Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > Road Cycling
Reload this Page >

Latex Inner Tubes: More Than They're Worth?

Search
Notices
Road Cycling “It is by riding a bicycle that you learn the contours of a country best, since you have to sweat up the hills and coast down them. Thus you remember them as they actually are, while in a motor car only a high hill impresses you, and you have no such accurate remembrance of country you have driven through as you gain by riding a bicycle.” -- Ernest Hemingway

Latex Inner Tubes: More Than They're Worth?

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old 08-16-18, 06:54 PM
  #26  
on the path
Señor Blues
 
on the path's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: upstate NY
Posts: 1,598

Bikes: Cannondale CAAD 10, Breezer Venturi Custom Build, IRO Singlespeed

Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 127 Post(s)
Liked 6 Times in 6 Posts
Originally Posted by Bah Humbug
This is funny, because I'm a monkey with mechanical stuff and never had these issues with Vittoria or Michelin latex tubes. Yank out the existing rim tape and use a double wrap of Stan's, and wide enough that it goes from wall to wall (not whatever's recommended). Slightly pre-inflate the tube prior to installation. Ensure the tube is entirely within the tire before locking the second bead, and ensure the tube is not pinched. I can all but guarantee you that will work, reliably, for as long as you care to use them.

Note also that those are the best practices for butyl tubes as well.
I'm a recent convert, still evaluating. I in about 2 months time I ruined 1 tube. It failed on the side facing the hub. I used a "tubeless type" (Stan's substitute) but only single wrapped it. After failure I re-wrapped the tape, double this time. The tubes are so pliable they protrude into the spoke holes if proper precautions aren't taken. Yes, my pre-ride ritual almost always involves pumping up. I've done that for years. I hope the latex tubes continue to work well. I love how they ride.
on the path is offline  
Old 08-17-18, 12:49 AM
  #27  
tFUnK
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: San Jose, CA
Posts: 3,676

Bikes: Too many bikes, too little time to ride

Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 425 Post(s)
Liked 454 Times in 313 Posts
I've been off and on latex tubes over the past few years. Apart from what has already been mentioned about the ride quality and installation concerns, I will say that the latex will creep out of any holes or cuts in the tire or sidewall, whereas a butyl tube would not. This may be the source of otherwise unobvious "spontaneous" punctures.
​​​​​​The other thing I will say is that latex tubes tend to stretch out over time. If I had used a latex tube in a 25mm tire for some time, there is no way I will be able to reuse that tube in a 23mm tire in the future.
Finally, I will echo that latex tubes are much less prone to typical punctures due to their increased flexibility. I recently found a thorn and a staple that made their way through the tire tread, yet the latex underneath held up.
tFUnK is offline  
Old 08-17-18, 02:03 AM
  #28  
RChung
Perceptual Dullard
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 2,412
Mentioned: 36 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 915 Post(s)
Liked 1,131 Times in 487 Posts
Originally Posted by rubiksoval
Nearly the whole of the professional peloton uses latex tubes (in tubulars). Paris Roubaix, Flanders, Strade Bianchi, etc., etc.
That's true; however, note that the Continental tubulars we can buy are different than the Continental tubulars that pros get. Consumer Conti tubulars have butyl tubes. Damn them.
RChung is offline  
Old 08-17-18, 03:28 PM
  #29  
rubiksoval
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Music City, USA
Posts: 4,444

Bikes: bikes

Mentioned: 52 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2622 Post(s)
Liked 1,429 Times in 711 Posts
Originally Posted by RChung
That's true; however, note that the Continental tubulars we can buy are different than the Continental tubulars that pros get. Consumer Conti tubulars have butyl tubes. Damn them.
Yes! Frustrating! Still not sure how they get away with the Pro LTD version and not go afoul of the UCI general availability/whatchamacallit rule.
rubiksoval is offline  
Old 08-17-18, 06:04 PM
  #30  
macca33
Senior Member
 
macca33's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: West Gippy, Australia
Posts: 607

