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Do You Worry About Your Heart?

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Do You Worry About Your Heart?

Old 11-21-19, 11:22 AM
  #151  
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Originally Posted by metalheart44
Do I worry about my heart? Sometimes I have concerns, like recently. Here is the history.

My first heart attack was in 2005 and the way I remember it the doc said I lost about 15% of heart capacity. A couple of stents were implanted. I became active in the gym and pool after that event. in early 2010 I had some occasional chest pain and a stress test was recommended. The treadmill was relatively easy and the results showed I was in the top 1% for my age group. Three weeks later I had a second heart attack after lifting bundles of stone from a pallet. More stents. Takeaway: a stress test is no guarantee things won’t be different the next day.

Since 2010 I have been an active cyclist averaging about 6k per year with a reasonable amount of climbing. Serial knee replacements in 2015 slowed me down for a year or so, but I bounced back fine. Since 2010 I have had occasional chest pains, but nothing too worrisome and those pains have seldom happened while riding. My resting heart rate is in the range of 45-52 and while pushing hard my heart rate is in the mid to high 150’s. Last year on sustained climbs my heart rate peaked in the low 160’s. I am 75.

This year has been different, starting with some delays riding because of a second shoulder surgery in December 2018. I have about 4500 miles this year and 200k of climbing so far, so I am a bit behind my average. After some rides I am very tired, enough that I lay down and take a nap after the ride, which is unusual for me. My average speed has dropped about 1.5-2 mph. There is one hill I climb regularly and it is my own personal “stress test”, an average 10% grade for about 1/4 mile, which I do all out. My heart rate will get into the low 150’s, but I have not had chest pains. However, my overall performance on that hill has slowly declined.

The combination of being tired after some rides, lower average speed, and decreased climbing capacity does not make me worry, but it has my attention. At my recent cardiology appointment I mentioned these issues to my doc and another stress test is scheduled in a few weeks followed by an echo cardiogram after that. Maybe It is just aging, maybe it has just been one of those years, maybe it is a change in my cardiac functioning. Time to find out.

So, before the formal stress test I am riding 4 times a week, pushing a little harder than usual, climbing a bit more, drinking less wine, focusing on sleeping better. So, while I am not worrying about my heart, I know that I can’t ignore what can be signs of a developing issue. I am also keeping the nitro FOB a bit more accessible during the next few weeks.

Sounds like you are doing 4 stress tests a week as it is.

Wishing you all the best with the upcoming "official" stress test.
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Old 11-21-19, 01:57 PM
  #152  
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Originally Posted by bpcyclist
Sounds like you are doing 4 stress tests a week as it is.

Wishing you all the best with the upcoming "official" stress test.
My cardiologist told me that stress tests only really identify blockages when they are pretty significant ... in the order of 90% or more. So it wouldn't surprise me that you'd pass one, then have a cardiac event when circumstances are different.

I would consider an CT angiogram ... maybe ask your doc about it?
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Old 11-21-19, 02:39 PM
  #153  
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Originally Posted by Biker395
My cardiologist told me that stress tests only really identify blockages when they are pretty significant ... in the order of 90% or more. So it wouldn't surprise me that you'd pass one, then have a cardiac event when circumstances are different.

I would consider an CT angiogram ... maybe ask your doc about it?
not to get too personal but you look real young in your pic (if that is you). What prompted you to see/have a cardiologist?
thanks
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Old 11-21-19, 04:46 PM
  #154  
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Originally Posted by Flip Flop Rider
not to get too personal but you look real young in your pic (if that is you). What prompted you to see/have a cardiologist?
thanks
Thank you! Yea, that's me ... looking younger than I am through the wonders of Photoshop. lol

My GP is very thorough. My risk factors are significant, but all have caveats:

Family History: I'm in my early 60s. My Dad died of a massive MI when he was in his late 60s. But then again, he was a 2 pack a day smoker all his life and with much of that on one lung. He got zero exercise and didn't eat well, either. My brother had a series of strokes in his 50s, but he was morbidly obese, diabetic, ate terribly, and was taking megadoses of vitamin K to try to stop the bleeding in his eyes.

Blood Pressure: Every time I go to the doc, my BP is high ... like in the order of 135-155. But the caveat is that it goes down to 115-120 by the time I've left. And the lower number is consistently low.

