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Pedestrians = more dangerous than drivers?

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Pedestrians = more dangerous than drivers?

Old 09-19-19, 09:03 AM
  #26  
sheddle
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No they aren't, and it's fine to jaywalk, especially in a city, if you aren't literally walking into a car 3 feet away moving at 40mph, or doing it somewhere where crossings are prohibited, like a divided highway.

Thanks folks
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Old 09-19-19, 09:07 AM
  #27  
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Originally Posted by Moe Zhoost View Post
Probably. Observation and anticipation developed over many years of commuting in urban traffic.
98% of times you can indeed anticipate the motions of pedestrians, but there are times when they do something completely illogical. One example was a pedestrian crossing a street in front of me, in a reasonably safe distance; I take a slight turn to safely pass behind his back, when in the last moment he suddenly swings around to head back where he came from. I managed to avoid contact, but with only millimeters to spare.
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Old 09-19-19, 09:21 AM
  #28  
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Originally Posted by subgrade View Post
98% of times you can indeed anticipate the motions of pedestrians, but there are times when they do something completely illogical. One example was a pedestrian crossing a street in front of me, in a reasonably safe distance; I take a slight turn to safely pass behind his back, when in the last moment he suddenly swings around to head back where he came from. I managed to avoid contact, but with only millimeters to spare.
This is when you want to ring your bell to make sure they see you.
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Old 09-19-19, 09:53 AM
  #29  
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Originally Posted by CliffordK View Post
Cars don't have designated crossing places. They can cross a road dang near anywhere there isn't a curb to hop or guard rail to cross.
But I wish they'd move the deer crossing signs so the deer will cross the road elsewhere.
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Old 09-19-19, 10:01 AM
  #30  
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Originally Posted by sheddle View Post
No they aren't, and it's fine to jaywalk, especially in a city, if you aren't literally walking into a car 3 feet away moving at 40mph, or doing it somewhere where crossings are prohibited, like a divided highway.

Thanks folks
Don't they have ordinances against jaywalking in some places?
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Old 09-19-19, 10:20 AM
  #31  
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They're hilarious.

My town has the most comprehensive MUP system in my country, and most of the world. It was built with one, from scratch. We don't cycle on roads. Some find my recurring report of this tedious, but just think what that must be like...

Yes i can imagine pedestrians just walking out into the road. Possibly more than they do when you're in a car. But just think for a moment, when you share every pavement with them...

It must've seemed like such a good idea in the 1970s. But there were no ipods in the 1970s. No e-scooters. No delivery robots. It's like the crazy golf of cycling. Some dizzy student, liberated dogs, even the cats and birds got attitudes of defiance now.
Pedestrians, heh. You can see them wandering from one side of the path to the other. And i think, ''hmm, have i got time to go that side? Or should i go for it the other side?'' And not even an air horn will work over their gangster rap, let alone a bell.

Some are good. Some try. And there's lots of eye candy. But if you think you have to be careful on long straight open roads... you wanna try here, where 10mph is often too fast.
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Old 09-19-19, 04:05 PM
  #32  
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People were in cities before cars, horses were in cities before cars, bicycles were in cities before cars. Cities are designed around people, if you can't driver safely in a city, stay in the suburbs which is designed around cars. Civilization is designed around cities and water. No people, no cars.
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Old 09-19-19, 04:21 PM
  #33  
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Originally Posted by Banzai View Post
Pedestrians don’t kill people.

Drivers kill scads of people.

Any questions?
Except we have to admit, pedestrian lives matter.. so if they act in a manner that gets themselves killed, it's probably worth discussing.
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Old 09-19-19, 04:28 PM
  #34  
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Originally Posted by bedtime View Post
I was riding to my bike coop again and saw a group of about 6 teenagers j-walking across the street. They crossed even though there was clearly a car coming. Not one of them hesitated. The car had to slow to a stop for them. So it's not just bikes they don't respect—it's their own lives.

That having happened, I think I overreacted with my initial post, and I take back much of what I said. You guys clearly put me in my place, lol.

