I have narrowed it down to 2 bikes, and I still feel lost (pls help)
02-07-20, 06:32 AM
#26
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Advice for a complete beginner:
Once you have crossed the $1000 threshold, you're usually getting a great bike. You can get a LOT of gravel bike for under $2k. In the price range you are looking at, you're getting lighter, more pricey components, which will really only benefit you if you are racing at a competition level. Weight differences on bikes under 30lbs are insignificant in practice if you aren't climbing big hillls all day long.
As others have suggested, you probably won't get it right on your first bike, and bikes lose a lot of resale value the second they leave the showroom. I'd strongly recommend something along the lines of a Marin nicasio or a salsa journeyman before you take such an expensive plunge into a component level you won't really benefit from as a complete beginner.
Once you have crossed the $1000 threshold, you're usually getting a great bike. You can get a LOT of gravel bike for under $2k. In the price range you are looking at, you're getting lighter, more pricey components, which will really only benefit you if you are racing at a competition level. Weight differences on bikes under 30lbs are insignificant in practice if you aren't climbing big hillls all day long.
As others have suggested, you probably won't get it right on your first bike, and bikes lose a lot of resale value the second they leave the showroom. I'd strongly recommend something along the lines of a Marin nicasio or a salsa journeyman before you take such an expensive plunge into a component level you won't really benefit from as a complete beginner.
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02-07-20, 10:24 AM
#27
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Beginner, narrowed it down to two bikes, bikes are dissimilar, haven't ridden either bike, doesn't understand the terminology that describes each bike, bikes range $3k-$5k...
I think you're in for a very expensive lesson..
Better to buy a used, well-reviewed(on Bike Forums), well regarded $1k bike and ride the heck out of it. If you feel it's limiting your riding, then take a $3k-$5k bike for a ride and compare them to the base of experience you've developed. If/when you decide to trade up, your $1k used bike will still be worth $750.
I think you're in for a very expensive lesson..
Better to buy a used, well-reviewed(on Bike Forums), well regarded $1k bike and ride the heck out of it. If you feel it's limiting your riding, then take a $3k-$5k bike for a ride and compare them to the base of experience you've developed. If/when you decide to trade up, your $1k used bike will still be worth $750.
02-07-20, 10:47 AM
#28
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1) Same way you would buying new, by trying the bike out. and looking at it Don't buy used carbon if you aren't confident in being able to spot problems. Metal frame defects tend to be pretty obvious. If you can't test ride, don't buy.
2) Requires local knowledge--ask the LBS if they do this, but you would also need to know if they can be trusted. I know of shops near me that really don't do anything but service, so if they're at all good, they'd have no dog in the fight.
I have to ask--have you actually ridden ANY bike yet? Right now, this is like trying to explain to someone who's never walked what to look for in a pair of shoes. You learn what works for you by trying things on, not by reading.
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02-07-20, 10:51 AM
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1) Same way you would buying new, by trying the bike out. and looking at it Don't buy used carbon if you aren't confident in being able to spot problems. Metal frame defects tend to be pretty obvious. If you can't test ride, don't buy.
2) Requires local knowledge--ask the LBS if they do this, but you would also need to know if they can be trusted. I know of shops near me that really don't do anything but service, so if they're at all good, they'd have no dog in the fight.
I have to ask--have you actually ridden ANY bike yet? Right now, this is like trying to explain to someone who's never walked what to look for in a pair of shoes. You learn what works for you by trying things on, not by reading.
2) Requires local knowledge--ask the LBS if they do this, but you would also need to know if they can be trusted. I know of shops near me that really don't do anything but service, so if they're at all good, they'd have no dog in the fight.
I have to ask--have you actually ridden ANY bike yet? Right now, this is like trying to explain to someone who's never walked what to look for in a pair of shoes. You learn what works for you by trying things on, not by reading.
02-07-20, 10:57 AM
#30
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See, now you have a benchmark to work with--feel better, worse or same than what you've tried.
Note what the saddle is on the Infinito or any other ones you try that seem good. If you have to swap one out, it'll be great to know ones that suit you.
No one here is going to be able to tell you whether you're going to like any bike in 6 months. It's up to you how much money you want to put on that bet.
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02-07-20, 11:47 AM
#31
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1X means it has a single chainring on the crank. 2X means 2 chainrings. A book could be written about why one is better then the other, or you could search this forum and get a feel for what people think and the experiences folks have.