Enlarged Heart: Abmoral EKG. Huge spikes ... higher than the doc has ever seen (last time, he looked at it and quipped that it had to be some kind of a record ... it was off the scale). But it has been looked at with ultrasound and is not enlarged. The spikes are some kind of strange anomaly.

Cholesterol: Borderline. Sometime below guidelines, sometimes above.

So he suggested the stress test, which showed nothing, so we did the CT angiogram. That was done at a cardiac center that throught I was an interesting subject (with the combination of some family history but healthy habits), so I have been asked to participate in a number of clinical trials (and I usually say yes to those).
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Old 11-21-19, 05:07 PM
  #155  
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Originally Posted by Biker395
My risk factors are significant, but all have caveats:

Family History: I'm in my early 60s. My Dad died of a massive MI when he was in his late 60s. But then again, he was a 2 pack a day smoker all his life and with much of that on one lung. He got zero exercise and didn't eat well, either. My brother had a series of strokes in his 50s, but he was morbidly obese, diabetic, ate terribly, and was taking megadoses of vitamin K to try to stop the bleeding in his eyes.

Blood Pressure: Every time I go to the doc, my BP is high ... like in the order of 135-155. But the caveat is that it goes down to 115-120 by the time I've left. And the lower number is consistently low.

...

Cholesterol: Borderline. Sometime below guidelines, sometimes above.
I am similar to you. I'm 64.

1) My dad died instantly on the golf course from a heart attack at 74. He was really out of shape with quite a big pot belly.

2) I will sometimes measure high BP at the doc office, but when I measure it at home it varies all over the place including dropping very low. The Dr asked about taking BP meds, but when I mentioned what I measure at home the Dr immediately said they don't prescribe unless consistently high.

3) Same here with borderline cholesterol. Don't get tested much, but last time was borderline and the previous was fine. I eat a crap load of fiber, fruits, and veggies. I suspect that I inherited this from my Dad. Sister reports the same. But I also suspect that it reflects what I've been eating in the few weeks before the test. You can get it tested for about $30 without a Dr. I've been thinking about doing some spaced out tests and monkey with the diet in between to see the effect.

I'm 5-8, 138lbs, and don't have much body fat. I wakeboard a lot so my upper body is somewhat developed. I.E. not skinny fat. It's a bummer to stay in shape and eat well but still have some borderline measurements. But genetics are always part of the game. I'm really anti takings drugs unless it's dire. Since I rarely have any physical effects that lead me to believe I need medical health I tend to stay away from doctors. Had gallstones last Dec and ended up having my gall bladder removed. Definitely had pain that sent me to urgent care on that one.
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Old 11-21-19, 05:48 PM
  #156  
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Originally Posted by Biker395
Thank you! Yea, that's me ... looking younger than I am through the wonders of Photoshop. lol

My GP is very thorough. My risk factors are significant, but all have caveats:

Family History: I'm in my early 60s. My Dad died of a massive MI when he was in his late 60s. But then again, he was a 2 pack a day smoker all his life and with much of that on one lung. He got zero exercise and didn't eat well, either. My brother had a series of strokes in his 50s, but he was morbidly obese, diabetic, ate terribly, and was taking megadoses of vitamin K to try to stop the bleeding in his eyes.

Blood Pressure: Every time I go to the doc, my BP is high ... like in the order of 135-155. But the caveat is that it goes down to 115-120 by the time I've left. And the lower number is consistently low.

Enlarged Heart: Abmoral EKG. Huge spikes ... higher than the doc has ever seen (last time, he looked at it and quipped that it had to be some kind of a record ... it was off the scale). But it has been looked at with ultrasound and is not enlarged. The spikes are some kind of strange anomaly.

Cholesterol: Borderline. Sometime below guidelines, sometimes above.

So he suggested the stress test, which showed nothing, so we did the CT angiogram. That was done at a cardiac center that throught I was an interesting subject (with the combination of some family history but healthy habits), so I have been asked to participate in a number of clinical trials (and I usually say yes to those).
thanks for the response and keep pedaling!
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Old 11-21-19, 10:18 PM
  #157  
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Originally Posted by Biker395
My cardiologist told me that stress tests only really identify blockages when they are pretty significant ... in the order of 90% or more. So it wouldn't surprise me that you'd pass one, then have a cardiac event when circumstances are different.

