What bikes compete with the Kona Sutra?
#52
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It's a very nice shop, we've had our other bikes in for some work there and were quite pleased with the service.
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Djb, thanks for the indepth response and link to your report on Marathon Supremes. Yep, I probably should've just gone with this "smaller" size right then and there but, there was another thing which I couldn't factor into my evaluation because it was such a new concept to me - the included Brooks B17 saddle.
Tourist in MSN, yeah, toe-overlap just isn't an issue. Mondials for touring: never, for me. The knobs are fatiguing for me to ride on hardpack surfaces.
Wiggle, coming from the '99 Trek 520, one of the ugliest bikes I've ever seen, the pastel-mint of the Sutra is welcome.
I.B.Roots, good to know, thanks!
Tourist in MSN, yeah, toe-overlap just isn't an issue. Mondials for touring: never, for me. The knobs are fatiguing for me to ride on hardpack surfaces.
Wiggle, coming from the '99 Trek 520, one of the ugliest bikes I've ever seen, the pastel-mint of the Sutra is welcome.
I.B.Roots, good to know, thanks!
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I actually got it from Pictou County Cycle. They are near my parents house. Cyclesmith can do warranty work on Trek though which is great cause they are very close to our home.
It's a very nice shop, we've had our other bikes in for some work there and were quite pleased with the service.
It's a very nice shop, we've had our other bikes in for some work there and were quite pleased with the service.
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My 1999 Trek 520 frame measures 28 inches from ground surface to where the top of the top-tube meets the seat-tube. I'm not sure what size frame that is but it was either a 17 inch or 19 inch, the two smallest sizes of that year. Sitting on this bike and holding onto something to keep myself upright, I can foresee my toe possibly contacting a fender. I can't be sure though. Kona doesn't think it will happen with the Sutra, and its tires are even wider than my 35mm. Jamis doesn't think it will happen with the Aurora Elite (thanks for the suggestion, Ndrose. I hadn't heard of that one).
Fenders (and disc brakes) are the main reason I want an upgrade from my 1999 Trek 520, so I will probably only try bikes that are already setup with them. Fenders with tires no narrower than 35mm.
I was hoping to stay with 700 wheels because that's what I'm accustomed to riding. I would think smaller wheels will make the bicycle more squirrely at higher speeds, in comparison to 700.
If it comes with a road triple, I'll be glad to have the 52t chainring and just swap one (or both of the) other(s) to get the bike that does everything that I want.
Fenders (and disc brakes) are the main reason I want an upgrade from my 1999 Trek 520, so I will probably only try bikes that are already setup with them. Fenders with tires no narrower than 35mm.
I was hoping to stay with 700 wheels because that's what I'm accustomed to riding. I would think smaller wheels will make the bicycle more squirrely at higher speeds, in comparison to 700.
If it comes with a road triple, I'll be glad to have the 52t chainring and just swap one (or both of the) other(s) to get the bike that does everything that I want.
if you are small enough to use a frame Surly only offers 26 inch rims, I would no go with 700s.
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I purposely bought a 56cm LHT with 26 inch rims. It is in no way squirrely at high speeds, in fact, I used to commute on it, and hit 40-45mph every day on the downhills. It was rock solid, loaded or unloaded. I love it, and it has performed well on tours.
if you are small enough to use a frame Surly only offers 26 inch rims, I would no go with 700s.
if you are small enough to use a frame Surly only offers 26 inch rims, I would no go with 700s.
I'm already set on the Sutra. The shop has both frame sizes that I should be considering, and I tried and liked one of them already. I'll be getting it tomorrow.
Last edited by Nyah; 04-29-20 at 08:01 AM.
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the Kona sutra is a great touring bike, and was one of the ones I was seriously considering, along with the Masi Giramondo 700c, and the Salsa Marrakesh, in the end the Masi Giramondo 700c won because there is nothing I needed to change on the bike to make it work for me unlike the others I mentioned, the ones I didn't mentioned required a lot more changes. The only things I have to change on the Masi is the seat, the pedals, and the tires, but it's good to go on a tour right out of the box.
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Now, that Masi Giramondo IS very close to the Sutra. Several of the parts are even identical, too. I like the Giramondo rear rack more than the one on the Sutra, because I'd be able to put a wire basket there more easily (something I usually do for everyday riding), because the top is flat (it flares upward on the Sutra). The chainrings are lower-geared on the Giramondo. Some people are preferring that. I'm glad for what the Sutra has though, as I will be keeping the 48/36 and change only the smallest one to something smaller. I have to congratulate Masi for realizing that metallic paint is in demand. Kona made a nice choice of avocado green though (the white in the online photos is false). Thank you, Greatscott, for suggesting the Masi Giramondo. That is certainly one which competes with the Kona Sutra. Too late for me, as I already got the Sutra before seeing your post. But good for the record.