Its immensely helpful to have a LBS (Local bike shop) where you trust the sales folks to help steer you into a bike that’s right for you, your experience level and budget. Also one that isn’t going to sell you the $4200 Orbea when a bike less than half the price fits you better and that you like on a test ride.
Attending the beginner nature of the purchase, is your skill level also at the beginner level ?, in terms or your ability to not get into a crash while you learn the particulars of riding off a paved road ?. That too drives the decision to maybe not spend as much at this stage.
And since you are in Canada, do look at Norco bikes. Great products, great value. A Canadian company whose bikes are not well represented in the US, so you read less about them.
This has a nice feature set and it’s red, which everybody knows is faster.
https://www.norco.com/bikes/2020/roa.../search-xr-a1/
Its immensely helpful to have a LBS (Local bike shop) where you trust the sales folks to help steer you into a bike that’s right for you, your experience level and budget. Also one that isn’t going to sell you the $4200 Orbea when a bike less than half the price fits you better and that you like on a test ride.
Attending the beginner nature of the purchase, is your skill level also at the beginner level ?, in terms or your ability to not get into a crash while you learn the particulars of riding off a paved road ?. That too drives the decision to maybe not spend as much at this stage.
And since you are in Canada, do look at Norco bikes. Great products, great value. A Canadian company whose bikes are not well represented in the US, so you read less about them.
This has a nice feature set and it’s red, which everybody knows is faster.
https://www.norco.com/bikes/2020/roa.../search-xr-a1/
That looks like a nice bike with a decent set of components. Even I, a confirmed steel bike fan who prefers a more retro look, would seriously consider that Norco. Plus the website has good info.
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02-07-20, 03:12 PM
#32
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@aabb----as you can see, a Lot of posters recommend buying a cheaper bike to start with and then learning what you really like.
Why? because it just makes sense, and because a lot of people have bought the "wrong" bike.
You say you have checked out some bikes and made a decision to a couple .... but don't know the most basic stuff about those bikes or bikes in general (by the way, bravo for admitting that. honest people are the best.)
This i why people have been advising you to ride a season and learn what you Really like, as opposed to what you Think you'd like .....
And if you aren't even sure what "fit" feels like to You ... how can you possibly know that the bike you are buying fits/ The folks in the shop might have their own ideas about how people "should" ride .... but they don't know how you Like to ride ... and neither do you.
I have ridden that bike which was a dream for 45 minutes and a torture device after 60. it can happen. And while no one here knows you, we all pretty much want to help you enjoy an activity we all find highly enjoyable on many levels.
But whatever you do, you won't end up buying a "bad" bike. You might get a bike which doesn't do what you really want it to as well as some other ... but you will still be able to ride it. You won't get a bike which doesn't fit at all ... but you might get a bike which is not great for longer rides, or which fits less and less well as you gain strength and ability.
I would definitely suggest buying a Fuiji Sportiv, or giant Contend with Sora .... both should fit 32-mm tires, both a re solid bikes at slightly better prices than Trek, Spec, or Cannondale ... and both would give you a good baseline. The next year, demote the bike to 'rain bike" and buy whatever you really want.
You may find that you need a dedicated, high-BB, 1X, gravel bike with really low gearing, not suited to the road but perfect for the muddy hills you love to climb. Or ... you might find that you really don't ride much gravel and you like a more road-oriented bike with two chain rings for a wider range of gears, but still clearance for a comfortable tire which won't sink into the occasional dirt trail. You might decide you need a pure mountain bike, because road riding just isn't any fun.
But .... if you insist on spending multiple thousands of dollars on your first bike, that is fine. Yo won't buy a 'bad" bike if you listen at all.and whatever you buy, you will be able to enjoy it some .... and probably quite a bit.
When i started daily commuting with some distance riding, I rode a lot of very compromised bicycles .... bikes I made work because I needed working bikes. Many were far from optimal, and many weren't much good beyond the length of my daily commute---but so long as I got where I needed to be, i didn't care.
After i got financially stable, I Knew what bikes I wanted, and i bought them. I know what fit for different uses, and I know what I liked to do with bikes.
And I never started with a $4000 bike. You will have to compromise a lot less than I did. So whatever .... you will almost certainly enjoy what you buy. You might waste some money, but that isn't my concern.
