Bekologist

Riding today, clipping along on my schwinn corvette 5 down a good hill, i'm doing 20 or so in the bike lane on one of the more heavily bike ridden streets in Seattle. I usually have pepper spray taped to the seat stay of my commuter bike. Today, though, I'm out for a joy ride on the schwinn, so no spray.

Ahead of me, a cab is stopped ahead in the lane, dropping off. I hand out to the left and take the lane, all good. Before I can merge back, a mercedes guns it past me in the middle turn lane. Instead of him motoring along, he decides to hang back, and rolls down his window to comment on my biking. The driver is a consumptive, overweight guy with the look of a chronic boozer. I immediately let him know with copious volume and profanity that I have every right to the lane, didn't he see the cab, etc...

So he starts playing aggressive driver with me, slowing and squeezing, I drop back, then pass him on his left because he keeps holding back to jack with me. I signal and pull past him back into the bike lane. He's got his the drivers window down now too, hollering at me. So, I'm in the bike lane again, playing dodgeball with this guy. He finally pulls over right in front of me and jumps out, screaming the typish "come here, you little fokker!" so I dodge him into the lane. About 30 feet ahead theres 5 or 6 people at a bus stop.

I pull off the road by the bus stop and the people. The guy starts running and screaming at me, and I hold him back verbably and with the observer factor of the crowd working to my advantage. I'm screaming "Aggressive driver, you were threatening me with your car, I have every right to pass the cab..." The cab has pulled up by now and has slowed down in the lane, looking on too. I pointedly ask the guy at the top of my lungs "Have you been drinking? Does that let you threaten people in your Mercedes?" or something and he pretty much lost the joust right there.

He finishes off his deflated tirade with a "I just want to kick your ass" and I'm like, yeah, right, sweetie!" too bad I broke my hip 3 months ago or might have egged him on to get more physical, but wasn't willing to risk a throw down with a glass hip.

Anyway, no real foul. I know some of you may feel I should have done the ignore thing, or the friendly wave thing, but I tend to become very verbally defensive if some driver has rolled down his window to play the 'educate the cyclist' game.

So, I feel I could have saved myself a lot of grief if I could have just reached down and pepper sprayed the son of a gun as soon as he jumped out of the car to threaten me. It could have been a lot worse, the guy could have been more aggressive, if people and the cabbie hadn't been around. Any comments?

Blue Order

I think it would have been very effective to say, with witnesses present, "Aggressive driver, you were threatening me with your car, I have every right to pass the cab..." and finish the sentence by describing his Mercedes and license plate number, and noting that you will be filing a police report of the incident.

Having the cab's number (and some witnesses contact numbers) would have been good too-- another witness (if nothing else, the cab driver could testify that he had indeed just dropped a passenger off at that spot).

Then file a police report and nail the fat ****.

Jonathan1987

i was pissed today when i was going 25 in a 30 zone with no bike lane and this old man with a trailer passed with a car coming the other way and the trailer came inches from me. i wish people in their cars could just relax and make this more enjoyable for us

Blue Order

If the guy had been drinking, I think the police would be interested to know that. Immediately.

karmical

pepperspraying someone, am i missing something? i thought pepperspray was for personal defense. it seems to me if you thought this guy was intoxicated you would of been best served by staying the heck out of his way and give him more space.

i dunno i just don't go around exchaning profanities with jerks behind the wheel, is this the norm simply reach for the pepperspray if said jerk pulls over and now wants to take it up a notch. am i the only one that simply jumps up on the sidewalk and watch as cars that do dumb stuff go off into the distance, then slip back into the flow..

Savas

it can happen to get so caught up in the moment. We all get caught short sometimes and come back with equally surly and agressive behavior. Better to think to yourself, "I'll just go along like the intelligent biker I am and leave this POS to his own misery." - then maybe he'll speed past you and crash into a building somewhere up ahead.

chemcycle

He ought to be shot.