700c bicycles for every height! NO good reason to limit oneself to 26" wheel bicycles, unless you're really close to the shorter end of the height spectrum. I've had no problems controlling my Trek 520, and none so far with my Kona Sutra. I'm somewhere 5'6" or 5'7" tall and, with the minimalist shoes that I exclusively wear, am probably, effectively closer to the height of a shorter test rider of this bicycle.
700c bicycles for every height! NO good reason to limit oneself to 26" wheel bicycles, unless you're really close to the shorter end of the height spectrum. I've had no problems controlling my Trek 520, and none so far with my Kona Sutra. I'm somewhere 5'6" or 5'7" tall and, with the minimalist shoes that I exclusively wear, am probably, effectively closer to the height of a shorter test rider of this bicycle.
Last edited by Nyah; 02-15-20 at 10:15 PM.
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Kona Sutra I just bought one
I just bought one and it’s a very nice touring bike. Please note that this bike runs “large”, or, a 54 cm in another brand is gonna be a 52. You HAVE to try one of the Konas for size. Important. Also, if you are small, you might be better served on bike w 26 “ wheels. I travel the mountains and I had the front triple chainring changed to 40/32/22. It is a really amazing spread of gears. 16.9 low to 100 high. Perfect for me. Bike is heavy and very strong. Like a 4x4 compared to sports car. With this gearing and wheel combo it can do a lot of different things well
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I just bought one and it’s a very nice touring bike. Please note that this bike runs “large”, or, a 54 cm in another brand is gonna be a 52. You HAVE to try one of the Konas for size. Important. Also, if you are small, you might be better served on bike w 26 “ wheels. I travel the mountains and I had the front triple chainring changed to 40/32/22. It is a really amazing spread of gears. 16.9 low to 100 high. Perfect for me. Bike is heavy and very strong. Like a 4x4 compared to sports car. With this gearing and wheel combo it can do a lot of different things well
Others who share the same opinion, please explain to me why you do.
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Why smaller rider smaller wheel
[QUOTE=Nyah;21331860]Can you explain why you think small persons might be better off with a 26er? I have already disagreed with other people who suggested that, because I've been fine with 700c bicycles so far. Please address this part of your post.
Others who share the same opinion, please explain to me why you do.[/QUOTE
@@@@@well I’m not an engineer, but I do know that geometry changes with the scale of the bike as do turning radius and center of gravity. There is some info I’ve read plus the fact that smaller versions of several tourers have smaller wheel option. I’ve ridden lots of different bikes and I prefer larger wheels for the ride, but I’m about 5’8” and it almost feels too large, the 29s on the 52 cm sutra. I had a Decathalon 27.5 inch mtb as well and it was a great ride. I went w the 29” (measured tire circumference = 27.5!!!) because I’m more of an on road climber type than a gravel / road type tourer. Your call. Maybe try another kona at the bike shop w 27.5s? No right answer, just best trade off. You can also run 27.5s on the kona (is there an actual diameter difference?) if you end up going more off road gravel
Others who share the same opinion, please explain to me why you do.[/QUOTE
@@@@@well I’m not an engineer, but I do know that geometry changes with the scale of the bike as do turning radius and center of gravity. There is some info I’ve read plus the fact that smaller versions of several tourers have smaller wheel option. I’ve ridden lots of different bikes and I prefer larger wheels for the ride, but I’m about 5’8” and it almost feels too large, the 29s on the 52 cm sutra. I had a Decathalon 27.5 inch mtb as well and it was a great ride. I went w the 29” (measured tire circumference = 27.5!!!) because I’m more of an on road climber type than a gravel / road type tourer. Your call. Maybe try another kona at the bike shop w 27.5s? No right answer, just best trade off. You can also run 27.5s on the kona (is there an actual diameter difference?) if you end up going more off road gravel
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Why smaller rider smaller wheel
[QUOTE=Nyah;21331860]Can you explain why you think small persons might be better off with a 26er? I have already disagreed with other people who suggested that, because I've been fine with 700c bicycles so far. Please address this part of your post.
