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Do you put patched tubes back in your saddlebag?

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Do you put patched tubes back in your saddlebag?

Old 01-14-21, 08:06 PM
  #151  
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Originally Posted by cyccommute View Post
I I even mark my tubes beforehand with an arrow to indicate rotation direction so that whatever caused the puncture is easier to find.

As I stated a while ago, I have yet to find these mythic $2 tubes.
Clever. I may take that up.
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Old 01-15-21, 12:21 PM
  #152  
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Originally Posted by WinterCommuter View Post
funny. I honestly donít think weíre that far apart.

I have to admit that itís been years since iíve ridden a patched tube very far. I quit riding patched tubes long, long ago. i was riding tubs when i realized how funky a patched tube felt and i did some time track time.

i have in fact found tubes for $2 something recently enough that i quit worrying about the cost of a tube. A co2 inflator usually costs me more than a cheap, spare tube. Does that give me the best possible ride? Absolutely not, but itís how i roll.

When i mount new tires, i put on new, light weight tubes or reuse the old ones (If itís a cheapo, back in the kit). After the first flat, i run the cheapo tube until i replace the tire.

I donít flat often and i prefer cheap, new tubes in my kit. First, they might sit there for a long time. Second, they often end up on someone elseís wheel: stranger need help or friend too. I prefer giving away cheap, new tubes.
There is no such thing as a $2 lightweight tube unless you think 120 plus grams is lightweight. Yes, I know that Walmart and Amazon sells the Bell brand of tubes for $2, but they weigh 160 grams! My tubes weigh 75 grams but they cost $11 each though I get mine on sale for 4 for $33. Why do the Bell weigh 160 grams? obviously, they're thicker, but their wall thickness is not consistent like more expensive tubes thus they had to make the wall thicker to make up for thin spots.

We all know that having a lighter wheel makes the rolling resentence less, in fact going with lighter tires and tubes is the cheapest way to get that, so if you want that for your bike then go lighter, if none of that matters other than buying cheap tubes and cheap tires then do the cheap tires and tubes thing. Don't let a bunch of cycling morons discredit your opinion if that's how you want to run.
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Old 01-15-21, 01:00 PM
  #153  
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No I put a new tube in. For me the $4 in savings isn't worth the peace of mind knowing that the new tube won't still have a slow leak, or can't handle the high pressure I put in my tires. When I was a teenager I probably wasn't doing it right but I had a couple patches let go on long rides.
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Old 01-15-21, 01:38 PM
  #154  
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Originally Posted by rekmeyata View Post
There is no such thing as a $2 lightweight tube unless you think 120 plus grams is lightweight. Yes, I know that Walmart and Amazon sells the Bell brand of tubes for $2, but they weigh 160 grams! My tubes weigh 75 grams but they cost $11 each though I get mine on sale for 4 for $33. Why do the Bell weigh 160 grams? obviously, they're thicker, but their wall thickness is not consistent like more expensive tubes thus they had to make the wall thicker to make up for thin spots.

