1nterceptor

canklecat

This.

Reckless driving with dealer tags reflects badly on a dealership. If it's a sales rep or manager the dealer needs to know. When I worked for dealerships years ago the purpose of allowing employees to drive dealer demo cars was to boost sales through giving test rides to family, friends, neighbors, etc. If you didn't bring in prospects from those test drives you might lose the privilege of taking demo cars home. Reckless or other unauthorized use of dealer demo cars could result in termination and prosecution. I know of one employee of a dealership I worked for who was reported to police for unapproved use of a demo car -- I think he took it out of the city without advance authorization.

If it's a recently purchased car that still has dealer tags it still reflects badly on the dealer. They may be willing to reveal the relevant info to police about who purchased the car.

And do get a camera. The driver is a threat not only to you and other cyclists but to everyone around the school. As others have noted many suburban school zones are badly overcrowded at dropoff/pickup times. Parents should consider this a privilege, not a right. Get other parents involved. They'll help watch out for reckless drivers.

FenderTL5

Dealer plates you say?
Don't you realize that's their un-subtle way if yelling, "Buy a car!"

I commute every day and I decide that I need or don't want a camera on a regular basis.
Godspeed!

Robert C

This is what I was thinking as well, call the dealership first.

Leisesturm

Seriously? Buy a >$100 camera to document the uncivil behavior of one driver? Uh... no. And if that driver were actually a serious threat to the safety and lives of children, the o.p. would not have to take this on. The driver under discussion would already have been dealt with by other parents. A serious and recurrent threat to the safety of children would not be tolerated for long.

himespau 

Cameras can cost way less thatn $100. Get footage and contact the dealership.

Secret Squirrel

Hey, Bike to work day.
I used my overpriced Fly6 camera to pin a cordial note/picture on the car of the person that passed me on a blind curve with on coming traffic. The car was parked right next to my office.
This is the reason I wave, when they honk (small work and close neighbors)

noglider 

I don't think it's clear whether the cost of the camera or the trouble it takes to take videos for possibly days or weeks is justified. I hope @HBpapa does find a way to reel this guy in. It's worth something, that's for sure. I'm not about to spend $100 or more on a camera for myself, but I don't have his problem. If I did, I would see the camera as much cheaper than what's at stake.

Perhaps trying to catch up with the driver in his own car would be easier. Perhaps getting help from the school or the police or both would help. One way or another, I hope he finds the guy and either speaks with him directly or has his employer or law enforcement do so.

Leisesturm

Thank you so much for THIS! I have seen no purer, no more concise refutation of the growing culture of video paranoia gripping the biking community than the quoted. Some of you don't even ride with your kids. "Its too dangerous!" And... its ok if you are killed as long as your kids are safe in Mom's (it isn't safe for Mom to ride either) SUV or Minivan? As long as your life insurance is paid up, you can go ahead and be a commuting daredevil with a death wish. At least your last moments on earth will be recorded so the insurance company will know that it wasn't your fault, and thus they should pay out the claim post haste.

Going out of doors anywhere on Earth has risk. Period. Whether in a car, on a motor bike, on a bike, on foot... all outdoor transportaion involves greater risk in America, than in other developed parts of the world. There is a dash cam community growing among American car drivers, but I suspect that the majority of them got the idea from cyclists. That is where it started, and cyclists are using the majority of monitoring devices on the road, for now. And? Cyclist injury and fatality statistics are NOT improving for all that camera proliferation. But cyclist injury and fatality statistics DO improve with increased experience. The best insurance you have as a cyclist is increased awareness of good cycling technique. Documenting the bad behavior of other road users does not keep you safe.

When you don't have a camera entitling you to claim your 'right of way'... you cede it. Or you become a news item. But do you know what really seals it for me? Its the realization that: a single camera with a fixed POV, be it behind, ahead or to the traffic side, is almost worthless. Trouble can come from any quarter, how could a fixed POV be of more than scant utility. However, consider the spectacle of a full 360 degree vehicle coverage system. Consider the cost of it. Consider the administration of four separate video streams. Consider it, and then don't bother.

KD5NRH

This, and a $40-50 FauxPro will come in handy for a lot more than catching this one guy.

Secret Squirrel

This is interesting discussion. I was not aware of the passion that was directed against having a camera available when riding a bicycle.
Dealing with law enforcement has always yielded the advice that you need to be proactive with evidence in the case of an negative interaction.
If an individual sees that a camera is pointed at them, don't they tend to be on their best behavior? Or is that guy in the car with the finger up his nose getting away with being unnoticed?

ItsJustMe

It's amazing to me this phenomenon on the internet where a few people can start having a discussion about something like having a camera, and people find it necessary to charge into the middle of the group and say that they think it's wrong in some way to wear a camera. it's against their personal bicycle religion or something.

Do these people butt in to groups in everyday life to talk about how THEY don't think what the group is doing makes sense? Do they walk around car dealerships and tell people they don't need a car, they can just walk or ride a bike, it's a much purer experience?

Leisesturm

Push-back against camera use is not all that passionate for the most part. That is part of why it has proliferated. But IMO it is creating a culture of entitlement that precludes good defensive operation of a vulnerable road vehicle. Hence my passion about it. I have seen a fair number of camera videos that were absolutely useless at providing any insight as to what happened. When I drive by a cyclist I am not looking to see if they have a camera on their head or on their bike. I DOUBT that the large majority of motorists know or care that cyclists are recording their behavior!

