you pay for.

When researching to buy a bike, I shied away from hydraulic brakes. I had visions of plastic brake hose lines or compression fittings leaking or even the calipers themselves leaking and with those things the accompanying loss of brakes. That and I didn't have a clue about how to fix them or even replace the pads when that time would come. Well, here it is 5 months and 700 miles later and my opinion has changed. Do I have to have hydraulic brakes? Nope rim brakes work just fine. I now simply prefer and want to have hydraulic disc. There are a couple of minor downsides but on balance I really like them.

I really like and appreciate the nice one finger smooth stopping. I've had zero leak issues. Replacing the pads can be done in less than ten minutes (I haven't replaced them but I have taken them out, more about that later). I bought a bleeder kit to have on hand and bleeding them, if ever needed would be another 10 minute job if that much. We (wife has a DS3 also) haul the bikes to Rail trails inside the back of our CR-V with the bikes standing up on a fork mount hitch thing. The front wheels, of course, need to come off. With the quick release wheels, you just slide the wheel out without the need to release the rim brake so it will open up and slide over the tire (our tires are 38 wide). I do slip a spacer into the caliper (takes 2 seconds) just in case I might bump the brake lever and close the pads but even if I did a tire tool / flat screwdriver will spread them back apart. In terms of time saved, that's probably a wash compared to rim brakes because releasing the rim brakes takes almost zero time also. Hydraulic brakes aren't all that complicated as some think. In the simplest terms you pull the brake lever(s) which increases the fluid pressure in the caliper which in turn pushes the disc pads together against the rotors and you stop/slow down. The hydraulic brakes on our bikes are entry level Tektro (even though Trek's website say they should be Shimano). With the Tektros there is no recommendation to change the hydraulic fluid at a specific interval but I'll probably do that anyway just for peace of mind. So any kind of regular maintenance is minimal.

The things, so far, that I don't like aren't a big deal. When I first got the bike those brakes really squealed all the time and loudly... annoying like fingernails on a chalk board. That's when I removed the pads, and lightly sanded them thinking that would help... it didn't. Then I read somewhere (and later verified by the Trek mechanic) that sometimes you need to go out and seat the pads. Basically get the bike up to speed and ram on the brakes. Do that about a dozen times. Yep, that worked and I've never have had another squeak. Anyway, taking out the pads to lightly sand them is when I learned that replacing the pads is less than a 10 minute job. The other minor dislike is every once in awhile when we get to our Rail trail and reinstall and tighten the front wheel, the pads may endup a few thousands out of alignment with the rotor and so one of the pads is just touching the rotor. Not enough to not allow the wheel to spin but enough to slightly slow it down. The fix is fast and simple. You simply loosen the two mounting screws for the caliper, pull the brake lever in like you're applying the brakes (which you are!) and while holding the lever, tighten the 2 mounting screws back up... takes about as long to explain it as it does to actually do it. After that the pads are back in alignment with the rotor (and not touching it) and are where they should be.

Bottom line and as already stated, on balance I really like them. Again, rim brakes will stop you or slow you down and will get that job done. I simply better like the way hydraulic disc brakes do that. I can't comment on mechanical disc brakes other than I suspect nice smooth one finger stopping power probably isn't there. I'm looking to buy another bike in the next several months and hydraulic brakes are one of the things I want on it.

grahamtillotson

A lengthy thread indeed! Will it ever stop or slow down? OK, ok, just couldn't resist the easy target.

For me the interesting part is having a match of the brakes to the bike (without letting great be the enemy of good). Two recent builds -- I took an old Raleigh Robin Hood and built out 700c wheels with a Sturmey Archer 3-speed coaster brake hub on the back and a Shimano short pull brake on the front. Works great as a commuter bike and no issues with weather. After that I built out a touring bike on an old Trek 850 frame, and it has Mavic alloy rims with the original v-brakes and Kool Stop pads (which are fantastic). No trouble braking, even if it is wet. The only place I draw the line is steel rims in the rain -- lots of better ways to exit this life than that.

Graham

LesG

I'm not helping with that! As a relative newbie here I should have warned everyone about a recurring condition I have. Diarrhea of the mouth. There's only one cure and, unfortunately for you all, it often involves a lengthy post.

KraneXL

You're in the right place.

Biker395 

No doubt about that. There are a litany of topics that bring it on.

disc brakes
compact doubles/triples
e-Bikes
electronic shifting
carbon/aluminum/steel
campy/shimano/sram
helmets
bike lanes
rear view mirrors
...

This is where being old and crotchety becomes a way of life. Believe me ... I am a living example.

PS: Confession time ... riding to work yesterday in the fog and sand, I was just thinking that disc brakes might make sense on the commuting bike.

rossiny

Boy lot of great reading and info here.! I am looking to get a touring bike.. now throughly confused ..hehehe.. I have a vintage touring bike bought for peanuts and has been barely used , a Schwinn Voyageur, with tange tubing that needs an over haul and possibly new tires or should I just go new bike with disc brakes and get say a titanium or steel frame with newer discs brakes or old school rim brakes.. I am having analysis paralysis...hehe..lol..

BlazingPedals

Definitely try both types of brakes before buying. Although that advice could be applied to trying different types of bikes, too.

KraneXL

The limitation to that is disc brakes come into prominence under adverse weather conditions. This is unlikely to be the case when OP tries them out.

350htrr

Yes, hydraulic disks do tend to shine when things are not ideal… But really, even in normal conditions hydraulic discs do come out shinning above the rest, as to modulation, the amount of effort need toto apply a certain amount of stopping power, and so on...

McBTC

True, true... pads work pretty well although I wish my calipers were just a tad bigger so I could run a 28 on the back. Doubt If I'll buy a new machine because of it tho… the cheaper Domane models come with caliper brakes. Not sure how good IsoSpeed is and it just may be great but... I don't think I'd need it much either if I also had bigger tires. If Trek decides to brink back the ALR5 and it has an aluminum steerer, I'd probably go up to ~$2k for it but it looks like those prices for 105-equipped Treks are a thing of the past.