I would consider an CT angiogram ... maybe ask your doc about it?

After my second heart attack, a positive stress test does not give me any comfort. My doc is describing the next one as a necessary step for whatever might come next, most likely an angiogram. I am probably not a candidate for a CT angiogram since my CAD is already diagnosed. After the second angiogram and the stents implanted, the surgeon said, "stay in shape, I'll probably see you again for a bypass." That was not reassuring, but I don't let those comments affect how I ride.

I continue to rely on how my body feels while riding as a good enough indicator of heart health. The indications I have now suggest examining if my heart issues are the reason.

As an aside, I also share the liable hypertension you describe:At the doc's office I am often between 130 and 150 systolic and 70/80 diastolic, but I insist on having it taken again near the end of my appointment and it is usually back to normal for me 125/65. I keep a daily record of my BP and bring it along to all my med appts. When I first enlisted in the Navy at 17 it was noted that I had liable BP and that has not changed, although now I take BP meds.

My total cholesterol when I had my first MI was 180, but my LDL was over 100. At the time the docs ordered a Berkeley Labs Cholesterol Assessment test that examines the size and character of different lipoproteins and it turns out I have large sticky particles that I believe contribute to my CAD. I take a statin and my total cholesterol is in the 110-120 range with my LDL in the 40-50 range. The statin works for me with no side effects. There is now a test that produces similar results called the Vertical Auto Profile (VAP) and I think it is covered by most insurance and if you have risk factors it may be worth asking for that test rather than just a lipid profile.

Family history too, dad died at 52 of an MI.

I don't let my heart disease limit my cycling most of the time. My doc said he would prefer that I not try to do the Death Ride here in California and I told him not to worry about that. But, since both heart attacks I ride hard enough, but I do limit my efforts at near maximum heart rate: when I hit the low 150's I back off.

Last edited by metalheart44; 11-21-19 at 10:27 PM.
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Old 11-22-19, 09:47 AM
  #158  
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Originally Posted by bpcyclist
Interesting. I never do group rides, though I probably should give them a try again. I am not an antisocial person. But I really enjoy riding alone. It's peaceful and relaxing and even when I am pushing myself, which I often do, it is just for me. Nobody else. And I kind of like that.
This describes me perfectly, every sentence is exactly as I feel about biking. I knew I was not the only one.
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Old 11-22-19, 04:35 PM
  #159  
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Originally Posted by peterws
Anybody got any Diastolic h.r. stories? Just found out there's a thing as Pulse pressure which ideally should be around 40, the difference between Systolic and Diastolic pressures. on a normal (shrug) 30yo, say.
Looks like my Diastolic is way too low . . it's usually around 60, but was 40 this morning. I'd had Cetirizine for hayfever/rhinitis and it may have caused this . . .
Now, please don't panic, guys; I'm pretty sure it's nothing a decent cup o' coffee can't fix . . .
Yes - you have made my point - unless a person understands their blood vessel status - during both systole and diastole - they have a poor chance of understanding what their heart health/risk status is.

Cyclists - like any group - come with their share of hypertensive individuals. Worry about cardio- VASCULAR - status - not just heart rate.....
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Old 11-27-19, 05:25 PM
  #160  
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Originally Posted by Skullo
This describes me perfectly, every sentence is exactly as I feel about biking. I knew I was not the only one.
Me too. I tried riding with a local club group and the conversations when we stopped for lunch were fun, but I'd get done with a ride and realize all that I'd seen was the rear tire of the guy in front of me! And I don't like the idea that riding is some sort of competition. If you're into that, OK, but I just enjoy the freedom of seeing the world from an open platform that can take me just about anywhere I'd like to go. In my younger days, that was on a motorcycle, but at 73yo I can afford to slow it down a bit.

I even enjoy going solo on week-long catered group trips where I spend the day riding the route at my own pace and then get to enjoy the group camaraderie (and a few beers) around the dinner table in the evening.

