nico vs

Hello, I have a merckx cyclocross frame and cannot find too much info about it. Bracket says left side : H, right side: F 3428
Any info is very welcome!

CyclesMakaron

H F3428
1994 and that's all the information...
Without pics - drama

nico vs

thank you very much
It seems I have to make 10 posts in this forum before I can post pictures.

bommel716

Wow thanks! Love people with expertise!
Send you a digital beer!

Greetings Ben

cb400bill

That is correct. However, junk posts just to reach to 10 are not allowed.

Paul J

If you go to the introduction page you can introduce yourself and welcome a couple of new folks and you will have your post count up in minutes. You need to post in new threads.

Seanaus

To help with the post count, does yours have mudguard or rack eyelets? I have seen a Merckx randonneur for sale locally that was misidentified as a cyclocross bike. Also, what does the tube decal say if it has one?

Treybiker

Team Motorola - Andy Hampsten frame.

H on left side, C above 5651 (I'd post pics but apparently I haven't posted enough yet)


I've been meaning for years to learn specifics on this frame so I can find the correct fork and build it back up. (long story short, purchased this from a friend who sort of lost the fork and it got beat up in storage by someone who didn't have a clue about what it was).

Anyway, the serial number has always thrown me but I believe it is a 91 based on finally finding a picture of Andy riding it (team & sponsor decal placements match perfectly) but the pic I found mentions it is of him during1991 Fleche Wallonne and I found zero records of him ever doing that race. I have also found a pic of him doing the 91 TdF sans sponsor & name decals on a frame that matches... but riders usually had a few frames, including training & specialty built for things like climbing.

Any help would be appreciated... especially if anyone has the correct fork looking for a new home (lugged with shoulders).

Treybiker

Also, I believe it to be 753 based on the non-flat, non-embossed, seatstay tips where they meet the seat tube. It also has Andy's well-known reeeealy stretched-out toptube (Seat tube is 55.5cm ctc, top tube is 59.5 ctc!)

CyclesMakaron

H C5651 - frame built spring 1991
Here is a slightly later one:
speedbicycles.ch/velo/295/eddy_merckx_motorola_hampsten_1991.html
Motorola competed in the 1991 Spring Classics
Check the tube ends visible through the BB cover, if they don't have "riflings" then your frame is built with 753

jeirvine 

Any ideas about this one? Mike Kone at Boulder Bike has a curious early and possibly prototype EM frame. Pics here:
Eddy Merckx Bicycle - possible prototype, rumored Patrick Sercu connection, uncertain past

scottschofield

Newbie here so no photos...need help with this serial number:

upper left: A (or upside down V?)
bottom left: 6M
upper right: B
lower right; 6024

frame is labeled SLX and Corsa with block style frame logos. (I find this confusing as I assumed Corsa was SL.) Chromed rear dropouts and drive side chain stay.

Great site and information!

Treybiker

Thanks for the clarification. No rifling so likely 753.

CyclesMakaron

^6M B6024 - Strada 1989; I'm afraid someone has changed the stickers...

CyclesMakaron

...well, yes, and I thought March was going to start calmly and nicely
jeirvine - thank you, this is a very interesting frame

Observations:
- flat fork crown without Eddy Merckx inscription, also no DEROSA logo or inscription
- the way the brakes were mounted was not used in series EMC
- bottom bracket cover is a design used by De Rosa (heart) and not fitted on series EMCs
- front lugs are a similar design to those of the EMC, but not identical
- dropouts (Campagnolo) do not have holes for Porta Catena; all Campagnolo dropouts on early EMC frames have PC (if you did not want PC a different pattern of dropouts with Eddy Merckx inscription was fitted)
- the method of joining seatstays and dropouts was used in De Rosa and EMC; in this case it is done clumsily (later EMCs have this element done neatly)
- the rear lug was used in De Rosa and early EMC
- the stickers are from a later period
- seatstay cap in "EM logo" version