I, and I think everyone here, hopes that if you really want to ride, that you get that chance, and if it turns out that you are "one of us," one of that group of people who enjoy cycling ... great. Welcome aboard.
Why? because it just makes sense, and because a lot of people have bought the "wrong" bike.
You say you have checked out some bikes and made a decision to a couple .... but don't know the most basic stuff about those bikes or bikes in general (by the way, bravo for admitting that. honest people are the best.)
This i why people have been advising you to ride a season and learn what you Really like, as opposed to what you Think you'd like .....
And if you aren't even sure what "fit" feels like to You ... how can you possibly know that the bike you are buying fits/ The folks in the shop might have their own ideas about how people "should" ride .... but they don't know how you Like to ride ... and neither do you.
I have ridden that bike which was a dream for 45 minutes and a torture device after 60. it can happen. And while no one here knows you, we all pretty much want to help you enjoy an activity we all find highly enjoyable on many levels.
But whatever you do, you won't end up buying a "bad" bike. You might get a bike which doesn't do what you really want it to as well as some other ... but you will still be able to ride it. You won't get a bike which doesn't fit at all ... but you might get a bike which is not great for longer rides, or which fits less and less well as you gain strength and ability.
I would definitely suggest buying a Fuiji Sportiv, or giant Contend with Sora .... both should fit 32-mm tires, both a re solid bikes at slightly better prices than Trek, Spec, or Cannondale ... and both would give you a good baseline. The next year, demote the bike to 'rain bike" and buy whatever you really want.
You may find that you need a dedicated, high-BB, 1X, gravel bike with really low gearing, not suited to the road but perfect for the muddy hills you love to climb. Or ... you might find that you really don't ride much gravel and you like a more road-oriented bike with two chain rings for a wider range of gears, but still clearance for a comfortable tire which won't sink into the occasional dirt trail. You might decide you need a pure mountain bike, because road riding just isn't any fun.
But .... if you insist on spending multiple thousands of dollars on your first bike, that is fine. Yo won't buy a 'bad" bike if you listen at all.and whatever you buy, you will be able to enjoy it some .... and probably quite a bit.
When i started daily commuting with some distance riding, I rode a lot of very compromised bicycles .... bikes I made work because I needed working bikes. Many were far from optimal, and many weren't much good beyond the length of my daily commute---but so long as I got where I needed to be, i didn't care.
After i got financially stable, I Knew what bikes I wanted, and i bought them. I know what fit for different uses, and I know what I liked to do with bikes.
And I never started with a $4000 bike. You will have to compromise a lot less than I did. So whatever .... you will almost certainly enjoy what you buy. You might waste some money, but that isn't my concern.
I, and I think everyone here, hopes that if you really want to ride, that you get that chance, and if it turns out that you are "one of us," one of that group of people who enjoy cycling ... great. Welcome aboard.
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02-10-20, 08:29 PM
#33
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I had a major warranty problem with Orbea, they refused to warranty their scandium frame after it cracked at the headtube within the first year of use, they claimed it was fatigue and thus no warranty? If you don't care about the warranty then I guess Orbea might be in the running for you, but I think I would rather have the Bianchi personally.
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02-10-20, 09:59 PM
#34
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@aabb----as you can see, a Lot of posters recommend buying a cheaper bike to start with and then learning what you really like.
Why? because it just makes sense, and because a lot of people have bought the "wrong" bike.
You say you have checked out some bikes and made a decision to a couple .... but don't know the most basic stuff about those bikes or bikes in general (by the way, bravo for admitting that. honest people are the best.)
This i why people have been advising you to ride a season and learn what you Really like, as opposed to what you Think you'd like .....
And if you aren't even sure what "fit" feels like to You ... how can you possibly know that the bike you are buying fits/ The folks in the shop might have their own ideas about how people "should" ride .... but they don't know how you Like to ride ... and neither do you.
I have ridden that bike which was a dream for 45 minutes and a torture device after 60. it can happen. And while no one here knows you, we all pretty much want to help you enjoy an activity we all find highly enjoyable on many levels.
But whatever you do, you won't end up buying a "bad" bike. You might get a bike which doesn't do what you really want it to as well as some other ... but you will still be able to ride it. You won't get a bike which doesn't fit at all ... but you might get a bike which is not great for longer rides, or which fits less and less well as you gain strength and ability.