We all know that having a lighter wheel makes the rolling resentence less, in fact going with lighter tires and tubes is the cheapest way to get that, so if you want that for your bike then go lighter, if none of that matters other than buying cheap tubes and cheap tires then do the cheap tires and tubes thing. Don't let a bunch of cycling morons discredit your opinion if that's how you want to run.
agreed. I donít think i ever said $2 tubes are lightweight. If so, my bad. I also mostly agree with you about rolling resistance/rotational inertia. Iím simply saying that i carry new, cheap tubes in my kits, not patched or otherwise lighter, more expensive tubes. I did the same in my road/track racing days: high quality tubs on my wheels, cheaper/heavier tubs under the saddle for limping home.
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Old 01-15-21, 08:09 PM
  #155  
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Originally Posted by WinterCommuter View Post
agreed. I donít think i ever said $2 tubes are lightweight. If so, my bad. I also mostly agree with you about rolling resistance/rotational inertia. Iím simply saying that i carry new, cheap tubes in my kits, not patched or otherwise lighter, more expensive tubes. I did the same in my road/track racing days: high quality tubs on my wheels, cheaper/heavier tubs under the saddle for limping home.
When I use to race I did so on tubular tires, we had cheap cotton threaded tires we trained on and then race on silk tubs, but they all used virtually the same latex tubes inside. Of course, this was back in the 70's and 80's. Since then I went to clinchers, and I use the same tube regardless if a spare or not, why? because like I mentioned before, I don't like doing things twice, so when I put my spare tube in the tire it stays there and will be my main tube till whenever I have to switch again, so I use the same brand, weight of tube to keep everything consistent. I've never known anybody who raced that used a cheaper tube to train on or as a backup.
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Old 01-15-21, 08:10 PM
  #156  
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Originally Posted by cbrstar View Post
No I put a new tube in. For me the $4 in savings isn't worth the peace of mind knowing that the new tube won't still have a slow leak, or can't handle the high pressure I put in my tires. When I was a teenager I probably wasn't doing it right but I had a couple patches let go on long rides.
This is just you saying that you don't know how to patch a tube correctly, that's all this is saying.
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Old 01-17-21, 07:31 PM
  #157  
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Originally Posted by rekmeyata View Post
This is just you saying that you don't know how to patch a tube correctly, that's all this is saying.
I'm sure like many people. Sorry it's just not worth the cost of a cup of coffee to be riding around on shoddy old tubes to me. Lets turn this around for a second. Why are all these guys not re-installing the old tube and putting the new one back in the saddle bag? So they can get that extra mileage out of their old tube, and keep the new one new?
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Old 01-17-21, 09:59 PM
  #158  
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Originally Posted by cbrstar View Post
I'm sure like many people. Sorry it's just not worth the cost of a cup of coffee to be riding around on shoddy old tubes to me. Lets turn this around for a second. Why are all these guys not re-installing the old tube and putting the new one back in the saddle bag? So they can get that extra mileage out of their old tube, and keep the new one new?
Shoddy old tubes? so if you get a flat on a brand new tube that you bought yesterday and got a flat today, it's now a shoddy old tube? Let's hear some more excuses.
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Old 01-17-21, 11:22 PM
  #159  
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Originally Posted by rekmeyata View Post
Shoddy old tubes? so if you get a flat on a brand new tube that you bought yesterday and got a flat today, it's now a shoddy old tube? Let's hear some more excuses.

If you are getting two flats in two days you are doing something wrong. You are either either installing the tube wrong or your wheel rim has some damage. And yes if it has a hole in the tube and it's junk to me, I'd rather buy a new one. Same with the tire if it's got a big hole in it I would prefer to replace it ASAP. But I'm sure you are one of those guys that thinks a tire should be duct taped and the hole in the side wall of your car tire is OK to be plugged.


If you are getting constant flats maybe you should spring a extra few bucks and get a self sealing tube.
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Old 01-17-21, 11:40 PM
  #160  
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Originally Posted by cbrstar View Post
If you are getting two flats in two days you are doing something wrong. You are either either installing the tube wrong or your wheel rim has some damage. And yes if it has a hole in the tube and it's junk to me, I'd rather buy a new one. Same with the tire if it's got a big hole in it I would prefer to replace it ASAP. But I'm sure you are one of those guys that thinks a tire should be duct taped and the hole in the side wall of your car tire is OK to be plugged.
So where did you come up with this ďonly one flat a weekĒ rule? Iíve had 2 flats in 10 minutes less than 100 yards apart. And, no, the flats werenít related.
I donít agree with people who say that flats occur in one location but there is nothing that says you canít have more than one flat every other day. Iíve had more than 65 flats (I stopped counting at 65) in a single day...in a 16 mile ride. I ran out of tubes, patches and ended up carrying the bike for the last mile. Flats are a completely random event for which you canít plan. Saying that they fit some kind of schedule is just silly.
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Old 01-17-21, 11:48 PM
  #161  
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Originally Posted by cbrstar View Post
Why are all these guys not re-installing the old tube and putting the new one back in the saddle bag? So they can get that extra mileage out of their old tube, and keep the new one new?
That's exactly what I do. The saddle bag always has new tubes in it. The patched tubes get tested on an old wheel with an old tire at max pressure for a couple days to prove the patch is good, then they go on a hook in the garage.

Every time I do wheel maintenance I put a patched and tested tube in the tire. When I get home from a ride with a flat, I take out the spare/replacement tube and put in a tested patched one.

A patched tube has some higher probability of failing than an unpatched tube; most of the bickering in here is about the magnitude of that probability. I'm getting some quantum benefit from having good-as-new unpatched tubes in my bag rather than patched ones.