Others who share the same opinion, please explain to me why you do.[/QUOTE
@@@@@well I’m not an engineer, but I do know that geometry changes with the scale of the bike as do turning radius and center of gravity. There is some info I’ve read plus the fact that smaller versions of several tourers have smaller wheel option. I’ve ridden lots of different bikes and I prefer larger wheels for the ride, but I’m about 5’8” and it almost feels too large, the 29s on the 52 cm sutra. I had a Decathalon 27.5 inch mtb as well and it was a great ride. I went w the 29” (measured tire circumference = 27.5!!!) because I’m more of an on road climber type than a gravel / road type tourer. Your call. Maybe try another kona at the bike shop w 27.5s? No right answer, just best trade off. You can also run 27.5s on the kona (is there an actual diameter difference?) if you end up going more off road gravel
Others who share the same opinion, please explain to me why you do.[/QUOTE
@@@@@well I’m not an engineer, but I do know that geometry changes with the scale of the bike as do turning radius and center of gravity. There is some info I’ve read plus the fact that smaller versions of several tourers have smaller wheel option. I’ve ridden lots of different bikes and I prefer larger wheels for the ride, but I’m about 5’8” and it almost feels too large, the 29s on the 52 cm sutra. I had a Decathalon 27.5 inch mtb as well and it was a great ride. I went w the 29” (measured tire circumference = 27.5!!!) because I’m more of an on road climber type than a gravel / road type tourer. Your call. Maybe try another kona at the bike shop w 27.5s? No right answer, just best trade off. You can also run 27.5s on the kona (is there an actual diameter difference?) if you end up going more off road gravel
#64
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Can you explain why you think small persons might be better off with a 26er? I have already disagreed with other people who suggested that, because I've been fine with 700c bicycles so far. Please address this part of your post.
Others who share the same opinion, please explain to me why you do.
Others who share the same opinion, please explain to me why you do.
Some say 26ers because if you're in some third world country it's easier to find tires and tubes. I guess that could have some merit. The problem in modern countries, 26 is becoming harder to find
Others say 26ers handle better, I ride all sizes and have not noticed a difference and neither have pro MTB racers who ride with 29s.
Some bring up the fact that smaller circumference means a stronger wheel, this could be, but again, have not seen it
I toured with 26 on a converted MTB and my only negative which has little to do with the wheels, but due to the geometry of the MTB, under a heavy load the bike was not very stable.
People have opinions, it's informative if their opinions are backed up by facts, but for cycling, much of it is subjective.
Just like these:
Frames must be steel
Drop bars and brifters are the only way to go
Front suspension is not beneficial to touring
If you are happy, comfortable and settled with your bike; ride
Now, that there is the newest craze of the "mullet" bike, we could start a whole new thread
Cheers
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*In 1988 there was a reason for the two sizes as gears didn't go all that low (but perhaps lower than what you can get now) and the 24" wheel provided lower gears for better climbing.
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#66
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Everything old is new again Weren't 69ers available just a few years ago (29 front/26 back)? And before that Cannondale had a 64er (26 front/24 back) in 1988*. In all honesty, the 27.5er (a worse name couldn't be found) is admission that the 29er was a bad idea. I fully expect to see a brand new 559er in the near future.
*In 1988 there was a reason for the two sizes as gears didn't go all that low (but perhaps lower than what you can get now) and the 24" wheel provided lower gears for better climbing.
*In 1988 there was a reason for the two sizes as gears didn't go all that low (but perhaps lower than what you can get now) and the 24" wheel provided lower gears for better climbing.
I do know of Terry womans bikes with the smaller front wheels (to help with geometry and toe strike) but those others are news to me, weird and neat.
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This post is not an update on the Sutra, but on another bicycle that someone posting in this thread was considering.
While visiting the REI store in northern Virginia recently, I checked out the Co-op Adv 1.1 bicycle. The one they had in stock actually had cable-actuated disc brake calipers instead of the hydrolic calipers that the website lists. That change makes this bicycle a better value than the Sutra, in my opinion. I would still be looking for a chainring guard though. I wish those came with every crank, even the high-end ones, because I'm not having much luck finding them as aftermarket items.
While visiting the REI store in northern Virginia recently, I checked out the Co-op Adv 1.1 bicycle. The one they had in stock actually had cable-actuated disc brake calipers instead of the hydrolic calipers that the website lists. That change makes this bicycle a better value than the Sutra, in my opinion. I would still be looking for a chainring guard though. I wish those came with every crank, even the high-end ones, because I'm not having much luck finding them as aftermarket items.
Last edited by Nyah; 03-06-20 at 01:40 PM.
