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pedestrians

Old 03-18-15, 05:27 AM
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justblues
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pedestrians

I thought that car drivers were inattentive when it came to bicycles, but that's nothing compared to pedestrians. There is a greenway with a paved bike path near my home. There is a clearly marked walking lane and a clearly marked bicycle lane. Guess where the walkers prefer to walk? If you guess the bicycle lane, then you guessed right for about half of the walkers. If you guesses "all the way across the path so no one can pass them" then you guessed correctly for the other half. I'd call out as I came up behind them and a few would get out of my way. A few were apparently hearing impaired and few were totally unpredictable. You had to guess what they would do and hope that you reacted properly. I managed to not injure anyone yesterday but there were some close calls. Fortunately, I was on a hybrid so I could go off road when needed to avoid pedestrians.
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Old 03-18-15, 05:35 AM
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If you are doing anything more than a casual speed, stay off the MUP (Multi Use Path). They are frequented by walkers, by (wo)men pushing strollers, kids, dogs, runners with earbuds and generally distracted people. I've seen a number of accidents when a cyclist calls out "on your left" and the person turns left to see and walks into the cyclists path.
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Old 03-18-15, 05:43 AM
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Originally Posted by oldnslow2 View Post
If you are doing anything more than a casual speed, stay off the MUP (Multi Use Path). They are frequented by walkers, by (wo)men pushing strollers, kids, dogs, runners with earbuds and generally distracted people. I've seen a number of accidents when a cyclist calls out "on your left" and the person turns left to see and walks into the cyclists path.
so I learned. I thought that I was doing good by getting off the road with the crazy after work drivers.
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Old 03-18-15, 05:45 AM
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I made the mistake of thinking that the markings on the path meant something.
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Old 03-18-15, 05:51 AM
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Sometimes.... I just like to ride like the wind! The shared use paths (AKA bike paths) aren't a good place for that. At least not on the paths that are located in or close to the population centers. Although the rail-to-trails paths can be sparsely used in rural areas during weekdays.

But most of the path areas around here are part of the various parks. And like the remainder of the park areas... get plenty of use by the entire family. Generally the people on the paths are nice, relatively friendly, locals.

Last edited by Dave Cutter; 03-18-15 at 05:59 AM.
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Old 03-18-15, 05:54 AM
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I live near a very nice MUP that runs 3/4 the width of Long Island. I can use it early in the morning but once it's 8:00am I switch to the roads.

Some people just don't have the concept of stepping off the path if they want to stop and talk. I've come around a corner at 20mph only to find someone standing in the middle on the cell phone or two people with strollers blocking the entire path and had to go around them on the dirt.

On one ride it was a long straight path and the guy 100 feet in front yelled out "on your left" to someone on a 'beach cruiser". She turned left and he T-boned her. Luckily she was relatively unhurt, but he had some serious road rash and the bike had a broken right shifter and damaged front wheel.
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Old 03-18-15, 05:55 AM
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Originally Posted by justblues View Post
I made the mistake of thinking that the markings on the path meant something.
These are your neighbors, your peers, co-workers, fellow club and church member, kids, grand-kids.... and all of their friends. They are getting fresh air, exercise, and (above all) enjoying themselves.
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Old 03-18-15, 05:58 AM
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yep. MUT's/MUP's are for casual riding only....if you want to have an average speed of over 15mph... stay off of them...and in some cases that may be pushing it....
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Old 03-18-15, 06:02 AM
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on the plus side, despite the obstacle course, I made six passes of the three mile path in an hour and five minutes. I didn't think that was too bad a pace for a novice under the conditions.
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Old 03-18-15, 09:40 AM
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It's like you're singing my song.

Yes, it is irritating when pedestrians ignore plainly marked lines delineating space designated for bikes and space designated for pedestrians. I can understand that when there are two pedestrians walking abreast, but when there is only one? Just as bad are the ones that walk directly down the center of the path (no kidding), and do so with headphones blaring so they can't possibly hear anyone coming (affectionately referred to hereabouts as bike path zombies).

I've come to the conclusion that the people that do that fit into one of two categories: (1) the ignorant (2) the arrogant. I think the ignorant fall prey to the malady affecting all humans (including cyclists) ... they aren't very good at considering others, particularly when the "others" aren't doing what they are doing. That's why a lot of motorists give cyclists a hard time, and consider pedestrians a nuisance ... why cyclists consider pedestrians a nuisance ... and why pedestrians consider both motorists and cyclists a menace. The arrogant ... well ... they're just ***holes.

I have dreams of a utopian world where the LEOs actually enforce the rules. Maybe even just once a year. I actually asked a LEO why they don't enforce the rules (he had complimented me on the fact that I actually got off and walked when signage demanded it), and he professed ignorance. Apparently, he wasn't sure "Bikes Only" really meant bikes only, even though he was clear what the sign "Walk Bikes" meant.