As for the heart health issue, there was a period of time -- coinciding with the age that my dad died of a heart attack -- that I worried more about it. In general, my hereditary history is not good, I have med-controlled cholesterol and BP issues, and my two younger brothers have had heart-related incidents. But at this point I have had no overt symptoms and my recent tests have been good, so I generally don't think about it much. I certainly haven't let it hold me back from continuing to ride as well as run regularly.

Last edited by DougG; 11-27-19 at 05:31 PM.
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Old 11-28-19, 07:15 AM
  #161  
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No. I don't worry about anything else, either.
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Old 11-28-19, 12:50 PM
  #162  
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Although I'm sure this thread is getting a little old and has probably veered off course several times, I do worry and I went and had it looked at. Here are the results. I was told that there is really nothing to worry about and to keep up with the bike riding. The Dr. was rather impressed when I told him that 2 months ago I had ridden 450 miles, but that the current month was down around 250 miles.

HOLTER MONITOR FINDINGS:
1. This is a good quality 22-hour recording showing underlying sinus rhythm. Low minimum (43 bpm), average (61 bpm) and maximum (90 bpm) heart rates.Normal diurnal variation in heart rates.
2. There are rare (6) isolated, unifocal premature atrial contractions.
3. There are occasional (412) unifocal premature ventricular contractions. There are brief episodes of ventricular trigeminy. There is one ventricular couplet. Ventricular ectopy is primarily during daytime hours.
4. There is no significant bradycardia, pauses or conduction block.
5. The patient reports "heartbeat" (palpitations) several times in the diary which correspond to periods of increased premature ventricular contractions.
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Old 11-29-19, 09:19 AM
  #163  
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I just got my bloot test results back for my physical. It seems my ldl cholesterol is elevated. Thought I would switch to margarine. After some research I think I'll pass.

Too many conflicting results. I like that butter is natural too, Not a highly processed food product that is sometimes worse, and at best, gets mixed results.

Avoiding saturated fat in other products like snacks, and controlling overall fat intake seems like a sensible approach. That, and adding 3 x 45 minute treadmill sessions at 63 - 72% of my max heart rate per week.
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Old 12-01-19, 09:25 PM
  #164  
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Originally Posted by xroadcharlie
I just got my bloot test results back for my physical. It seems my ldl cholesterol is elevated. Thought I would switch to margarine. After some research I think I'll pass.

Too many conflicting results. I like that butter is natural too, Not a highly processed food product that is sometimes worse, and at best, gets mixed results.

Avoiding saturated fat in other products like snacks, and controlling overall fat intake seems like a sensible approach. That, and adding 3 x 45 minute treadmill sessions at 63 - 72% of my max heart rate per week.
The no processed snacks, no soda, very little sugar approach seems to work well. Fat needs to be ~20% or so of calories, and yes, some fats are better, olive oil and wild caught fish being the best. More Italian cooking, less French! The best snack I've found is an apple.

Otherwise, it's exercise, basically the more the better. 10 hours/week is not unreasonable. Max HR is not a good place to start because there's no practical way to predict or find one's MHR.

One is better off going by breathing and watching one's HR against one's breathing rate. Find out where your VT1 and VT2 are w/r to HR and use that. Mostly exercise at ~ VT1, with maybe 20'-45'/week at or near VT2, perhaps done as 5'-10' intervals, but work up to that. Diet and exercise are a good place to start. See:
https://www.webmd.com/cholesterol-ma...sterol-ratio#1
https://www.urmc.rochester.edu/encyc...anel_hdl_ratio
https://www.hindawi.com/journals/jnme/2012/809576/
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Old 12-02-19, 02:13 PM
  #165  
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Originally Posted by zacster
I started wearing an HR monitor a few years ago, not because I was worried but so I see my effort. That was OK at the time, but now I use it to keep myself from pushing too hard. When I get up around 180 I figure that's enough, and usually my legs thinks so too. But I've hit 190 too, and that was just too high. As long as I recover normally I know I'm OK, and so far that's always been the case. It's hard to let go, but I try to stay under 175 now, and that'll go down over the coming years. I'm 64 now for reference. Oh, and given my age and the numbers I just threw out that calculator just doesn't work for me. What is it? 220 - your age? That would be 156 and that is just a steady tempo pace. I'm no natural athlete either, in fact the opposite.