I have 5 sets of wheels and I'd wager all of them have patched tubes in them right now - except for the sew-ups.
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Old 01-18-21, 12:16 AM
  #162  
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I've gone tubeless now, but I would patch then continue my ride. Later on, I would start carrying an extra tube because some punctures or failures can't be patched.
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Old 01-18-21, 11:21 AM
  #163  
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Originally Posted by cbrstar View Post
If you are getting two flats in two days you are doing something wrong. You are either either installing the tube wrong or your wheel rim has some damage. And yes if it has a hole in the tube and it's junk to me, I'd rather buy a new one. Same with the tire if it's got a big hole in it I would prefer to replace it ASAP. But I'm sure you are one of those guys that thinks a tire should be duct taped and the hole in the side wall of your car tire is OK to be plugged.


If you are getting constant flats maybe you should spring a extra few bucks and get a self sealing tube.
Nonsense; anyway, but this going on back and forth with your very stupid comments is getting tiring, crap like duct tape? I never mentioned doing that and it's just stupid that you would even bring that up, if you want to replace a perfectly fine new tube after a pinhole leak that's your thing, your probably one of those guys who bought a $15,000 bike using your pocket change, but I don't waste money like that just because a tube has a small hole, besides it's irresponsible to the environment to throw out perfectly fine tubes that end up in the waste, have a nice day.
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Old 01-18-21, 11:36 AM
  #164  
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Originally Posted by WinterCommuter View Post
i also use park glueless patches. I agree they work better than most. Perhaps you are more meticulous than me. I find that a new tube always works for the life of the tube. ;-)
I used to use Park's glueless patches, but had trouble with them sliding around in hot weather (melting from the heat of the pavement, I'm guessing).

Now, this was almost a decade ago, so maybe they improved their chemistry, but for me, while a bit more hassle, the Rema patch kits have always been the best.
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Old 01-18-21, 12:04 PM
  #165  
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Originally Posted by cyccommute View Post
So where did you come up with this ďonly one flat a weekĒ rule? Iíve had 2 flats in 10 minutes less than 100 yards apart. And, no, the flats werenít related.
I donít agree with people who say that flats occur in one location but there is nothing that says you canít have more than one flat every other day. Iíve had more than 65 flats (I stopped counting at 65) in a single day...in a 16 mile ride. I ran out of tubes, patches and ended up carrying the bike for the last mile. Flats are a completely random event for which you canít plan. Saying that they fit some kind of schedule is just silly.
Well maybe I don't do as much cycling as you, or maybe I live in a part of the world with better roads. But I think I have had less then 10 flats in 30 years of cycling. The two instances where I got consecutive flats where both wheel related. One was the rim had a slight crack right at the weld. And the other the rim strip was old and had shifted and one of the spokes was rubbing against the tube. Another weird instance was that I still enjoy doing BMX racing. I had bought a brand new set of really hard to get high pressure tires that were $100cdn each but I used the old tube from last years race season. Well as I was filing it up to the 100psi the tube exploded!! it was like a shotgun blast going off by my head. My ears rang for a good 5 minutes, and worst of all the blast was so bad it actually ripped the bead off the tire and the tire was shot. So now when ever I buy new tires I also buy new tubes. Rubber sadly degrades and breaks down over time.
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Old 01-18-21, 01:10 PM
  #166  
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Originally Posted by cbrstar View Post
Well maybe I don't do as much cycling as you, or maybe I live in a part of the world with better roads. But I think I have had less then 10 flats in 30 years of cycling.
My flats have almost nothing to do with the conditions of the roads. They are all related to what is on the roads or on the places where I ride bikes. We have goat heads throughout the area where I ride most and, if you donít have them, thank your lucky stars. I occasionally get flats from glass and I occasionally get flats from wires off of steel belted tires. Cactus spines also take their toll.

My main point, however, is that flats arenít something that is planned nor something that is uncommon.

The two instances where I got consecutive flats where both wheel related. One was the rim had a slight crack right at the weld. And the other the rim strip was old and had shifted and one of the spokes was rubbing against the tube. Another weird instance was that I still enjoy doing BMX racing. I had bought a brand new set of really hard to get high pressure tires that were $100cdn each but I used the old tube from last years race season. Well as I was filing it up to the 100psi the tube exploded!! it was like a shotgun blast going off by my head. My ears rang for a good 5 minutes, and worst of all the blast was so bad it actually ripped the bead off the tire and the tire was shot. So now when ever I buy new tires I also buy new tubes. Rubber sadly degrades and breaks down over time.
I can see some problems I can see with your tale about the blowout. Blowouts arenít caused by a tube rupturing inside the tire. That never happens. If the tube were old enough that it were to crack in the tire and release air, it wouldnít blow the tire off the rim. Iíve seen tubes rupture because of a bad rim strip and those are relatively quite ďpopsĒ, not loud bangs.