Bikes: 2017 Ridley Noah SL - Candy Apple DA9000, 2011 CAAD10 Berzerker Ult6800, 2013 FOCUS Mares CX Ult6800

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 26 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
I roll latex in my race wheels and they seem smoother, faster, or perhaps that is the wheels.....
macca33 is offline  
Old 08-17-18, 06:10 PM
  #31  
RChung
Perceptual Dullard
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 2,412
Mentioned: 36 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 915 Post(s)
Liked 1,131 Times in 487 Posts
Originally Posted by rubiksoval
Yes! Frustrating! Still not sure how they get away with the Pro LTD version and not go afoul of the UCI general availability/whatchamacallit rule.
Maybe they qualify under the same rule that allows Sky to use custom 3-D printed stems in oddball exact mm lengths.

Funny that Conti makes such nice consumer-level clinchers and such maddening consumer-level tubulars.
RChung is offline  
Old 08-24-18, 06:20 AM
  #32  
kansukee
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 429
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 122 Post(s)
Liked 51 Times in 27 Posts
And this is why I only ride Veloflex Tubulars. None of that bull**** about messing around with clinchers and tire beads. And I switched to the Efetto Mariposa tape and it's been great so I don't even deal with glue anymore...well only my spare tubs have a layer of Mastik on them, just enough to get me home until I replace the tire. Arenberg and Vlaanderen are the best
kansukee is offline  
Old 08-24-18, 07:59 AM
  #33  
Abe_Froman
Senior Member
 
Abe_Froman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: Chicago
Posts: 2,524

Bikes: Marin Four Corners, 1960's Schwinn Racer in middle of restoration, mid 70s Motobecane Grand Touring, various other heaps.

Mentioned: 76 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 9347 Post(s)
Liked 57 Times in 51 Posts
Originally Posted by wphamilton
Saving 5 watts per tire, probably even more with some of the tubes I use, I would gladly pay the extra cost and put up with the relative fragility. But having to air them up all the time is the deal-killer for me.
The watt savings seems to be less than that, closer to 2 watts per tire. According to this test anyway.

https://www.bicyclerollingresistance...eless-clincher
Abe_Froman is offline  
Old 09-25-18, 08:05 AM
  #34  
bungle73
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Posts: 81
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 24 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times in 1 Post
I found some little cuts in the side of my tyre. I came unstuck on a ride today, when I noticed knobs of inner tube sticking out of the tyre. I was still quite a few miles from home, so there was not much I could do about it at the time. I was hoping my luck would hold out, and I could see to it when I got back - it didn't. Going round a corner closer to home I started hearing a hissing noise, and the tyre went down. I had to take the tube out and put a new one in. I checked that the tube wasn't coming through before I set off again, and hoped it would be enough to get me home. Fortunately it was.

Are the tyres trashed now, or is there something I can do fix it? I'm not that happy about it as I only bought the tyres a few months ago.

I'm going to have to swap back to my other tyres I guess. They're Grand Prix 4 Seasons. Is it worth trying out the latex tubes with them, or are they too heavy duty to make it worth it?

Last edited by bungle73; 09-25-18 at 02:28 PM.
bungle73 is offline  
Old 09-25-18, 12:54 PM
  #35  
redlude97
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 4,764
Mentioned: 28 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1975 Post(s)
Liked 232 Times in 173 Posts
Originally Posted by Abe_Froman
The watt savings seems to be less than that, closer to 2 watts per tire. According to this test anyway.

https://www.bicyclerollingresistance...eless-clincher
4 free watts for $40 is a hell of a deal
redlude97 is offline  
Old 09-25-18, 03:06 PM
  #36  
rubiksoval
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Music City, USA
Posts: 4,444

Bikes: bikes

Mentioned: 52 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2622 Post(s)
Liked 1,429 Times in 711 Posts
Originally Posted by redlude97
4 free watts for $40 is a hell of a deal
40 bucks?! For 2 tubes?! I don't think I've ever paid over 12 bucks a tube, and I've stocked up in the past at $8-$9 a tube.