But the bottom line is that it is like the wild west out there. People can be and often are clueless (and that includes the helmetless yahoos I see daily strand cruising in their flip-flops on the wrong side of the street or bike path, staring a their cellphone). And that is not going to change, even if the LEOs had had the gumption to enforce the rules.

So if you're going to ride on the bike paths (and it doesn't matter that they are not MUPs ... most don't understand or care to understand the distinction), you have to press your chill button ... and sometimes hold it down ... and expect the unexpected.
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Old 03-18-15, 09:53 AM
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I ride a road bike. It's a vehicle. I ride it on the road.
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Old 03-18-15, 09:58 AM
  #12  
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Treat pedestrians like you would want to be treated by cars. they are entry level users and don't understand the rules.
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Old 03-18-15, 10:02 AM
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Originally Posted by Dave Cutter View Post

Originally Posted by justblues View Post
I made the mistake of thinking that the markings on the path meant something.
These are your neighbors, your peers, co-workers, fellow club and church member, kids, grand-kids.... and all of their friends. They are getting fresh air, exercise, and (above all) enjoying themselves.
I don't get the connection here. Do you mean that none of those people can follow the stated law?
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Old 03-18-15, 10:07 AM
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Not very many more irritating or dangerous things than a cyclist speeding on a MUP, or, worse yet, a pace line on one as it passes through a park. MUPs are not meant for race practice, nor anything but casual travel. If that isn't your purpose go somewhere else.

Recently I walked on a MUP that has been a favorite cycling route. It was exactly what I expected; a mix of all kinds of people out enjoying the day. Everyone was getting along except a few cyclists who looked on the rest of us with irritation and arrogance. There was one who charged up behind me, skidded his tires slowing and barely missed me as he passed. There was the one that wove through the pedestrians like it was an obstacle course.

But, most of the cyclists were considerate and traveled slowly enough and with enough care that we could all get along. Most didn't do that silly "on your left". Instead they said something like "passing on your left", or "Hi, nice day, I'm going by on your left". They were in the spirit of the day and the letter of the law. We are all out for a good time and pedestrians, in their lane or not, have the right of way.

A bit of reminiscing this: On a previous travel down a MUP riding my road bike I came upon a woman in a wheel chair making her way along the path. I made a smile and a comment as I passed. A bit later, on my way back, she had turned and also was headed back. I stopped and we had a few minutes of absolutely delightful conversation. We both had a good day and were able to encourage each other. To me, that is the purpose of a MUP.

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Old 03-18-15, 10:08 AM
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Originally Posted by Carbonfiberboy View Post
I ride a road bike. It's a vehicle. I ride it on the road.
There are places hereabouts where the bike paths are preferable for a number of reasons:


1. Faster transit (no stop signs).
2. Alternative roads are bike unfriendly (high volume of high speed traffic, little shoulder and bad sightlines)
3. Better views.

Some of those places have physically separate (some demarcated by a painted line, some by a median) bike/pedestrian paths.
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Old 03-18-15, 10:09 AM
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Originally Posted by justblues View Post
on the plus side, despite the obstacle course, I made six passes of the three mile path in an hour and five minutes. I didn't think that was too bad a pace for a novice under the conditions.
Maybe you are not getting the message here. Don't ride for speed on an urban MUP! It's not safe. If you are hoping to go fast - get out on the road or find an empty MUP/rail trail out in the sticks.
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Old 03-18-15, 10:35 AM
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Originally Posted by scroca View Post
I don't get the connection here. Do you mean that none of those people can follow the stated law?
He means that riding on a populated MUP requires patience and tolerance.

Last edited by MinnMan; 03-18-15 at 10:38 AM.
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Old 03-18-15, 10:36 AM
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Originally Posted by oldnslow2 View Post
If you are doing anything more than a casual speed, stay off the MUP (Multi Use Path). They are frequented by walkers, by (wo)men pushing strollers, kids, dogs, runners with earbuds and generally distracted people. I've seen a number of accidents when a cyclist calls out "on your left" and the person turns left to see and walks into the cyclists path.
What EXACTLY does "on your left" mean**********

Is there a snake on the ground on your left?...Is there a black bear coming out of the woods on your left?....Is there a bird flying overhead that just pooped on your left?

PASSING ON YOUR LEFT indicates an action....skater passing on your left indicates an action....runner passing on your left indicates an action....bicycle passing on your left indicates an action.
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Old 03-18-15, 10:39 AM
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Originally Posted by OldTryGuy View Post
What EXACTLY does "on your left" mean**********

Is there a snake on the ground on your left?...Is there a black bear coming out of the woods on your left?....Is there a bird flying overhead that just pooped on your left?

PASSING ON YOUR LEFT indicates an action....skater passing on your left indicates an action....runner passing on your left indicates an action....bicycle passing on your left indicates an action.
At 20mph i'll be past them before I finish. And if I start sooner they'll miss the beginning.