Conclusions (and speculation):
- the frame was not built in Meise, nor is it a prototype for serial EMCs
- the frame is not a De Rosa model, although it contains a lot of elements "fitting" to this company
- the frame was built in De Rosa
- in my opinion this is an early frame (built with "old" parts and not very carefully) from the famous "course for talented framebuilders" run for 2 months by the Master for a 16 years old boy sent by Eddy Merckx; the future chief framebuilder of EMC was Johan Vranckx and he must have built something during these 2 months - for example several dozens of frames...
I don't think his "production" was sold as De Rosa
I don't think his frames were given away for scrap
I think that these frames were transported to Meise, painted, marked and destined for: gifts, fairs and "factory use"
The theory that one of these frames was given to Patrick Sercu is plausible
This is the 9th V-frame I see; all V-frames are very early designs, some very unusual (e.g. frame for 8 year old Axel M., exhibition gold frame with reverse rear brake etc)
The theory that V = Vranckx from the time of training with De Rosa is extremely attractive, but unfortunately difficult to prove (nevertheless possible)
The last strange thing is the double numbering of the frames of the "letterless" series; I know already 2 pairs of different frames with the same number:
3. 398 and V398
3. 515 and V515
The implication is that the V series is "next to" the official EMC numbering of the period
To make it even more difficult, the V frames were probably "entered in the records" not in the order of construction ("gold" exhibition frame is built very carefully with newer part designs and is numbered V199)
One last intriguing trinket: seatstay cap with "EM logo".... until recently I thought it was introduced in 1981, but I have hard evidence that it was certainly used as early as 1980; I don't know if it was available during "training" (I doubt it), but it was possible to swap it with the previous one already at Meise before painting - I think it was important ... after all it is the only sign that you are dealing with a real Eddy Merckx frame (well - almost real)

mikekone

Thanks for the info here!

Your observations seem to confirm my original thought's on the frame (and how it was originally presented to me). I'm not well versed in the EMC history, but my understanding was that folks from EMC trained at DeRosa and some frames were built at that time. And my understanding was that this was one of them seems to be confirmed by your speculations.

This frame really is a split personality between an Eddy Merckx and a DeRosa yet isn't truly either. It's cool in that it's a piece of history and shows the links between the two companies, yet the coolness is tempered by it's purpose in being as mostly a training exercise.

Thanks again!
Mike Kone
Boulder Colorado

M1T

Left side: Right Side:
X Z
4 6726
Dura Ace 7400 6 speed (perfect)
Blue frame with white/cream accents. Chromed drive side rear stay, chromed dropouts

Thank you for all of this great information!
AGM, Basalt, CO, US of A

CyclesMakaron

4X Z6726 - Eddy Merckx Pro SLX 1986

M1T

Thank you! Here's the bike...

Treybiker

Quick question, does anyone know where I can find information about the specs of the forks? I see a ton that look alike (between the Corsa & Stradas over the years) but not sure if the tubing is different and they all use the same cast lugs... or if they're all the same. I do understand in many tube kits, the fork tubing can vary and even be customized. The reason I ask, is I am needing a fork (minimum 177mm steerer as the headtube is a good bit longer on Hampsten's frame than a standard 56cm). I see some pop up on ebay but have no idea what they are. My goal is to build this to exact spec and am hoping to get the right fork.

CyclesMakaron

If you are looking for a fork for "your Hampsten" then ... you are in luck: there is no way to find out what tubes it was made of (for pro frames a fork made of other tubes - more durable - was often added)
What remains to be established is what kind of fork crown was used at the time - you could choose between the classic "slope" or the no less classic "flat"; the "slope" did not change, the "flat" did - you would need one with the EM logo with small reinforcements... but you have a photo and with a bit of luck you will see the fork crown there....
And now the most important - forkouts !
....a actually the inscription on the forkouts - if on the dropouts you have BREV. CAMPAGNOLO then on a matched fork you should have the same...
( if you have EDDY MERCKX then analogically)
Good luck!

Treybiker

Thank you! It was hard enough determining if the bike was supposed to have the shouldered or flat top fork as he swapped between the two between 91 and 93 I would assume because the flat top may have been lighter. (Same goes for his shifter arrangement being he was known to have a brifter for rear & a down tube for front, or two brifters... and there are even pics with bar end shifters!)
Now to find a fork. Despite it having a 55.5 C to C ST, it has a 58.5 TT and a head tube that's more than 10mm taller than a standard 56cm bike.
​​​

IanKersey

CylesMakaron,

A quick question -- I have an early EMC in the Cannibal's Team Molteni livery.

It is DeRosa-esque in appearance, with flat fork lugs inscribed "Eddy" and "Merckx", EMC logo on top of SS, 3x TT rear brake cable guides brazed on, and a chain stay bridge...

From the BB serial number (reading clockwise, from the 7 o'clock to the 3 o'clock positions) -- A-7-Z-490

Can you confirm model & year?

Cheers, and thanks in advance!

V/r,

Ian Kersey

rccardr 

Ooooh, can I try?
57 cm, built mid-1984, likely SL tubing, Professional.

IanKersey

Thanks, rccardr -- appreciate the input!