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#68
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My Troll touring bike is 26", goes like stink downhill too, even with me, bike and cargo adding up to something around 340lbs. Again it's geometry and frame rigidity that make the difference.
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[INSERT KONA SUTRA PIC (Unfortunately i cant post the picture of my kona as im a new member. sorry guys)]
got my Sutra 2020 yesterday. loving it. its a size 52 and im 5'3. it felt much better than the trek 520 i tried, not sure why.
i went for the sutra over the 520 because of the reasons already highlighted but with a few more:
- existing riders complained of the poor paint finish on the 520 frame. it chips off easily. its a pity really as the diablo red was good looking.
- stock rims are weak. if u do a thorough search, riders complained of the bontrager rims having broken spokes after a few months. 24 spoke 520 vs 32 spoke sutra. no brainer really.
- sutra came stock with schwalbe marathons. a plus for me. had marathon plus on my previous foldie, love the range.
- brooks saddle on the sutra. a plus for me
- ive had wet butts from rainy weather before so the stock fenders on the sutra were a plus for me.
- im not technically good on bicycles as i just started this hobby last year, but people were commenting the gear set on the sutra beats the 520's alivio handsdown. some were even saying trek overcharges the bike with an alivio.
am loving the bike. have to get use to drop bars and the bar end shifters. still cant wrap my head around the purpose of a front derailleur xD
got my Sutra 2020 yesterday. loving it. its a size 52 and im 5'3. it felt much better than the trek 520 i tried, not sure why.
i went for the sutra over the 520 because of the reasons already highlighted but with a few more:
- existing riders complained of the poor paint finish on the 520 frame. it chips off easily. its a pity really as the diablo red was good looking.
- stock rims are weak. if u do a thorough search, riders complained of the bontrager rims having broken spokes after a few months. 24 spoke 520 vs 32 spoke sutra. no brainer really.
- sutra came stock with schwalbe marathons. a plus for me. had marathon plus on my previous foldie, love the range.
- brooks saddle on the sutra. a plus for me
- ive had wet butts from rainy weather before so the stock fenders on the sutra were a plus for me.
- im not technically good on bicycles as i just started this hobby last year, but people were commenting the gear set on the sutra beats the 520's alivio handsdown. some were even saying trek overcharges the bike with an alivio.
am loving the bike. have to get use to drop bars and the bar end shifters. still cant wrap my head around the purpose of a front derailleur xD
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*or whatever replaces the master cylinder in these brakes.
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Kona Sutra my impression
I just bought a kona Sutra (2020 model), after doing a lot of distance riding on 27.5 and 29 inch touring and mtbs. My chief need was a bike that climbed well (very low gears) and I had the standard chainring replaced w 40/32/22 one. Great upgrade and great upgrade lol. It’s a 52 cm frame (im 5’7”/ 173 cm) these frames run large, if local bike shop doesn’t have Sutra in ur size try a similar kona model for sizing. I like the derailleur setup (triple 10 sp and NOT SRAM). I like the brakes, and yes disks work a lot better. I like that large tires can go on it. Bar end shifters are robust and versatile. It’s a heavy bike and it’s large. The 29 inch tires seem less nimble than a 27.5”. It’s a bike that like to go straight. It’s extremely strong and set up like mine you can take it on awful roads dirt gravel etc. ride is good. I recommend this bike
#72
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[INSERT KONA SUTRA PIC (Unfortunately i cant post the picture of my kona as im a new member. sorry guys)]
got my Sutra 2020 yesterday. loving it. its a size 52 and im 5'3. it felt much better than the trek 520 i tried, not sure why.
i went for the sutra over the 520 because of the reasons already highlighted but with a few more:
- existing riders complained of the poor paint finish on the 520 frame. it chips off easily. its a pity really as the diablo red was good looking.
- stock rims are weak. if u do a thorough search, riders complained of the bontrager rims having broken spokes after a few months. 24 spoke 520 vs 32 spoke sutra. no brainer really.
- sutra came stock with schwalbe marathons. a plus for me. had marathon plus on my previous foldie, love the range.
- brooks saddle on the sutra. a plus for me
- ive had wet butts from rainy weather before so the stock fenders on the sutra were a plus for me.