A very loud blowout is related to either the tube being trapped between the rim and the tire where it forces the tire off the rim and ruptures. Thatís a very common mistake and is always user error. Iíve done it but Iíve never blamed the tire.

Your statement that you ripped the bead off the tire says to me that it could also be a defective tire. I have had blowouts on (supposedly) high quality tires that were the result of the tire just not staying on the rim. But the tire never experienced damage. Iíve also experienced cases where the fabric was inproperly cured or was improperly wrapped around the bead and slipped off. That did result in tire damage. But, in both cases, the tube was not responsible for the blowout nor has a trapped tube ever resulted in tire damage.

Tubes donít degrade in tires. The tire makes a really good barrier to most everything that would damage the rubber of a tube. Iíve pulled perfectly good tubes out of severely decayed tires from 1980s bikes. The tube, in some cases, was probably OEM. The tire was mostly just cord but the tube was fine.
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Old 01-19-21, 12:23 AM
  #167  
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Originally Posted by cbrstar View Post
I had bought a brand new set of really hard to get high pressure tires that were $100cdn each but I used the old tube from last years race season. Well as I was filing it up to the 100psi the tube exploded!! it was like a shotgun blast going off by my head. My ears rang for a good 5 minutes, and worst of all the blast was so bad it actually ripped the bead off the tire and the tire was shot. So now when ever I buy new tires I also buy new tubes. Rubber sadly degrades and breaks down over time.
Originally Posted by cyccommute View Post
I can see some problems I can see with your tale about the blowout. Blowouts arenít caused by a tube rupturing inside the tire. That never happens. If the tube were old enough that it were to crack in the tire and release air, it wouldnít blow the tire off the rim. Iíve seen tubes rupture because of a bad rim strip and those are relatively quite ďpopsĒ, not loud bangs.

A very loud blowout is related to either the tube being trapped between the rim and the tire where it forces the tire off the rim and ruptures. Thatís a very common mistake and is always user error. Iíve done it but Iíve never blamed the tire.
Exactly! Above is the statement that does not pertain to the tube quality but to the operator and their two layers of error. One error was in failing to check enough the seating of the beads and the second in failing to watch the rise of the tire. Failures provide chance to learn, but this one was missed as the problem did not not inspected to resolution, just blame put on the tube.
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Old 01-19-21, 02:09 AM
  #168  
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Originally Posted by cyccommute View Post
My flats have almost nothing to do with the conditions of the roads. They are all related to what is on the roads or on the places where I ride bikes. We have goat heads throughout the area where I ride most and, if you donít have them, thank your lucky stars. I occasionally get flats from glass and I occasionally get flats from wires off of steel belted tires. Cactus spines also take their toll.

My main point, however, is that flats arenít something that is planned nor something that is uncommon.



I can see some problems I can see with your tale about the blowout. Blowouts arenít caused by a tube rupturing inside the tire. That never happens. If the tube were old enough that it were to crack in the tire and release air, it wouldnít blow the tire off the rim. Iíve seen tubes rupture because of a bad rim strip and those are relatively quite ďpopsĒ, not loud bangs.

A very loud blowout is related to either the tube being trapped between the rim and the tire where it forces the tire off the rim and ruptures. Thatís a very common mistake and is always user error. Iíve done it but Iíve never blamed the tire.

Your statement that you ripped the bead off the tire says to me that it could also be a defective tire. I have had blowouts on (supposedly) high quality tires that were the result of the tire just not staying on the rim. But the tire never experienced damage. Iíve also experienced cases where the fabric was inproperly cured or was improperly wrapped around the bead and slipped off. That did result in tire damage. But, in both cases, the tube was not responsible for the blowout nor has a trapped tube ever resulted in tire damage.

