djb

Vegan, you were too fast, I was going to insult CF also.

dont know what you're doing with your patching techniques, I have probably ten year old patches working fine. Just following the straightforward steps of light sanding the same area space as patch, putting on glue that covers a bit more than patch size and letting dry completely in 5 mins or less, then pushing patch firmly on, rolling out any air and holding tightly for a few mins , and thats it.

79pmooney

(Scratches head) Using the ubiquitous REMA patchkits purchased this millennia, I have a close to 100% success doing nothing very rigorously. I do try to keep greasy hands away from the repair area and do a reasonable sanding job. Two coats of glue letting dry probably not enough time. I don't remove the clear plastic figuring it protects the patch from sticking to the tire. (Most of my failures are clearly because I rushed the drying.)

cyccommute 

There’s your problem. Don’t use “different glues and patches”. Use Rema...glue and patches...and nothing else. Rema has chemistry on its side since it isn’t just “glue” but actually uses chemistry to form rubber bonds. Everything else is the equivalent of rubber cement and old tubes. And works about as well.

In the current market, patching is about the only way to go. New tubes are getting extremely rare in stores. Even the wholesalers are out of tubes, especially in 26” sizes. Even patch kits are difficult to find.

However, even without shortages, $8 is a bunch to spring on a flat. I have tubes that have as many as 25 patches on them. At $8 a pop, that $200...and I have multiple tubes with nearly that many holes. I have boxes of 100 Rema patches (two sizes) that cost me about $30. Glue costs me about $10 for that many patches, so $40 all in. 200 tubes at $8 each would cost me $1600. That’s a whole bike.

Carbonfiberboy 

Another REMA patch and glue user. I get them bulk from Amazon! The usual issue is insufficient sanding and seams on inferior tubes. The seams have to be sanded flat and the whole area sanded until the texture is completely changed from smooth to sanded. I use 80 grit wet-or-dry, not because I use water but because it's the longest lasting paper for this use. My business used a lot of sandpaper so I have about a ream of it in the supplies cabinet. Since I buy the patches in bulk, they don't come with paper. I save an old patch kit box for the REMA patches, glue, and my paper. Sounds rather elaborate, but never had a patch failure, never. My answer to the patch number question is either 6 or until the damage is too great to be fixed by one of the dime-sized REMA patches or it's a patch on a patch or a snake-bite. I always toss snake-bit tubes. IMO putting a too-large or double patch on a tube stretches the tube too much and might weaken it.

If one does a lot of riding, consumables do become an noticeable expense - brake pads, tubes, tires, lube, etc. Patches and glue are not a noticeable expense.

veganbikes

Yeah I have done basically all of that. I use Rema glue actually. I for a while tried different stuff to see what might work best. I always heard excellent things about Rema so I have largely stuck with that. Maybe I rushed the drying but I had a tube that I didn't use for a couple days to allow things to bond and still no luck. Maybe I should try again sometime next time I have a flat. I tried on that last one to be really methodical and careful with no rushing. Maybe I am just not a patcher. Ho hum not a big deal.

I guess I don't have Cyco's unlucky tube streak.

djb

you cant rush the drying, it has to be dry
maybe you are putting waaaay too much glue on, and it takes forever to dry

its a pretty straightforward procedure, and no need to say that maybe youre not a patcher, just get the steps right. Once you get it right, its a skill like any other that you'll remember for the rest of your life

cyccommute 

If you want as many patches per tube, you just need to live where the goatheads grow. You get good at it with all the practice.

You can’t let it dry too long. I’ve forgotten about tubes in the middle of a patch job and have gone weeks before I applied the patch. It still worked.

Darth Lefty 

Tooooooobless

(runs away)

gergokee

If you want as many patches per tube, you just need to live where the goatheads grow.

djb

interesting to know, I've never really thought about it, but good to bring up simply to reinforce the idea and concept to people the importance of letting the glue dry so as to allow for a proper bonding (counter intuitive to all of our life experience with glue)

cyccommute 

The lack of tubes doesn’t make tubeless less prone to punctures. The sealant in the tubeless tire does that job. I could put the same sealant in the tube...without all the attendant hassles of doing tubeless...but I’m not a fan of sealant in general.

Additionally, I have 8 bikes. If I did tubeless for all of them, I spend all my time dealing with the maintenance of 16 tubeless tires every 3 to 6 months. No thanks.

Rogerogeroge

So you have 25 tubes that each have up to 25 patches? So that's up to 625 patches? I realize all tubes don't have 25 patches in each of them.....
I still think toobless is the way to go. I find it's more of an annual maintenance task, and has to be way easier than patching 300 flats. Are goatheads the culprit?

veganbikes

I am good without goat-heads. The potholes are plenty.

Maybe I will let it dry more, next time.

cyccommute 

No, I was comparing the cost of 2 boxes of 100 patches (200 total) to the cost of 200 tubes.

We’ll just have to agree to disagree. I find tubeless to be a royal pain to deal with when I’ve had to deal with them at my local co-op.

Amt0571

I always patch if possible. If I'm in a hurry (going to work, for example) I replace the tube and patch later at home.

I've had tubes with 6 or 7 patches, but by that point they mostly end up with irrepairable damage some way or another. Mountain bike tubes tend to last me a lot more than road bike ones. It's the only component in my mountain bike that regularly exceeds the life of the road bike equivalent.

Tubes may be cheap, but patching has 2 advantages:
1. Is enviromentally friendlier.
2. It lets me keep my spare tube in case the one I'm running gets some unpatchable damage. I like being able to ride home.

WT160

I hated patching years ago. The new peel-and-sticks are amazing. Much better!

Swampthing 

In Covid times I’m a patcher.
my bikes and my kids.
About %50 of the tubes I was able to score back in June have failed at the valve.
I must have bought a bunch of no quality control Friday afternoon tubes. Now my tubes are getting patches when possible. My daughter’s bike is her only form of transportation. And since she is now on the other side of the continent, she now has a set of tannus equipped wheels. She actually prefers the ride over gatorskins on the city streets.

djb

I beg to differ, and many other people do also. Glueless patches have a reputation not to last very long, certainly not worth the hassle down the road of having to deal with a slow leak or simply taking a tube out again, compared to just doing an easy regular patch job at home that will last for years and years, having put in your good spare tube on the road after getting a flat.

coffeecherrypie

something must be off with the way you're doing it. riv has a good video: https://vimeo.com/125176770

zacster

I bought a bulk quantity of Rema glue and patches so I would never have to look for a tube of glue again that wasn’t dried out. I patch my tubes as long as I can. A valve problem or a hole too close to the valve makes me throw them out, or sometimes if I screw up a patch.

the best way to not get flats though is to buy tubes in bulk. You’ll never get another flat if you have 5 brand new tubes in boxes.

thesongs

That's interesting, how well does that work as a type of extra skin?