Thanks for the replies guys!
Again, in my country, motorists MUST give way to pedestrians.
People are not more important just because they are inside a motor vehicle.
Again, there is no such thing as jay-walking. It was a term made up as propaganda my the motoring lobby groups when they successfully took over our roads from the general public.
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Old 09-19-19, 05:10 PM
  #35  
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Only litigation-wise.
Tim
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Old 09-19-19, 06:09 PM
  #36  
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Originally Posted by sumgy View Post
Again, in my country, motorists MUST give way to pedestrians.
Except, if it's impossible to do so in time, then ooops.

Originally Posted by sumgy View Post
People are not more important just because they are inside a motor vehicle.
Again, there is no such thing as jay-walking. It was a term made up as propaganda my the motoring lobby groups when they successfully took over our roads from the general public.
huh..? all that jaywalking means is crossing when you're not supposed to (ie. the "Don't Walk" flashing light is a dead giveaway).
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Old 09-19-19, 06:23 PM
  #37  
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Squirrels = More Dangerous Than Pedestrians?
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Old 09-19-19, 06:53 PM
  #38  
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A remembered "moment of zen", circa 2001 in downtown Atlanta: Near the university, a homeless man gets hassled by a cop for jaywalking.... A few blocks away a cop is stopping traffic so bizziness people can jaywalk en masse... despite two perfectly good and near crosswalks....
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Old 09-20-19, 12:16 AM
  #39  
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Originally Posted by Sy Reene View Post
Except, if it's impossible to do so in time, then ooops.
Then you are likely not driving to the conditions.


Originally Posted by Sy Reene View Post
huh..? all that jaywalking means is crossing when you're not supposed to (ie. the "Don't Walk" flashing light is a dead giveaway).
Nope: https://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-26073797
In my country, you are correct ONLY at a lit marked crossing that you must wait for the lights. If you are further than 20m from that lit crossing you can cross anywhere and motor vehicles MUST Give Way.
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Old 09-20-19, 04:52 AM
  #40  
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Don’t get me started on scooters, pedestrians, drivers, e mopeds people who meander on bikes and motorists. We’ll be here all day. And it will ruin my coffee.
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Old 09-20-19, 05:37 AM
  #41  
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Originally Posted by Moe Zhoost View Post
Pedestrians in motion walk slow enough that you can anticipate their movements and thus avoid them.
False, pedestrian do stupid stuff all the time. Then come up with some wacky logic to why they did what they did. I've had them walk right into me (without so much as a grunt apology) hypnotized by their cell phones. I've had people cross the street walking south while I'm waking north and run into me -- and I was the only one on the entire block. If I need to read something carefully, I stop, especially in a crowd of people.
If they are stationary, you can count on them starting to walk soon, so just assume that they will step out on you and plan accordingly. Don't assume that they see you even if they are looking your way. Also, resist the urge to buzz them because it really does not "teach them a lesson" and could result in something that would ruin your day.
And what is the rate for pedestrian babysitting? If he's an adult and they're an adult then they have as much responsibility to watch out for him as he does to watch out for them.

Originally Posted by 79pmooney View Post
I'm guessing you have never had one step out from in front of a van mid-block. Or maybe you have powers of anticipation I was not gifted with.
He's making an irrational comment. People (pedestrians) do stupid things all the time. Here's a scenario that shows this fact. A pedestrian is crossing the street as I'm approaching. If you track their movement forward they would be well out of the way by the time I arrive at their intersect point.

Instead of continuing forward, they (apparently panic like a deer caught in the headlights) and either start shifting back and forth, move backwards, or just stop. I now have to come to a complete stop and wait for their thinking to keep from having a collision.

All they had to do was keep their original walking pace and they would have been on the sidewalk (well out of the path) by the time I got to that point.

BTW, I've noticed that some people seem to have a mental block so that they can't think and walk at the same time. I'm guessing this is where that "walking and chew gum", phrase comes from?