- im not technically good on bicycles as i just started this hobby last year, but people were commenting the gear set on the sutra beats the 520's alivio handsdown. some were even saying trek overcharges the bike with an alivio.
am loving the bike. have to get use to drop bars and the bar end shifters. still cant wrap my head around the purpose of a front derailleur xD
got my Sutra 2020 yesterday. loving it. its a size 52 and im 5'3. it felt much better than the trek 520 i tried, not sure why.
i went for the sutra over the 520 because of the reasons already highlighted but with a few more:
- existing riders complained of the poor paint finish on the 520 frame. it chips off easily. its a pity really as the diablo red was good looking.
- stock rims are weak. if u do a thorough search, riders complained of the bontrager rims having broken spokes after a few months. 24 spoke 520 vs 32 spoke sutra. no brainer really.
- sutra came stock with schwalbe marathons. a plus for me. had marathon plus on my previous foldie, love the range.
- brooks saddle on the sutra. a plus for me
- ive had wet butts from rainy weather before so the stock fenders on the sutra were a plus for me.
- im not technically good on bicycles as i just started this hobby last year, but people were commenting the gear set on the sutra beats the 520's alivio handsdown. some were even saying trek overcharges the bike with an alivio.
am loving the bike. have to get use to drop bars and the bar end shifters. still cant wrap my head around the purpose of a front derailleur xD
1. Stock wheels are 36 spoke on both bikes.
2. The components on the Sutra are higher in the hierarchy but I've had good luck with the Alivio on mind so far, shifting feels smooth. I believe they had to go Alivio to allow for brifters to be used because 10 speed road and mountain groups are not compatible. Only solution seems to be to bring in a microshift brifter to allow use of 10 or 11 speed mountain with a drop-bar brifter. Someone let me know if I'm wrong here though.
3. The Sutra comes stock with Fenders and a better saddle, however 520 comes stock /w front rack.
4. The Bontrager hard-case tires seem pretty good so far. I haven't had any flats but I've only got a few hundred km on them so far. That being said I've ordered in a set of Schwalbe G-One since it seems to allow good on-road performance but improving gravel handling.
Last edited by Wiggle; 04-14-20 at 07:16 AM.
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Congrats on the new bike Couple comments though for anyone considering the 520 or Sutra (as a 520 owner):
1. Stock wheels are 36 spoke on both bikes.
2. The components on the Sutra are higher in the hierarchy but I've had good luck with the Alivio on mind so far, shifting feels smooth. I believe they had to go Alivio to allow for brifters to be used because 10 speed road and mountain groups are not compatible. Only solution seems to be to bring in a microshift brifter to allow use of 10 or 11 speed mountain with a drop-bar brifter. Someone let me know if I'm wrong here though.
3. The Sutra comes stock with Fenders and a better saddle, however 520 comes stock /w front rack.
4. The Bontrager hard-case tires seem pretty good so far. I haven't had any flats but I've only got a few hundred km on them so far. That being said I've ordered in a set of Schwalbe G-One since it seems to allow good on-road performance but improving gravel handling.
1. Stock wheels are 36 spoke on both bikes.
2. The components on the Sutra are higher in the hierarchy but I've had good luck with the Alivio on mind so far, shifting feels smooth. I believe they had to go Alivio to allow for brifters to be used because 10 speed road and mountain groups are not compatible. Only solution seems to be to bring in a microshift brifter to allow use of 10 or 11 speed mountain with a drop-bar brifter. Someone let me know if I'm wrong here though.
3. The Sutra comes stock with Fenders and a better saddle, however 520 comes stock /w front rack.
4. The Bontrager hard-case tires seem pretty good so far. I haven't had any flats but I've only got a few hundred km on them so far. That being said I've ordered in a set of Schwalbe G-One since it seems to allow good on-road performance but improving gravel handling.
hope you enjoy your bike too. ride safe
#74
Mad bike riding scientist
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Denver, CO
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Bikes: Some silver ones, a red one, a black and orange one, and a few titanium ones
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You could change the chainring on a 1x system to get a high gear the same as the triple but the low gear becomes even higher. You could change the chainring so that you have the same low gear as the triple. But, obviously, the high is ridiculously low...spinning out at less than 25mph...which means even more coasting.
Of course you could put a wider range cassette on the 1x with an 11-42 or an 11-50 which would give a better low with the same high. But there is a cost associated with that change. First the cassettes aren’t cheap. A Sunrace 11-42 is $20 to $50, depending on where you get it. A Sunrace 11-50 cassette is closer to $70 to $85. And it doesn’t stop there. The Shimano derailer might not be able to handle the 42 tooth cog and most certainly won’t be able to handle the 50 tooth cog which means a derailer change.