Naw, it's always smart to try to escalate the situation so you have to use your spray!! FUN!!

mrRed

If some fool is trying to run you off the road with his Mercedes, a shot of pepperspray followed by a prompt u-turn is probably personal defense. The problem is that he didn't realize what type of damage he could've done with his car and from the sound of it was trying to use it as a potential weapon. Pepper spray is not the recommended action, but it is a viable option, IMO.

I personally go for the yell and wave hands in the air like an epileptical jackyll, than get the hell out of the way routine. I find it works better than attempting to get into a physical (or chemical) altercation with the driver, being that I don't wanna risk my freedom (in case I get carried away) or my life due to someone using their vehicle as a weapon against me.

pleaseassist

Bek, that's funny stuff. You and a small crowd of busgoers waiting for a driver to come-a-pummeling your way. Suppose you shouldn't have passed him after he made an ass out of himself. The yelling vulgarities is flame for his fire...but I know how that goes.

Depending on you Schwinn and how quick you are with that hip, you could've tried something big. The manuever is one I've only heard of, from a guy who owns a courier business in SF; Angry motorist shouts, biker retorts with no unusual desire but for vindication. Driver stops and gets out to batter biker. Biker taunts and leads driver away from car. Biker gets to car and removes keys and places them in an unreachable place. Seattle is near water... you'd think of something.

The guy I knew was a motorcyclist and quite aggressive, so this was a wise tactic for him. Also, the incident took place on a bridge and the keys made a splash. I can't condone, but for a lesson to be learned one must impress greatly. What would the perp tell his wife/friends/tow driver?

Artkansas 

My general rule of thumb is "Let trouble pass you by". Most times in traffic, letting the problem go, solves the problem.

You might have had pepper spray. He might have had a gun. You decide.

In any case, I can't say that I've always resisted the urge to tell a driver off either. It's always a judgement call.

Az B

Once they get out of thier car, it's always fun to go back and get the keys and toss them into the bushes.

This does assume that you can outrun them, and in this case it sounds like it was possible.

Also, take your bike with you, don't leave it behind.

I did this to someone once a long time ago. Me and a friend were riding and this lady nearly right hooks my buddy. She made the turn with tires screeching since she had to speed up to pass us right before making the right turn. He managed to turn with her rather than go over or under the car, but it was close. I was impressed by his riding.

At any rate, he kicks her car after the apex of the turn and she slams on her brakes, stops and gets out yelling. Walks over to my buddy and starts waving her finger in his face. I roll up on the driver's side of the car with the door open and the keys in the ignition. I reach over, pull them out, jingle them once to get both of thier attention and then toss them as far as I can into a vacant lot.

Then we rode off laughing. We laughed for a long time and sometimes still even laugh about it.

Az

becnal

Most EXCELLENT!

N_C

In this case I feel your actions were appropriate. You did the right thing at confronting him amongst witnesses. If it were different I might say you should have done the ignore thing, but not in this case. Did you notice an open bottle of booze in his vehicle, or smell it on him?

LittleBigMan

Been there done that Bek. Can't pass any judgement. I think it might have something to do with when an aggressive person uses their thousands of pounds of steel vehicle to threaten my flesh and bones on purpose. Can I help it if the primitive part of my brain tells my adrenal cortex to release powerful hormones which change my brain chemistry into a fighting machine? Well, maybe I can, but anyway, I've lost it too on many occasions.

On the other hand, I hope you are able to avoid toxic personalities like this in the future. Don't want to see you get hurt by some ape.

timmhaan

the problem with these situations are that you're not just dealing with the traffic altercation. you're dealing with all of his problems and they're focused directly at you. be it his drinking, stress from work, marrage going down the tube, lack of love as a child, etc. all that frustration usually comes out all at once, and you're a convienent scape goat. be safe out there, never know who you'll run into and what kind of problems they have.

slagjumper

Great story glad to hear nothing too bad came of it for you. Makes me think that I should keep my cell phone handy so that I can call in an agressive driver's license. I'd probably would have behaved much the same way.

timmhaan

stories like this make me realize how much i need to practice memorizing plate numbers. i just need to get in the habit of noticing them and trying to recite it to myself. just in case.

rainbikey

Bek,
I am a commuter in Seattle. Riding from Ballard to Pike Market, then hoping a vanpool to SeaTac.
Been doing this ride 3x per week for five years. I been trouble-free since then.
A few mornings ago a driver in a residential neighborhood street forced me off the road.
It was obvious that it was intentional. When I came to the next stop sign, adjacent the car, I pouned the car body with my fist and he drive off and ignored me.
I immediatly regreted the physical response, but I was overcome with anger and surprised myself.