Tubes donít degrade in tires. The tire makes a really good barrier to most everything that would damage the rubber of a tube. Iíve pulled perfectly good tubes out of severely decayed tires from 1980s bikes. The tube, in some cases, was probably OEM. The tire was mostly just cord but the tube was fine.
Well fast forward to about 1min and you can see simular situation
of what happened to me.
Many of the new bmx tires dont have the metal wire in the bead anymore. Maybe if it had the damage wouldn't been as bad?
If the tire wasn't seated right then it would have come off the rim much sooner. And I agree that a tube is sealed in the tire making it last longer. But again I think its where you live. Being in Canada we get extreme temperatures from super cold to super hot. And I really believe it's all in how it's stored over the winter.
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Old 01-19-21, 08:30 AM
  #169  
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Originally Posted by cbrstar View Post
Well fast forward to about 1min and you can see simular situation of what happened to me.
Many of the new bmx tires dont have the metal wire in the bead anymore. Maybe if it had the damage wouldn't been as bad?
If the tire wasn't seated right then it would have come off the rim much sooner. And I agree that a tube is sealed in the tire making it last longer. But again I think its where you live. Being in Canada we get extreme temperatures from super cold to super hot. And I really believe it's all in how it's stored over the winter.
Are you kidding?! Again a similar situation to yours of carelessness. I live next to close to Canadian border and most Canadian live close to their southern border. I ride all winter long when ridership drops down by a factor 100-300. My bikes are stored in an unheated garage. My riding temperatures span so far -30C to 43C. The latter have been typical daily temperatures at my base in Asia and in Africa close to that. No blowouts for me or anybody else tied to those temperatures. For tires that you use in touring, it is common to have kevlar beads rather than wire, so that you can fold them easier for your luggage.
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Old 01-19-21, 09:56 AM
  #170  
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Originally Posted by cbrstar View Post
Well fast forward to about 1min and you can see simular situation of what happened to me.
Many of the new bmx tires dont have the metal wire in the bead anymore. Maybe if it had the damage wouldn't been as bad?
If you look closely while he is pumping up the tire, you can see the tube has herniated out of the tire. It looks to me like a section about 6Ē long at the bottom of the wheel. Itís very obvious that the tire hadnít been seated on the rim properly. Perhaps if he had been paying attention to what he was doing rather than fiddling with a phone, he would have spotted the tube coming out.

Folding tires are very common and they use a Kevlar bead. I have never seen a folding tire have bead damage because of the nature of the flexible bead. Tires that are rigid and hold their round shape are wire bead. The bike in the video has a wire bead.

I will say that a folding tire...or any tire...can be damaged around the bead if you use the wrong tools to install or remove the tire. If you use a knife or screwdriver to do tire removal or installation, you can damage the sidewall. The tire casing is just a fabric that has been impregnated with rubber and, if damaged, it will act like fabric. In other words, it can tear.

The bottom line however, is that the video above is user error and not the fault of the tire or tube. A patched tube would respond just like an unpatched tube. If the tire were installed correctly, there would have been no blow out.

[/QUOTE]If the tire wasn't seated right then it would have come off the rim much sooner. And I agree that a tube is sealed in the tire making it last longer. But again I think its where you live. Being in Canada we get extreme temperatures from super cold to super hot. And I really believe it's all in how it's stored over the winter.[/QUOTE]

How long it takes for a tire to slip off if it is installed incorrectly depends on a number of factors. Iíve had tires blow off when after 15 minutes...scared all of my co-workers... as well as others than have blown out in seconds. Iíve had some tires that donít seat well...mostly 20 inch wheels from HelMart...where I can see the tube sneaking out and Iíve been able to deflate the tire before a blowout. The rubber of a tire is a fairly high friction material so it can take a while for enough of the bead to unseat prior to the blowout.