JensonUSA has them for 10 bucks a pop at the moment.
rubiksoval is offline  
Old 09-30-18, 10:38 PM
  #37  
Litespud
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Chapel Hill NC
Posts: 1,683

Bikes: 2000 Litespeed Vortex Chorus 10, 1995 DeBernardi Cromor S/S

Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 645 Post(s)
Liked 797 Times in 446 Posts
Originally Posted by bungle73
I found some little cuts in the side of my tyre. I came unstuck on a ride today, when I noticed knobs of inner tube sticking out of the tyre. I was still quite a few miles from home, so there was not much I could do about it at the time. I was hoping my luck would hold out, and I could see to it when I got back - it didn't. Going round a corner closer to home I started hearing a hissing noise, and the tyre went down. I had to take the tube out and put a new one in. I checked that the tube wasn't coming through before I set off again, and hoped it would be enough to get me home. Fortunately it was.

Are the tyres trashed now, or is there something I can do fix it? I'm not that happy about it as I only bought the tyres a few months ago.

I'm going to have to swap back to my other tyres I guess. They're Grand Prix 4 Seasons. Is it worth trying out the latex tubes with them, or are they too heavy duty to make it worth it?
They're toast - if you're seeing tube protruding out through the tire, a temporary boot - a wrapper or folded dollar bill - might suffice to get you home, but they're done after that, and an explosive flat waiting to happen.
As to the other question, you might feel a difference using latex tubes in a supple high-thread-count tire like an Open Corsa, but I suspect that any "latex effect" will be lost in a heavy duty tire.
Litespud is offline  
Old 10-02-18, 02:33 AM
  #38  
bungle73
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Posts: 81
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 24 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times in 1 Post
Originally Posted by Litespud
They're toast - if you're seeing tube protruding out through the tire, a temporary boot - a wrapper or folded dollar bill - might suffice to get you home, but they're done after that, and an explosive flat waiting to happen.
As to the other question, you might feel a difference using latex tubes in a supple high-thread-count tire like an Open Corsa, but I suspect that any "latex effect" will be lost in a heavy duty tire.
But they're £36 tyres and I've only had them six months!!

It's only a small hole, can't I just put one of the those Park Tool tyre boots in it or something?

Last edited by bungle73; 10-02-18 at 02:55 AM.
bungle73 is offline  
Old 10-02-18, 07:28 AM
  #39  
Litespud
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Chapel Hill NC
Posts: 1,683

Bikes: 2000 Litespeed Vortex Chorus 10, 1995 DeBernardi Cromor S/S

Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 645 Post(s)
Liked 797 Times in 446 Posts
Originally Posted by bungle73
But they're £36 tyres and I've only had them six months!!

It's only a small hole, can't I just put one of the those Park Tool tyre boots in it or something?
sure you can - at the end of the day, it’s your call. If you consider the the hole(s) to be sufficiently small that a permanent boot will fully support the surrounding tire, then go for it, but give them a good hard look before each ride to ensure that the boot hasn’t moved or the holes haven’t grown. That being said, were I in your shoes, I would consider the tire to be compromised, and I would rather eat the replacement cost than run the risk of eating asphalt somewhere down the line
Litespud is offline  
Old 10-08-18, 07:24 AM
  #40  
bungle73
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Posts: 81
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 24 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times in 1 Post
I just examined the tyre off the wheel and you can hardly tell there is a cut there - I had to search for it - it's so very, very small - in fact I felt the need to mark it with a pen so I can find it again later. I don't see that it's something that the whole tyre needs to be replaced over. In fact it's only on a recent ride that the butyle tube found its way through, before that it was fine, and the only way I knew it was there was because the latex tube kept popping when I installed and tried to inflate it. I'm thinking some kind of tyre boot would sort it out. What do you think? Surely it's not worth ditching an otherwise unblemished almost brand new tyre because of the minutest of nicks?