The triple also has an advantage with range. With only a slight change of the inner chainring on the crank, you could get an even better low than stock. Chainring changes are trivial.
Everything isn’t perfect on the triple of the Kona, however. The chainrings on the crank aren’t very well selected. The high is too high. Changing the outer ring to a 44 as well as changing the inner ring gives a shift system that has a pretty good high, a good low and what is close to a half step gearing system. But take a look at the link to the 44/38/22 gearing again. If you look closely, you’ll notice that from any gear you pick, a shift up or down on either the crank or the cassette goes to the either the same or close to the next step down in gear inch ratio. For example, the 44/17 is a 70” gear. The a downshift on the front would result in a 38/17 gear that is a 61” gear. A downshift to the 44/19 gear combination would give a 63” gear which is close enough. Yes, there are a lot of duplicates but that’s not as much of an issue as you think. And the low range gearing is usually used as if it is a 1x any way. If you get into the low range, you usually aren’t shifting to the middle ring and back all that often. You stay there for long periods of time.
__________________
Stuart Black
Plan Epsilon Around Lake Michigan in the era of Covid
Old School…When It Wasn’t Ancient bikepacking
Gold Fever Three days of dirt in Colorado
Pokin' around the Poconos A cold ride around Lake Erie
Dinosaurs in Colorado A mountain bike guide to the Purgatory Canyon dinosaur trackway
Solo Without Pie. The search for pie in the Midwest.
Picking the Scablands. Washington and Oregon, 2005. Pie and spiders on the Columbia River!
Stuart Black
Plan Epsilon Around Lake Michigan in the era of Covid
Old School…When It Wasn’t Ancient bikepacking
Gold Fever Three days of dirt in Colorado
Pokin' around the Poconos A cold ride around Lake Erie
Dinosaurs in Colorado A mountain bike guide to the Purgatory Canyon dinosaur trackway
Solo Without Pie. The search for pie in the Midwest.
Picking the Scablands. Washington and Oregon, 2005. Pie and spiders on the Columbia River!
#75
Newbie
My 2 cents:
I have been looking at the Sutra a lot as of late as a potential replacement to my Fuji Touring. Among the things that I really like of the Sutra is the generous tyre clearance (if memory serves up to 700c*47 at least) which opens up some great options for tours in rougher areas of the world where a 35 simply wouldn't cut it. And in this sense I think only the Salsa Marrakesh has similar clearance.
Not sure how I feel about the geometry: for one I heard that it is "big for its size", aka I would have to go for the 52 to get similar stack and reach to my 54 Fuji. The wheelbase is slightly shorter but the chainstay is longer. I never had particular issues with toe overlap on the front (in the sense that it never bothered me or put me in danger) but I had issues with my heels hitting the back panniers and had to move them further back on the rack.
Something I don't like that much if at all is the choice to go for flat mount disc brakes which limits you to 160 mm. I would personally want the flexibility to mount 180mm or even 200mm on a bike meant for fully loaded cycling.
If the drop bar is negotiable, I would look at the Koga. Yes it's aluminum but those bikes are tanks (check Cyclingabout for some info).
The way I will probably go about it is to reach out to some frame manufacturer in my area and use the things I like from the Sutra as a starting point but expand on it so that it checks each and every box that makes for the perfect touring machine based on my experience/preferences.
I have been looking at the Sutra a lot as of late as a potential replacement to my Fuji Touring. Among the things that I really like of the Sutra is the generous tyre clearance (if memory serves up to 700c*47 at least) which opens up some great options for tours in rougher areas of the world where a 35 simply wouldn't cut it. And in this sense I think only the Salsa Marrakesh has similar clearance.
Not sure how I feel about the geometry: for one I heard that it is "big for its size", aka I would have to go for the 52 to get similar stack and reach to my 54 Fuji. The wheelbase is slightly shorter but the chainstay is longer. I never had particular issues with toe overlap on the front (in the sense that it never bothered me or put me in danger) but I had issues with my heels hitting the back panniers and had to move them further back on the rack.
Something I don't like that much if at all is the choice to go for flat mount disc brakes which limits you to 160 mm. I would personally want the flexibility to mount 180mm or even 200mm on a bike meant for fully loaded cycling.
If the drop bar is negotiable, I would look at the Koga. Yes it's aluminum but those bikes are tanks (check Cyclingabout for some info).
The way I will probably go about it is to reach out to some frame manufacturer in my area and use the things I like from the Sutra as a starting point but expand on it so that it checks each and every box that makes for the perfect touring machine based on my experience/preferences.