As to temperatures, my tubes are stored in my garage. The temperature fluctuates widely as well. That really has little effect on the rubber. Youíd have to get to much higher temperatures than even the warmest summer day to have much effect on the rubber. Cold temperatures have zero effect on the rubber and would even prolong the life of the tube. You can damage a tube by taking it out of the box and leaving it sitting around or leaving it in direct sunlight for a very long time (years). Store them in a closed container and in a dark area and they will last for a very long time.
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Old 01-19-21, 12:51 PM
  #171  
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Originally Posted by 2_i View Post
Are you kidding?! Again a similar situation to yours of carelessness. I live next to close to Canadian border and most Canadian live close to their southern border. I ride all winter long when ridership drops down by a factor 100-300. My bikes are stored in an unheated garage. My riding temperatures span so far -30C to 43C. The latter have been typical daily temperatures at my base in Asia and in Africa close to that. No blowouts for me or anybody else tied to those temperatures. For tires that you use in touring, it is common to have kevlar beads rather than wire, so that you can fold them easier for your luggage.
I think that's the thing. If you are riding them in winter you are keeping them inflated and I think it's when they are cold and uninflated that it's possible to get cracks. But maybe I'm wrong? I know I used to take them for granted over the winter but I don't anymore. I'm not using my bike everyday for transportation like I think a lot of the people in this thread are. For me it's when I get a weekend off work and I want to take a short couple hundred km trip somewhere. Or I am traveling to the next city for a BMX race or cruise around town with some buddies. The possible down time will cost me way more then it's worth.

It might be a surprise but I also do collect and restore vintage bikes. I've noticed that sometimes a pull a tube out of a old wheel and it still smells good, but sometimes they smell awful and I believe it's the rubber breaking down.
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Old 01-19-21, 02:39 PM
  #172  
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Originally Posted by cbrstar View Post
I think that's the thing. If you are riding them in winter you are keeping them inflated and I think it's when they are cold and uninflated that it's possible to get cracks. But maybe I'm wrong? I know I used to take them for granted over the winter but I don't anymore. I'm not using my bike everyday for transportation like I think a lot of the people in this thread are. For me it's when I get a weekend off work and I want to take a short couple hundred km trip somewhere. Or I am traveling to the next city for a BMX race or cruise around town with some buddies. The possible down time will cost me way more then it's worth.

It might be a surprise but I also do collect and restore vintage bikes. I've noticed that sometimes a pull a tube out of a old wheel and it still smells good, but sometimes they smell awful and I believe it's the rubber breaking down.
Rubber really isnít going to fracture because of the cold at most any temperature youíll encounter on this planet. Rubber doesnít become hard enough to crack until you get to around -220įF (-150įC). Thatís near liquid nitrogen temperatures (-320įF,-196įC)
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Old 01-19-21, 05:45 PM
  #173  
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Originally Posted by cbrstar View Post
I think that's the thing. If you are riding them in winter you are keeping them inflated and I think it's when they are cold and uninflated that it's possible to get cracks. But maybe I'm wrong? I know I used to take them for granted over the winter but I don't anymore. I'm not using my bike everyday for transportation like I think a lot of the people in this thread are. For me it's when I get a weekend off work and I want to take a short couple hundred km trip somewhere. Or I am traveling to the next city for a BMX race or cruise around town with some buddies. The possible down time will cost me way more then it's worth.

It might be a surprise but I also do collect and restore vintage bikes. I've noticed that sometimes a pull a tube out of a old wheel and it still smells good, but sometimes they smell awful and I believe it's the rubber breaking down.
I have different bikes that I ride on different occasions. Sometimes I do not use a bike for 2 years, sometimes locally and sometimes because it is away from my central base. When I pump the tires again after 2 years, nothing blows up and then nothing after another 2 years. I have racks of tires and boxes of tubes of different age. Yes, the rubber ages, but not on the scale of a year, but a decade and that depends on details, as was discussed. Various devices in everyday life have rubber rollers inside and belts and you do not run all the time changing them. Yes, eventually they will die but the time scale tends to be such that at the everyday level you can forget that they are there. For vintage bikes, aging rubber and plastic can become of a concern.
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Old 01-19-21, 09:37 PM
  #174  
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Originally Posted by notmyke View Post
I used to use Park's glueless patches, but had trouble with them sliding around in hot weather (melting from the heat of the pavement, I'm guessing).

Now, this was almost a decade ago, so maybe they improved their chemistry, but for me, while a bit more hassle, the Rema patch kits have always been the best.
I never had that issue in the heat and I use to live in the Mojave Desert area of California where it wasn't uncommon for me to be out riding in 100 degree plus weather, and that was from 1987 to 2003, but I didn't start using glueless patches till sometime around 1995ish.
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Old 01-20-21, 01:28 AM
  #175  
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Happened once when my bike was just sitting in the car, too. Maybe I wasn't cleaning the rubber well enough (?).

But yeah - in both cases, I'd check out the old tube and it wouldn't be leaking anywhere, except from around that patch (which had been holding fine for a few rides prior). How that happens at 110psi... no idea.
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