Last edited by bungle73; 10-08-18 at 08:38 AM.
bungle73 is offline  
Old 10-08-18, 08:15 AM
  #41  
bungle73
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Posts: 81
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 24 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times in 1 Post
I'm thinking I could sort it by sticking an inner tube patch on it. I've read that is what other people have done with small nicks.
bungle73 is offline  
Old 10-08-18, 09:16 AM
  #42  
dmanthree
Senior Member
 
dmanthree's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Northeastern MA, USA
Posts: 1,678

Bikes: Garmin/Tacx Bike Smart

Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 646 Post(s)
Liked 289 Times in 191 Posts
5 watts?

Originally Posted by wphamilton
Saving 5 watts per tire, probably even more with some of the tubes I use, I would gladly pay the extra cost and put up with the relative fragility. But having to air them up all the time is the deal-killer for me.
I've never seen test that indicates you'd save 5 watts per wheel. Where did you see that?
dmanthree is offline  
Old 10-08-18, 09:52 AM
  #43  
wphamilton
Senior Member
 
wphamilton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Alpharetta, GA
Posts: 15,280

Bikes: Nashbar Road

Mentioned: 71 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2934 Post(s)
Liked 341 Times in 228 Posts
Originally Posted by dmanthree
I've never seen test that indicates you'd save 5 watts per wheel. Where did you see that?
https://www.cyclingweekly.com/news/p...-hassle-282066
"The fit. files were processed and the inertia was corrected for each tyre. The result was that latex tubes were five to 5.5 watts faster per tyre"

Not saying that it's credible. Just that I'd pay extra for that much, if it weren't so much extra hassle.
wphamilton is offline  
Old 10-08-18, 02:56 PM
  #44  
FullSpeedAgain
Member
 
FullSpeedAgain's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
Posts: 35
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 11 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
I'm curious about the pressure issue.

If you need to pump them up from one day to the next, would you notice a difference from the start to the end of a very long ride?
FullSpeedAgain is offline  
Old 10-08-18, 07:11 PM
  #45  
Johnny Rad
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Zion
Posts: 632
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 40 Post(s)
Liked 9 Times in 9 Posts
Originally Posted by TiHabanero
The OP's experience with latex tubes is all too familiar. After several customers demanded their money back on the "defective" latex tubes we stopped bringing them in. Nothing defective about them, total operator error. Tires are tougher to seat with them, that's all. When done correctly they don't go "BANG!"
Truth! “Operator error” can be a bitter pill to swallow, but it’s not the tube’s fault for getting pinched or damaged from tire irons. I’ve learned the hard way that installation of latex tubes takes patience and good technique, but the payoff in my experience is well worth it (lower rolling resistance, greater snakebite / pinch flat resistance and a smoother ride).

Latex tube posts are kinda like carbon vs steel, Campy vs everything else, aero vs weight weenies, etc. with lots of strong opinions on both sides!
Johnny Rad is offline  
Old 10-09-18, 02:08 AM
  #46  
Racing Dan
Senior Member
 
Racing Dan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 2,231
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1335 Post(s)
Liked 318 Times in 216 Posts
Originally Posted by trailangel
I tried the Latex on clinchers.... after riding tubulars for 12 years... thought I'd get the ride feel back. No go. Same result as OP. My theory ....Latex goes bad when exposed to light. How are they stored before you purchase them (unknown)? In tubular tires latex tubes never see sunlight, except to repair them. Not really any weight savings. Went back to Conti Race Light about 70grams... the same weight as latex. Can anybody tell the difference? Clinchers are so good now, not like 40 years ago.
Best Bang For The Buck?..... not IMO
Yeah, form what I hear about latex on the forums, I would go with light butyl tubes as well. I have a few light butyl tubes and from my experience they last just as well as the normal weight tubes. Contrary to latex, butyl last virtually forever. I reguarly run decades old butyl tubes on my commuter, with no issues and no obvious signs of degradation.
Racing Dan is offline  
Old 10-16-18, 05:02 PM
  #47  
bungle73
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Posts: 81
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 24 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times in 1 Post
I tried patching the tyre, but when I tried inflating it the crack started expanding and it was very obvious. I also noticed it was bulging slightly at that point when I felt it (this was with the latex tube). I decided that I wouldn't be happy riding it like that, so I took it back off and put the 4 Seasons back on. It looks like I'll have to fork out for a new tyre next spring..........
bungle73 is offline  
Old 10-17-18, 01:53 PM
  #48  
Abe_Froman
Senior Member
 