So when going up a hill I usually go as hard as I can, but if the HR goes over 180 I let up, and the HR always goes over 180 if I push it. On the flats I only would go that high if I sprint and hold it.
Since buying a HR monitor I found out I am in the same boat; a 60 year old weekend warrior at best with a max heart rate of at least 190. Glad to hear others are in the same HR range and aren't keeling over. I haven't worried about overworking my heart but couldn't tell you why. When using software to calculate heart rate zones that have calculators which use the 220-age formula I have to say I'm 30 for the numbers to be close. I take small victories like that when I can.
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Old 12-04-19, 10:11 AM
  #166  
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Concerns I have about my heart are noted in a post above, the short version is decreased performance this past year, some chest pains, tiredness, and a mismatch between perceived effort and heart rate.

I have been riding 3-4 times a week the past month, some weather issues have kept me off the bike a few times, but I’ve managed four different on-the- bike “stress tests” on a selected hill, about a quarter mile average 10% grade. Some of those efforts are concerning, some not: when my heart rate is lower than my perceive effort and I am breathing very hard I get concerned. When my heart rate matches perceived effort, then I am not concerned.

On the last effort yesterday, my heart rate, breathing, and perceived effort were consistent and I reached close to predicted max heart rate for my age. Recovery was also ok, with heart rate dropping 30% from calculated max within a couple minutes. I did several more climbs on the ride and did just fine. The overall ride was 31 miles with 2500 feet of climbing, nothing unusual for me.

I did have chest pain during the ride but there was no connection between the onset or duration of the pain and cycling effort. That is a confounding experience so I am working with my doc to rule out other potential sources of that persistent chest pain if it is not cardiac related.

So, tomorrow I have the nuclear stress test (SPECT) the doc prescribed. This will be my 6th stress test since my first heart attack and the second nuclear stress test. The others were either standard stress treadmill or stress echocardiogram. Each of these offers different types of information, but short of an angiogram, the nuclear stress test is probably the best look at my heart that will happen.

For me, cycling is the best indicator of my overall health and particularly my heart health. When there are changes in in cycling performance and experience, I don’t worry about my heart, but I do pay attention and try to sort out what are the issues
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Old 12-04-19, 11:09 AM
  #167  
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Originally Posted by metalheart44
Concerns I have about my heart are noted in a post above, the short version is decreased performance this past year, some chest pains, tiredness, and a mismatch between perceived effort and heart rate.

I have been riding 3-4 times a week the past month, some weather issues have kept me off the bike a few times, but I’ve managed four different on-the- bike “stress tests” on a selected hill, about a quarter mile average 10% grade. Some of those efforts are concerning, some not: when my heart rate is lower than my perceive effort and I am breathing very hard I get concerned. When my heart rate matches perceived effort, then I am not concerned.

On the last effort yesterday, my heart rate, breathing, and perceived effort were consistent and I reached close to predicted max heart rate for my age. Recovery was also ok, with heart rate dropping 30% from calculated max within a couple minutes. I did several more climbs on the ride and did just fine. The overall ride was 31 miles with 2500 feet of climbing, nothing unusual for me.

I did have chest pain during the ride but there was no connection between the onset or duration of the pain and cycling effort. That is a confounding experience so I am working with my doc to rule out other potential sources of that persistent chest pain if it is not cardiac related.

So, tomorrow I have the nuclear stress test (SPECT) the doc prescribed. This will be my 6th stress test since my first heart attack and the second nuclear stress test. The others were either standard stress treadmill or stress echocardiogram. Each of these offers different types of information, but short of an angiogram, the nuclear stress test is probably the best look at my heart that will happen.

For me, cycling is the best indicator of my overall health and particularly my heart health. When there are changes in in cycling performance and experience, I don’t worry about my heart, but I do pay attention and try to sort out what are the issues
Hope you do fine on your test.

Possible causes for your issues:
1) Chest pain can often be muscular discomfort, cramping, associated with breathing hard. My cardiologist told my that my chest pain, right over my heart, is nothing to worry about. He said that if something was wrong, I'd certainly know about it by now. Just an encouraging note.

2) When my HR lags my RPE, I know I'm tired. That's definitive. If you're posting here and climbing 7500' or so every week, yeah, you could be just tired. Do you upload your rides and watch your hrTSS, CTL, TSB, morning resting and standing HRs and orthostatic HR, any of that? Use an HRV app on your phone? You might want to do all of that. I betcha there'd be clear signals coming from your numbers which would set your mind at ease.