Anyway, even a dog can gauge your approach and cross your path without issue. Now a cat, they will wait and get under your feet. 🐱

Last edited by KraneXL; 09-22-19 at 05:02 AM. Reason: clarify sentence
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Old 09-20-19, 07:48 AM
  #42  
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Originally Posted by KraneXL View Post
He's making an irrational comment. People (pedestrians) do stupid things all the time. Here's a scenario that shows this fact. A pedestrian is crossing the street as I'm approaching. If you track their movement forward they would be well out of the way by the time I arrive at their intersect point.

Instead of continuing forward, they (apparently panic like a deer caught in the headlights) and either start shifting back and forth, move backwards, or just stop. I now have to come to a complete stop and wait for their thinking to keep from having a collision.
This is the type of stuff that I was getting at. In my city j-walking is legal, and I think that's a good thing, but I believe it is not legal to obstruct traffic or block it in any way to cross. If there is a clear way, cross by all means. Barring that, pedestrians should wait for the traffic to clear or walk to the next light. This is what I do when I'm walking; I would never run or walk out in front of a car in a way that would make them slow down.

So why do they do it? I imagine they are impatient and just don't want to wait their turn, so they figure they'll step onto the road a little, more and more, until a car stops for them so they can cross.

This, IMO, is quite selfish. People in vehicles have to respect the laws; they have to stop for lights (which can make them wait for a minute or two sometimes) so people can cross—they don't just run red lights when they're impatient.

The issue with the pedestrians and bikes is that many pedestrians don't seem to respect cyclists as much as other vehicles. Yes, pedestrians will likely stop for you if they are in the middle of the road and see you coming while they are crossing, but how are we to trust they will actually stop? Why not just wait for the street to be clear to cross?

It's just logic: don't step in front a moving vehicle—bicycle or not!
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Old 09-20-19, 01:19 PM
  #43  
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Just remember that most of those pedestrians are also motorists. As a cyclist, you do have to look out for both.
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Old 09-20-19, 01:24 PM
  #44  
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Originally Posted by bedtime View Post
Cars tend to keep away from me and give me my space. Pedestrians on the other hand often j-walk right in front of me while I'm riding properly on the road. I end up having to slow down, or I'd hit them. Happens almost every single time I go to my bike coop.

I don't know why they think it's okay for them to wait for a car but just walk right in front of a bike.

Oh, and people on those powered scooters—don't even get me started!! Too many close calls.
My experience exactly. That's why I ride in the road and leave the MUP to the random direction and velocity folks. On the road I give scooters more room than a torqued up cat 5 racer at his first crit.
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Old 09-20-19, 09:54 PM
  #45  
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Originally Posted by Daniel4 View Post
Just remember that most of those pedestrians are also motorists. As a cyclist, you do have to look out for both.
As a cyclist, you are likely also a pedestrian or a motorist when not riding your bicycle.
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Old 09-21-19, 03:44 AM
  #46  
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Originally Posted by I-Like-To-Bike View Post
As a cyclist, you are likely also a pedestrian or a motorist when not riding your bicycle.
I've rigged up a trainer in the front seat so I can be a cyclist while I'm driving.
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Old 09-21-19, 03:51 AM
  #47  
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Originally Posted by bbbean View Post
My experience exactly. That's why I ride in the road and leave the MUP to the random direction and velocity folks. On the road I give scooters more room than a torqued up cat 5 racer at his first crit.
I really want to know where you find these magical roads that have no unpredictable drivers. The whole premise of this thread is absurd.
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Old 09-21-19, 05:45 PM
  #48  
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Originally Posted by livedarklions View Post
I really want to know where you find these magical roads that have no unpredictable drivers. The whole premise of this thread is absurd.
Setting the bar at 0% unpredictable drivers is absurd.
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Old 09-21-19, 08:29 PM
  #49  
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This thread needs a Joeybike video
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Old 09-21-19, 08:42 PM
  #50  
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The biggest cause of my accidents were caused by no one other than myself.

Fatigue and poor focus at inopportune moments were direct causes of my last three accidents,

I cannot blame other cyclists, drivers, dogs, deer, squirrels, or pedestrians for my own carelessness.

Hazards are everywhere. I am the final arbiter of my fate.
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