Abe_Froman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: Chicago
Posts: 2,524

Bikes: Marin Four Corners, 1960's Schwinn Racer in middle of restoration, mid 70s Motobecane Grand Touring, various other heaps.

Mentioned: 76 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 9347 Post(s)
Liked 57 Times in 51 Posts
Originally Posted by redlude97
4 free watts for $40 is a hell of a deal
I'm no expert...but I'm pretty sure the math puts that at $10/watt
Abe_Froman is offline  
Old 10-17-18, 03:29 PM
  #49  
Psimet2001 
I eat carbide.
 
Psimet2001's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Elgin, IL
Posts: 21,627

Bikes: Lots. Van Dessel and Squid Dealer

Mentioned: 25 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1325 Post(s)
Liked 1,306 Times in 560 Posts
So much in here and so frustrating to read knowing there’s a lot of misinformation on here but only a few will take the time to read this far down.

Op - you installed the tubes incorrectly. Period. Whenever you get a flat with any tube simply perform an inspection of that flat. The shape and position of the hole will tell you the cause. Large holes (opening that run along the tube and have a jagged edge (butyl - smooth on latex) in the center are caused by the tube not being contained. You didn’t keep it under the bead of the tire. Sorry.

Mounting a latex tube Can be subtly harder. It flops around a lot easier........BECAUSE it’s more supple. The whole point. It conforms easier and even though you think you have it tucked away in the tire you could easily pinch it or have a small edge of it between the bead and rim without realizing it.

Ok next...

latex tubes are are more durable in the same conditions and are more likely to conform to an intrusion than they are to yield to it. BUT - it’s still a tube holing air. Sure it can be popped. So what. Anyone’s personal anecdotal history of a flat or two is meaningless in a way because they don’t have any idea what they rolled over or hit, etc.

this is akin to the same situation you run into while wrenching in a shop. “I got a flat. You just changed my tube so it must have been you or the tube.” “Let me look. Nope - look you ran over something causeing this hole. Let me check your tire- yup piece of glass is still there. Sorry you ran over glass.”

to the person with the tube tube sticking out the side - your tire’s purpose in life is to hold your tube in. If it’s not doing that then it needs to be fixed. Outside of temporary booting - there’s not really a fix. Get a new tire. Don’t like it? Sorry I guess. Don’t run over stuff that can cause a hole in the side of your tire.

Not noticing the “performance aspect of latex tubes” while riding on anything made from continental but gatorskins in particular is a facepalm moment. A latex tube there is like putting lipstick on a pig: At the end of the day it’s pointless and you probably should explain your motivation for doing so to a therapist.

Yes the majority of tubulars (of which I mount hundreds of annually) have latex inner tubes. Yes this is for the performance. Are they a performance enhancer when used in clinchers? Of course. For the same reasons. Will they turn any clincher tire into performing like a tubular? Of course not. There’s more to a tubular than the inner tube. The casing, the tread compounds, etc. same with clinchers. See above reigs and lipstick.

TLDR- it’s a tube. It works. If it isn’t working for you then all roads point to you doing something wrong.
Psimet2001 is offline  
Old 10-17-18, 03:41 PM
  #50  
TimothyH
- Soli Deo Gloria -
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Northwest Georgia
Posts: 14,779

Bikes: 2018 Rodriguez Custom Fixed Gear, 2017 Niner RLT 9 RDO, 2015 Bianchi Pista, 2002 Fuji Robaix

Mentioned: 235 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6844 Post(s)
Liked 736 Times in 469 Posts
^^^ Thank you for this.


-Tim-
TimothyH is offline  


Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service -

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.