I would definitely suggest buying a Fuiji Sportiv, or giant Contend with Sora .... both should fit 32-mm tires, both a re solid bikes at slightly better prices than Trek, Spec, or Cannondale ... and both would give you a good baseline. The next year, demote the bike to 'rain bike" and buy whatever you really want.
You may find that you need a dedicated, high-BB, 1X, gravel bike with really low gearing, not suited to the road but perfect for the muddy hills you love to climb. Or ... you might find that you really don't ride much gravel and you like a more road-oriented bike with two chain rings for a wider range of gears, but still clearance for a comfortable tire which won't sink into the occasional dirt trail. You might decide you need a pure mountain bike, because road riding just isn't any fun.
But .... if you insist on spending multiple thousands of dollars on your first bike, that is fine. Yo won't buy a 'bad" bike if you listen at all.and whatever you buy, you will be able to enjoy it some .... and probably quite a bit.
When i started daily commuting with some distance riding, I rode a lot of very compromised bicycles .... bikes I made work because I needed working bikes. Many were far from optimal, and many weren't much good beyond the length of my daily commute---but so long as I got where I needed to be, i didn't care.
After i got financially stable, I Knew what bikes I wanted, and i bought them. I know what fit for different uses, and I know what I liked to do with bikes.
And I never started with a $4000 bike. You will have to compromise a lot less than I did. So whatever .... you will almost certainly enjoy what you buy. You might waste some money, but that isn't my concern.
I, and I think everyone here, hopes that if you really want to ride, that you get that chance, and if it turns out that you are "one of us," one of that group of people who enjoy cycling ... great. Welcome aboard.
Why? because it just makes sense, and because a lot of people have bought the "wrong" bike.
You say you have checked out some bikes and made a decision to a couple .... but don't know the most basic stuff about those bikes or bikes in general (by the way, bravo for admitting that. honest people are the best.)
This i why people have been advising you to ride a season and learn what you Really like, as opposed to what you Think you'd like .....
And if you aren't even sure what "fit" feels like to You ... how can you possibly know that the bike you are buying fits/ The folks in the shop might have their own ideas about how people "should" ride .... but they don't know how you Like to ride ... and neither do you.
I have ridden that bike which was a dream for 45 minutes and a torture device after 60. it can happen. And while no one here knows you, we all pretty much want to help you enjoy an activity we all find highly enjoyable on many levels.
But whatever you do, you won't end up buying a "bad" bike. You might get a bike which doesn't do what you really want it to as well as some other ... but you will still be able to ride it. You won't get a bike which doesn't fit at all ... but you might get a bike which is not great for longer rides, or which fits less and less well as you gain strength and ability.
I would definitely suggest buying a Fuiji Sportiv, or giant Contend with Sora .... both should fit 32-mm tires, both a re solid bikes at slightly better prices than Trek, Spec, or Cannondale ... and both would give you a good baseline. The next year, demote the bike to 'rain bike" and buy whatever you really want.
You may find that you need a dedicated, high-BB, 1X, gravel bike with really low gearing, not suited to the road but perfect for the muddy hills you love to climb. Or ... you might find that you really don't ride much gravel and you like a more road-oriented bike with two chain rings for a wider range of gears, but still clearance for a comfortable tire which won't sink into the occasional dirt trail. You might decide you need a pure mountain bike, because road riding just isn't any fun.
But .... if you insist on spending multiple thousands of dollars on your first bike, that is fine. Yo won't buy a 'bad" bike if you listen at all.and whatever you buy, you will be able to enjoy it some .... and probably quite a bit.
When i started daily commuting with some distance riding, I rode a lot of very compromised bicycles .... bikes I made work because I needed working bikes. Many were far from optimal, and many weren't much good beyond the length of my daily commute---but so long as I got where I needed to be, i didn't care.
After i got financially stable, I Knew what bikes I wanted, and i bought them. I know what fit for different uses, and I know what I liked to do with bikes.
And I never started with a $4000 bike. You will have to compromise a lot less than I did. So whatever .... you will almost certainly enjoy what you buy. You might waste some money, but that isn't my concern.
I, and I think everyone here, hopes that if you really want to ride, that you get that chance, and if it turns out that you are "one of us," one of that group of people who enjoy cycling ... great. Welcome aboard.
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02-11-20, 01:42 AM
#35
Senior Member
If you have to order before test riding, you may as well save money and buy online. Testriding is the only real value an LBS adds and they seem to deprive you of that.