I just stay off the MUP during late morning and afternoon hours.
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Old 03-18-15, 10:46 AM
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I've been giving this very problem some thought. My theory is that when people get up off the sofa to go for a walk, blood rushes from brains to pool elsewhere. The closest calls I have are on the bike path.
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Old 03-18-15, 10:51 AM
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Originally Posted by spdracr39 View Post
Treat pedestrians like you would want to be treated by cars. they are entry level users and don't understand the rules.
This is great advice. Also, I hate when (on the road) cars pass me in tight spots, pass me just so they don't have to slow down for a second while they check for oncoming traffic, pass me right before a stop sign and then take away my lane. I try to remember that when I'm passing pedestrians on the path.

My path to work in the morning is well-used; and there are a few clueless users on foot, on bikes, on skateboards, etc. Still works pretty well.

https://vimeo.com/105974829
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Old 03-18-15, 10:51 AM
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Originally Posted by berner View Post
I've been giving this very problem some thought. My theory is that when people get up off the sofa to go for a walk, blood rushes from brains to pool elsewhere. The closest calls I have are on the bike path.
No, it means you aren't following the basic rule of road safety: "Go with the flow". It works on the highway, on the sidewalk, at the mall, or on the MUP.

Definition: It IS NOT a "bike path" unless designated and signed as such. It IS a Multiple Use Path "MUP".
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Old 03-18-15, 11:19 AM
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Originally Posted by scroca View Post
I don't get the connection here. Do you mean that none of those people can follow the stated law?
No. I meant (as I posted) he/she... the OP selected those people. They are the people that the OP chose to have in his/her life. If he/she is unhappy with the choice......... who's to blame? Sometimes.... people find themselves not enjoying other people. The problem is never the other people.
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Old 03-18-15, 11:21 AM
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Ok, I didn't know that I was going to cause any controversy or raise any ire, but I should know that things can be misinterpreted on the internet. I feel that some have misinterpreted my posts so I will make clarification. If you still want to throw darts, well I don't mind being criticized as long as it is clear what I am being criticized about.

When I read about the greenway online, seeing that one side of the path was marked for bicycles and one side was marked for pedestrians, I did think that for the most part people would honor those markings. I learned differently when I was there. It sounds like many of you have learned that lesson in the past.

I did go there to enjoy scenery AND to have a paved surface where I didn't have to worry about cars. I did not plan on blasting around to see how fast I could go, nor did I do so. Even if a path is "bicycle only", I would imagine that there would be bicyclists of all ages, capabilities and speeds. I did plan on keeping moving for the most part and to be honest, for the most part I did. I did have to go off-road some to keep moving and I did have to slow to the minimum speed in order to keep the bicycle upright at times.

There were a few stretches that were straight and where there was high visibility where I did go as fast as I could because there was no one ahead of me. I always reached for the brakes well before entering a bend, topping a hill or reaching other people going in either direction. My comment on pace was not an indication that I went to see how fast I could do the path. Quite frankly, I consider myself a newby to bicycling. I rode a lot as a kid with friends like most kids do. There was one period many years ago when my kids were little that I went to an LBS and bought a bicycle and rode in the neighborhood with my kids. Time passed and I got rid of that bicycle. I have just been back into bicycling for about a week and I had no idea what to expect. I have always worked hard to keep in shape, but with recent spinal issues I have decided that bicycling is the best way to maintain that conditioning going forward. I had no idea what to expect from myself as far as pacing. I did not go to the greenway with the purpose of seeing how fast I could go, but I did note what time I started, how many passes I made and what time I stopped and calculate my average pace after I got home. I am just trying to learn what to expect as I start this new hobby. I made that comment because I was surprised that despite the many obstacles, and being supremely cautious anywhere near those obstacles, the average pace was what I would have guessed before starting would be a maximum pace on my best day. I guarantee you that none of the walkers, runners or other bicyclists thought of me as "that guy" that was endangering everyone else.

Changing topics, I'm hoping to go on my first really long (for me) ride this Saturday. The weather looks to be good. I am just outside a military base and the end of the base where I live is essentially abandoned after hours and on weekends. It is all office buildings and far away from the troop and residential areas. A lot of people ride there. I am hoping that my bicycle computer that I ordered will be in before then and if so I'll really be paying attention to pacing.

Last edited by justblues; 03-18-15 at 11:31 AM. Reason: typos
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Old 03-18-15, 11:26 AM
  #25  
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Originally Posted by Dave Cutter View Post
No. I meant (as I posted) he/she... the OP selected those people. They are the people that the OP chose to have in his/her life. If he/she is unhappy with the choice......... who's to blame? Sometimes.... people find themselves not enjoying other people. The problem is never the other people.
actually, I very much enjoyed interacting with many of the other people on the path. It was just not what I expected based on the website description of the greenway. I thought that the greenway would be more bicycle friendly. I am learning but give me a little more learning time before criticizing too much. I am sure that I will go and walk that greenway with my wife many times in the future and while so doing, I will even more enjoy the people there. If I bicycle there again, it will likely be early in the morning on the weekend.
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