This is borne out by the continuing climb of the rate of bad cyclist/motor vehicle interactions. Distracted driving is on the rise and a camera is no deterrent. You don't need to prove the motorist was texting with a camera. Your lawyer can subpoena cell provider call logs and prove the same thing with much greater credibility. The drivers lawyer may argue that you, the cyclist, should have exercised better judgement in getting so close to a car where the driver was so obviously distracted. Audacious, but it just might work in a society so biased against cyclists, but more to the point, biased towards motorists.

I was riding past a car in the bike lane two days ago. Just as I reached it the drivers door flew open. The driver didn't just open the door, she kicked it open, and kept her body well out of the way! WTF. Was she deliberately trying to door me??? I was able to dodge the door, and we locked eyes for a fraction of a second as I rode by, but I made no comment, nor did she. Had I a camera it would clearly have shown that she kicked her door open with a speed and force totally outside of how 99% of car users open a car door, but was it a deliberate hostile act or just how she opens her car door all the time?!

What if I only had a camera monitoring my six? I mean... that's where trouble usually comes from? It would be of no use. I know there are two camera setups, but what if you are sideswiped? Right hooked? Right hooks are very common. A forward or rearward camera won't capture the critical strike point of a right hook, unless it is the cyclist that hits the right turning car. What if the right turning car hits the cyclist? It may be implied by other camera views, but... even without cameras the majority of right hooks have never usally been confused with being anything else. I'll never know what was in that drivers head who almost doored me, but I'd much rather be skilled enough to react to a situation like that than count on some judge awarding me a judgement against someone who may not be in any position to pay it, and is equally likely to be uninsured. FWIW.

mstateglfr 

The OP asked for 'riding recommendations'.

Some have suggested buy a camera to record all riding in order to document the 1%(the OP's words) of the time where there is an issue.
I, and others, have suggested perhaps that isnt the best use of money or planning.

Instead, some riding recommendations are...
- a different route to avoide the congested drop off area.
- hold your phone up and take a picture. I do this all the time while riding, its simple and not blurry.
- planning for the 1% of your life inconveniences and clutters up the 99% of your life.
- call the dealer who owns the vehicle.
- repeat the plate#s when the vehicle passes you, pull over, and say the #s into your voice to text. text it to yourself, and save it for after you drop your kid off at school.

I am responding to your post since you took issue with an earlier comment of mine, i am guessing you are referring to me in this latest complaint of reply style. I am not against cameras based on my bicycle religion or whatever you mean by that. I simply dont find value in it when I subject constant videoing to a benefit to hassle and cost analysis.
If I have to actively plan for the 1%, it takes the joy out of the 99%. Take a flat for example. I am prepared for that 1% by passively carrying a pump and tube. I dont have to do any planning each time I ride. I would not enjoy the constant need to charge my camera, storing it when not in use, setting it up, etc. That, for me, is too much work to just catch someone in a car when simpler solutions(for me) exist.



Buying a camera, charging it all the time, and using it for each ride just to possibly catch someone who you see once every two weeks is, to me, the epitome of overkill. Its using a sledge hammer to drive finishing nails into a cabinet. Sure it can work, but there are simpler ways to get the job done.

Secret Squirrel

The only question that was stated in the OP post was that they had an Iphone and how to mount it to the handlebars.

Maybe "sigh...camera and riding recommendations?" = Camera and how to ride with it

jack002

At the end of the day this is still an opinion. Less value than a fact. Thank you.

Leisesturm

Interesting. So you only have an objection if people with an opposing POV "charge into" a discussion where people are talking positively about using cameras? Ok.. I'll take that bait. When I start my thread about the idiocy of using cameras and it has 13 or 14 post going in that vein, it will be good to know that it won't be crashed by camera advocates.

HBpapa

Thank you all for the replies. I have started practicing holding my phone and recording since it is always on the same sections of the same stretch of road. I have to go about half speed since the trail-a-bike and one handed steering can get a little wonky. Once I get enough posts I'll link the YouTube URL to show the section of road where this all happens.

I was also able to photograph a vehicle and VIN with dealer plates that matched the description of the SUV we've had problems with. The vehicle belongs to a staff member that my daughter had a lot of problems with last year but they don't look anything like the driver I saw. The driver I saw was definitely male and this staff member is a female. This is an affluent enough area where dealer plates are commonplace and I don't want to jump to conclusions.

If this were just a random rager-cager passing close enough to russle my jimmies I wouldn't even come here to ask for help and ideas. I would just mash it out, catch up with the prick, and challenge him to fisticuffs (or, more than likely, just let it go). But since kids are involved and a pattern has emerged and it is most likely another parent at my child's school I came here and video just stood out as the obvious choice. There is a big problem with bullying at this school and I wouldn't be surprised if this were in some way linked to that whole issue. Kids learn that crap from their parents and/or grandparents.

ItsJustMe

Possibly true. I get other enjoyment out of cameras. Last night I saw some baby ducks near the greenway and got a decent shot of them. I pull photos and short videos and enjoy sharing them. I've had deer run alongside me, and birds fly alongside, and those are memorable videos. Occasionally I post "look at this idiot" videos. I find them useful to review (both mine and others) to keep myself sharp and honest when it comes to traffic safety.

Keeping them charged isn't really even a problem, I have 3 to 4 lights, a phone and one or two bluetooth headsets that I keep charged daily anyway. Putting a camera in to that mix once a day, and the rear camera once a week (much bigger battery) isn't even an eyeblink of bother.

I am lucky in that in 40,000 miles and about 13 years of riding I have never had an incident that was even worth speaking to the police about. But I still like riding with cameras, because it's something I enjoy and for me it increases my enjoyment of riding by allowing me to capture moments.

When I'm actually riding, I completely forget that they're even there. If I forget to turn them on before I get on the bike, I almost certainly won't remember along the way because having cameras just isn't something I consciously think about when riding.