As others said, try a cheaper or used one to know what you want. That way you get to know your local paths and can jufge better what gearing, tire size etc. you want. It is nice to have a $4K bike, but unless your paycheck depends on being on a podium, a $2K bike will be 99% good.
Also keep in mind expensive race bikes geometry is made for very fit racers that like to suffer for 1 hour to gain 2 seconds, they are not made for comfort. Same way a Ferrari, as great as it may be, isn't a great errand car.
Besides fit, I personally would choose for widest tire clearance frame and fork allow. With larger tires frame material matters less for comfort.
As others said, try a cheaper or used one to know what you want. That way you get to know your local paths and can jufge better what gearing, tire size etc. you want. It is nice to have a $4K bike, but unless your paycheck depends on being on a podium, a $2K bike will be 99% good.
Also keep in mind expensive race bikes geometry is made for very fit racers that like to suffer for 1 hour to gain 2 seconds, they are not made for comfort. Same way a Ferrari, as great as it may be, isn't a great errand car.
Besides fit, I personally would choose for widest tire clearance frame and fork allow. With larger tires frame material matters less for comfort.
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02-11-20, 04:40 PM
#36
Full Member
Apologies if this is in the wrong section, its my first time posting here. I am in the process of purchasing my first gravel bike in a very long time. I have tried numerous times to ask those questions to bike shops, but I keep getting conflicting answers. I suspect they are just trying to move inventory without being completely honest with me.
Anyways, I have narrowed my gravel bike list down to 2 options. I enjoy the look/aesthetics of both bikes (particularly the Bianchi), and aesthetics matter a lot to me. If I am paying this much, then I want something that looks good if ya know what I mean.
One has a special type of aluminum frame (Bianchi Impulso GRX-600), and the other comes with a carbon fiber frame and also higher end components (Orbea Terra M20-D IX). As a beginner, the Terra might be too much bike for me, but the price difference between the Terra and Bianchi is not that significant given the many improvements on the Terra. And I take good care of what I am passionate about, so I am contemplating saving a bit more to get the Terra (Bianchi is $3,200 and the Terra M20-D IX is $4,800 CAD). I'm going to post my questions below
1) Carbon Fiber vs. Aluminum. I heard the purpose of carbon fiber is performance only. Also, from what I know, aluminum is more practical. A bike shop I recently visited advised me that an aluminum frame is better for a gravel bike, given its more practical nature and that if something happens it would be less 'serious' and cheaper to fix. Is this true? And does carbon fiber only matter for performance (I'm not going to race)? Does it not have any other benefits?
2) Warranty. Bianchis come with a 5 year frame warranty, while the Orbea has a lifetime frame warranty. I understand those warranties cover only manufacturer defects, but: should this be a critical factor when deciding between the two? Does the lifetime frame warranty translate to a better product in the long term (otherwise why is Bianchi offering only 5 years?)?
3) Better components. The Orbea also comes with better components in almost every other respect, which is expected given the price difference. As a beginner and someone who does not intend to race, should I be aiming for these better components since money is no issue, or will getting the better components be useless as I won't utilize them to their full potential given that I'm a beginner and non-racer?
3) Opinion/Experience. If anyone has owned/owns either of those two (or just if you have any opinion), I would appreciate your input very much on any other aspect that you wish to share.
Thanks in advance!
Anyways, I have narrowed my gravel bike list down to 2 options. I enjoy the look/aesthetics of both bikes (particularly the Bianchi), and aesthetics matter a lot to me. If I am paying this much, then I want something that looks good if ya know what I mean.
One has a special type of aluminum frame (Bianchi Impulso GRX-600), and the other comes with a carbon fiber frame and also higher end components (Orbea Terra M20-D IX). As a beginner, the Terra might be too much bike for me, but the price difference between the Terra and Bianchi is not that significant given the many improvements on the Terra. And I take good care of what I am passionate about, so I am contemplating saving a bit more to get the Terra (Bianchi is $3,200 and the Terra M20-D IX is $4,800 CAD). I'm going to post my questions below
1) Carbon Fiber vs. Aluminum. I heard the purpose of carbon fiber is performance only. Also, from what I know, aluminum is more practical. A bike shop I recently visited advised me that an aluminum frame is better for a gravel bike, given its more practical nature and that if something happens it would be less 'serious' and cheaper to fix. Is this true? And does carbon fiber only matter for performance (I'm not going to race)? Does it not have any other benefits?