Even though it was dark (6am) I know he saw me and decided to make me a target.
(I was wearing bright , reflective clothes and all the correct lighting. )
I was taking the street as it is narrow and only one car at a time can travel it.
I was riding about 16 mph for 2 blocks.
It was obvious was pissed.
Do you have a sense that drivers are becoming more confrontational in the Emerald City?

p

trackhub

I think the government must have a special program where they breed these people from waste matter. It's the only explanation.

Good solution, pulling up to a crowd to confront this jerk. Good thinking on your part.

In the Boston area, this type usually has a Jeep grand Cherokee.

Bekologist

Yes, I do. Absolutely. I've been riding for over 30 years, and commuting in seattle for over a decade, and I have seen much more aggro behavior in the last, maybe two years? Perhaps I can date it back to post 911 as a benchmark, I surmise it is happening all across America.

There's some radio shock jockeys and ridiculous anti bike op eds in the papers fanning the flames. Some Mercer Islanders want to allow only residents to bike there, for instance. Seattle's group psyche is so dispassionately passive aggressive, overlaid with lala latte land saccharine dusting, so I see a lot of hostile drivers out there.


Yeah, I've had two drivers in the past year now that wanted to roll down their windows and chosen to take my retorts so personally they had to screech to a halt and jump out to potentially assult me.

THAT is why I have pepper spray taped to the seat stays of my commuter- I feel, if a driver is taking the action towards me of threatening me with his car bumper, screeches into my path, and jumps out, attempt to door me, and wants to assult me, it's ALREADY an assult and some pepper spray to the chops is merited and justifable defensive behavior.

scarry

Good going, one could only hope that one could provoke such rage in those type of folks (consumptive, overweight, old drunk) to cause a heart attack. That would be my wish.

webist

I'm sorry for your experience. I don't think I'd have been quite so confrontational myself, but I understand your reaction in the heat of the moment. Glad no one was hurt. My compliments to you on focusing your post(s) on the individual in question, rather than generalizing to everyone operating an automobile.

Roody

I'd like to tell you off Bek, but that would make me a hypocrite. A similar thing happened to me a couple weeks ago, and I went off even worse than you did. This happened when I was walking, not riding, with my 30 year old stepson, Jerry. A cager turned left as we were crossing a side street. He missed hitting us both by about 6 inches. Jerry and I yelled that pedestrians have the right of way, you effin' moron. The guy stopped his car in the middle of the intersection (!) and jumped out. I started yelling at him to get back in his car right now. Out of he corner of my eye I saw Jerry whipping his shirt off to fight. Now, Jerry is on probation, while I am considered an upstanding citizen with no police record whatsoever. I got between Jerry and the guy, and when the guy kept walking toward me I punched him twice in the head. I was yelling that he was a effin' lunatic to stop his car with his wife and little boy in it, and to get back in his car. As soon as I punched him he went back into the car and drove off. A minute later a cop car cruised by and looked us over real good, then kept going. It was a real wierd situation.

So bek, I can understand why you reacted the way you did. I do believe that the best response for me (and probably for you as well) would have been to walk (or ride) away from the situation. For both of us, we certainly were in a bad position legally, if a cop had witnessed the event. And morally too, I think it's better to remain peaceful and in control. Unfortunately, sometimes it's hard to live up to one's own standards of decency.

nova

On the taking the keys thing. Find nearest postal drop box and drop em in

Roody

It is strange that many of the people who posted on this thread can justify their own rae and anger, but believe the angry cager should die or otherwise be punished. This makes no sense to me.

If it's OK for a cyclist to go off on a cager, I'm pretty sure the reverse must be OK too.