As we age, it's pretty hard to train effectively without keeping track of how our training is affecting our physiology. We can't just do anything we want, any time we want anymore.
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Old 12-05-19, 05:18 PM
  #168  
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Originally Posted by Carbonfiberboy
Hope you do fine on your test.

Possible causes for your issues:
1) Chest pain can often be muscular discomfort, cramping, associated with breathing hard. My cardiologist told my that my chest pain, right over my heart, is nothing to worry about. He said that if something was wrong, I'd certainly know about it by now. Just an encouraging note.

There are at least a couple other causes for me, including some referred pain from some cervical degeneration and GERD. I have medical stuff in line to check out those possible causes. Mot of the time there seems to be no connection between the chest pain and effort. It is the combination of chest pain, the lag between heart rate and perceived effort, and some general tiredness that raises my concern.

2) When my HR lags my RPE, I know I'm tired. That's definitive. If you're posting here and climbing 7500' or so every week, yeah, you could be just tired. Do you upload your rides and watch your hrTSS, CTL, TSB, morning resting and standing HRs and orthostatic HR, any of that? Use an HRV app on your phone? You might want to do all of that. I betcha there'd be clear signals coming from your numbers which would set your mind at ease.

I climb between 6k &10k a week, depending on a whole range of circumstances. Climbing does not seem to give me the general feeling of being tired that I am experiencing. I monitor BP/HR every day and have a good handle on my HR at various times of the day, but I don't track any of the others you mentioned.

As we age, it's pretty hard to train effectively without keeping track of how our training is affecting our physiology. We can't just do anything we want, any time we want anymore.
Maybe it is just aging, I'm not sure. At today's nuclear stress exam I did fine. The tech taking the images and I had a good conversation so I asked him about my ejection fraction numbers and gave them to me and they are well within the "normal" range. Time and heart rate on the treadmill was good enough for the nurse to threaten to take me to the nearby senior center as an example of how exercise helps when aging. Since it was my birthday today, I decline the offer to visit the senior center.

So, the take away so far is that paying attention to heart function while cycling is helpful for me. Have I worried lately? Some, but I have tried to use that concern to sort out what is going on. There is more to find out.
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Old 12-05-19, 06:48 PM
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Originally Posted by metalheart44
Maybe it is just aging, I'm not sure. At today's nuclear stress exam I did fine. The tech taking the images and I had a good conversation so I asked him about my ejection fraction numbers and gave them to me and they are well within the "normal" range. Time and heart rate on the treadmill was good enough for the nurse to threaten to take me to the nearby senior center as an example of how exercise helps when aging. Since it was my birthday today, I decline the offer to visit the senior center.

So, the take away so far is that paying attention to heart function while cycling is helpful for me. Have I worried lately? Some, but I have tried to use that concern to sort out what is going on. There is more to find out.
When I did my test, the doc said I had the physiology of a fit 43 y.o. And I should stop worrying.

The simplest monitor for training stress is to take your orthostatic HR every morning, without fail, and record it in your training log. After getting up and peeing, lie back down with your HRM. Allow your HR to drop as low as it's going to go. I'd give it maybe 5 minutes. It's very important to image calming things, meditate. That's your morning resting HR, MRHR. Then stand, note the exact time and keep watching your HRM. After you stand, your HR will go up to a peak, then decline, then go back up again. Stand for 3 minutes and take your average HR for the last 30" of that three minutes. That's your morning standing heart rate, MSHR. The difference between them is your morning orthostatic HR. Two things to watch. If your MRHR goes up 6-8 beats above completely rested, you're on the edge of overdoing it. If your orthostatic HR climbs over 20, same thing. My orthostatic normally varies between 8 and 13 beats. This test is easy to do and well documented as a tell. It'll take a few weeks to document what's normal and what is not, but it's another handle on the problem.