2) Warranty. Bianchis come with a 5 year frame warranty, while the Orbea has a lifetime frame warranty. I understand those warranties cover only manufacturer defects, but: should this be a critical factor when deciding between the two? Does the lifetime frame warranty translate to a better product in the long term (otherwise why is Bianchi offering only 5 years?)?
3) Better components. The Orbea also comes with better components in almost every other respect, which is expected given the price difference. As a beginner and someone who does not intend to race, should I be aiming for these better components since money is no issue, or will getting the better components be useless as I won't utilize them to their full potential given that I'm a beginner and non-racer?
3) Opinion/Experience. If anyone has owned/owns either of those two (or just if you have any opinion), I would appreciate your input very much on any other aspect that you wish to share.
Thanks in advance!
Carbon fiber isn't really just for performance since companies can simply build more aero and sexier bike IMO with carbon compared to aluminium or other metals. It's true carbon can be lighter, stronger, and stiffer yet it could be noted it isn't the most crash resilient matter. The horror stories of carbon randomly failing is overblown but detecting cracks in carbon sometimes can be near impossible since most bikes are painted. That's not to say metal bikes can't fail but honestly I would never buy a used carbon frame or bike while I would trust buying a metal bike used
As per warranties, one ask yourself how long you actually think you will be keeping this bike, but also realize warranties are kind of BS. Frankly you will be at the discretion of the local rep to approve or deny your claim. Also bike's limited warranties have so many caveats now a days that simply any claim could be denied within reason. With this being said I would pick the bike based on your LBS's relationship with each vendor. If your LBS sells tons of "X" my thought process is that whatever rep will be more likely to warranty your bike based on your LBS sales.
02-14-20, 11:12 PM
#37
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the problem is people have such strong opinions of carbon fiber bikes and they guide people in the wrong direction , the problem with carbon is people are trying to sell you it and they will do anything to get the sale , so sometimes you buy carbon and its worse than a alu , and the other way around , if you do buy carbon id look for info on a fram analysis by a professional engineer im sure there are some articles or youtube videos on the actual reality of the carbon frame you want to buy , but in practice carbon is the best material , and im prety sure you cant fix alumimun if it cracks , you can take more hit on alu though , i think when choosing between bike its better to go with the cheaper frame and use the extra money to buy better parts and wheels !
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02-17-20, 09:15 AM
#39
Senior Member
All else being equal, buy the bike you think is prettiest.
Regarding cost, I'm still riding bikes I bought in the mid-1990s.
I sometimes regret that I bought a Gary Fisher Mamba instead of a Big Sur. This was back in 1996. The Big Sur was about $200 more, but had much better components.
If you are still single, remember that it will be a lot more difficult to get new toys once you are married.
Regarding cost, I'm still riding bikes I bought in the mid-1990s.
I sometimes regret that I bought a Gary Fisher Mamba instead of a Big Sur. This was back in 1996. The Big Sur was about $200 more, but had much better components.
If you are still single, remember that it will be a lot more difficult to get new toys once you are married.
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02-17-20, 10:27 AM
#40
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At that price I would recomend buying 3 Surly's.
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02-18-20, 10:21 PM
#41
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All else being equal, buy the bike you think is prettiest.
Regarding cost, I'm still riding bikes I bought in the mid-1990s.
I sometimes regret that I bought a Gary Fisher Mamba instead of a Big Sur. This was back in 1996. The Big Sur was about $200 more, but had much better components.
If you are still single, remember that it will be a lot more difficult to get new toys once you are married.
Regarding cost, I'm still riding bikes I bought in the mid-1990s.
I sometimes regret that I bought a Gary Fisher Mamba instead of a Big Sur. This was back in 1996. The Big Sur was about $200 more, but had much better components.
If you are still single, remember that it will be a lot more difficult to get new toys once you are married.
02-18-20, 10:25 PM
#42
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Also I should say that I'm going to be at the Toronto biking show in March (the first day only, which I believe is a Friday). Great to see everything all in one place. I may buy there, I don't know. Unlikely as I may not get one-on-one customer service in regards to the fitting in particular (I heard this event is busy?).
02-19-20, 12:19 PM
#43
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Bianchi for the win. I'm looking forward to your review.
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