The other simple tell is to hit a hill really hard after maybe 1/2 hour of riding and watch your HR. You're already doing that. But when your HR won't come up, it's nothing wrong with your heart, you just need more rest before pushing it that hard. IME.
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Old 12-05-19, 06:54 PM
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Thanks, those are very helpful suggestions, I plan to add those to my spreadsheet.
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Old 12-05-19, 06:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Carbonfiberboy
When I did my test, the doc said I had the physiology of a fit 43 y.o. And I should stop worrying.

The simplest monitor for training stress is to take your orthostatic HR every morning, without fail, and record it in your training log. After getting up and peeing, lie back down with your HRM. Allow your HR to drop as low as it's going to go. I'd give it maybe 5 minutes. It's very important to image calming things, meditate. That's your morning resting HR, MRHR. Then stand, note the exact time and keep watching your HRM. After you stand, your HR will go up to a peak, then decline, then go back up again. Stand for 3 minutes and take your average HR for the last 30" of that three minutes. That's your morning standing heart rate, MSHR. The difference between them is your morning orthostatic HR. Two things to watch. If your MRHR goes up 6-8 beats above completely rested, you're on the edge of overdoing it. If your orthostatic HR climbs over 20, same thing. My orthostatic normally varies between 8 and 13 beats. This test is easy to do and well documented as a tell. It'll take a few weeks to document what's normal and what is not, but it's another handle on the problem.

The other simple tell is to hit a hill really hard after maybe 1/2 hour of riding and watch your HR. You're already doing that. But when your HR won't come up, it's nothing wrong with your heart, you just need more rest before pushing it that hard. IME.
Thanks very much, that is very interesting to me. I think I'll try it. The only thing I might add is that these numbers can be quite fluid (pardon the pun), depending on overall volume/fluid status. Did you get up and chug a half-gallon of skim milk at 3 AM? Did you not only not eat dinner, but also for whatever reason have not had any meaningful fluids in twelve hours? So on and so forth. Anyhoo, all this intravascular volume stuff is important to bear in mind whenever you are looking at any kind of heart rate numbers.
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Old 12-05-19, 08:22 PM
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Originally Posted by bpcyclist
Thanks very much, that is very interesting to me. I think I'll try it. The only thing I might add is that these numbers can be quite fluid (pardon the pun), depending on overall volume/fluid status. Did you get up and chug a half-gallon of skim milk at 3 AM? Did you not only not eat dinner, but also for whatever reason have not had any meaningful fluids in twelve hours? So on and so forth. Anyhoo, all this intravascular volume stuff is important to bear in mind whenever you are looking at any kind of heart rate numbers.
I don't see a difference from food or fluid intake. OTOH my habits are very regular. I always eat and drink about the same amounts at the same time from evening on. On the bike, I'll see increased HR from dehydration but that goes away quickly with rehydration. I will sometimes see slightly anomalous MRHR numbers, but they don't seem to affect the orthostatic. I don't use any one thing as gospel.

If anyone wants to try that Elite HRV app, the best tell I get from that app is to take it standing for 5 minutes (Open Reading), then look at my HF power. That seems to be the one thing which fluctuates most reliably with training or other physiological stress. That number going through the floor was my first warning that I was coming down with polymyalgia rheumatica, long before it was diagnosed. HF power correIates with the happiness of one's parasympathetic system. I take my Morning Readiness, then the Open Reading. I add the two RMSSDs together and record that.
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Old 02-04-20, 06:07 AM
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To me life has already ended when one becomes an invalid so there is no reason to prolong it. I would rather have a shorter but healthy life while I live than a long life hobbling on an aluminum walker with a beer belly and dementia in a nursing home.
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Old 02-04-20, 08:27 AM
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Originally Posted by drbarney1
To me life has already ended when one becomes an invalid so there is no reason to prolong it. I would rather have a shorter but healthy life while I live than a long life hobbling on an aluminum walker with a beer belly and dementia in a nursing home.
Could not say it better.
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Old 02-05-20, 08:19 PM
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Originally Posted by big john
Forget the 220-age rule.
Originally Posted by bpcyclist
And use what?
Originally Posted by Machka
Find your own max HR.

According to that “rule,” my max HR should be 163. And yet, last summer I averaged that HR over a gravel race that took over four hours. I think my max HR for the year was 187. So, no, that rule is bogus.

Oh, and I don’t worry about dying of a heart attack while cycling. I worry about dying in a hospital while hooked up to a bunch of machines.
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