rosefarts

I’m trying to maximize my setup without getting anything new. I haven’t used a trainer since college, 25 years ago.

I’ve currently got a Kinetic Smart 2 fluid trainer. Additionally, I’ve got an Ant+ Dongle for my computer that pics up my HRM and Cadence

I am not super interested in racing against others or organized group rides or anything.

I’d be looking for 20-40 minute rides with variable intensity throughout. Not much more than that. Would love a program that flashes on n the screen when to crank in up, when to dial it down, and a countdown timer for how long before the current task is completed.

Can Zwift do that? I see hills and grades and my speed on the screen changes but nothing on my end. I understand that my trainer isn’t smart, it’ll get hard when I’m in a big gear and easy in a little gear. And that’s kinda counterintuitive because the wheel will be moving faster due to gearing.

I just signed up for Zwift but I’m totally willing to move platforms if there is a better solution.

Black wallnut 

Try a workout in Zwift. Might be exactly what you are looking for. Do they list your specific trainer? If not the estimated power will likely be off a bit. I've not tried their workouts without the phone app also running and frankly that has been at least 10 months since I bought their HUB smart trainer. I don't recall the onscreen prompts in workouts mode. Since you already have a subscription give it a try. It may be just what you want. If not there are other options.

tempocyclist

It depends what you're into. Yes, Zwift will do that. You could also try:

FulGaz
TrainerRoad
Rouvy

FulGaz and Rouvy both offer free trials, TrainerRoad does not (although I think they do a money back guarantee).

kcjc

Screaming on the screen, I think Sufferfest was the only one doing that. It's now part of Wahoo under Systm but I'm not sure how long (they just dumped RGT which is Zwift like app) or if newer video are structured the same. All the apps listed above have a workout screen where you can track progress. You can also use Golden Cheetah or MyWhoosh (Zwift like) for free. Zwift can be more animated if the workout is programmed to do so (sort of if you call text/notes appearing briefly on center of the screen). Zwift is the easiest to code but you can do it with the built in editor, Zwift and MyWhoosh, both of which are pain in the butt. If you have a bike computer like Garmin Edge, you can run workout off it (and free). I use it in conjunction with Rouvy (prefer sim but can't run sim under workouts in Rouvy) mostly for FTP testing.

rosefarts

I actually had no idea that there were so many different options.

A couple years ago I got the Kinetic at a discount and used up my Zwift free trial. I think I rode once. Then I traveled for two years with the intention of getting back to it eventually. That’s now, so I just paid for a subscription.

I didn’t realize that they offered workouts until this thread. It’s hard to navigate the site since I need to be pedaling to explore it. I found some workouts and some seem great. I still find it kinda odd that I have to choose an arbitrary background and be surrounded by people to do a workout that isn’t related to the course or other people present.

I never asked or wanted anything to do with screaming at the screen. Prompts, timers, and progress, yes. No screaming. I can’t think of something that would me turn it off faster than some cardio head screaming through his sweatband to “feel the burn”.

I’ve turned my road bike into a proper workout machine. I switched the SLR to a nearly 40 year old Ideale, since weight isn’t an issue. Then I found a set of old PowerCranks to turn the ride into a hamstring and hip flexor burner.

I’d take a picture of the Franken-handbuiltluggedsteel build but my garage is too messy for photos currently.

PeteHski

Yeah, that’s the problem with Zwift workouts ie they don’t relate to the virtual course you are riding. Zwift works much better for racing and group rides with a Smart trainer to simulate the terrain.

You might find that Wahoo SYSTM would work better for you. They are video based interval workouts and you do get on-screen prompts for perceived effort and cadence. So it can work reasonably well with a “dumb” trainer and the videos have some relation to the workouts. In fact the early SYSTM (previously Sufferfest) videos date back to pre-Smart trainer days.

BTinNYC 

Rosefarts,
I know that you don't want to get anything new, but, umm, yeah, I'll just say it; to get into indoor cycling on Zwift requires a trainer that will vary resistance. It is that big an improvement in experience.

A new Wahoo Kickr Snap is going for $300. The Saris Fluid 2 isn't quite as well built, but it's $175, my wife has been using one for a year. Both are Wheel-on trainers.

You won't regret it come winter.

rosefarts

I agree but I'm trying to see if this is something I can get into, and stay motivated with, or if this is will end up as a drying rack.

If it turns out that I can get on this bike 4+ days a week through the fall and winter, the price of a smart trainer is worth it, especially since I see them frequently in the local used gear on FB. If it turns out that this is just a different way to store my bike, well, I've got hooks on the wall that take up less space.

For the last year my bike riding has suffered due to family and work. I can find time to go on a big ride, if I plan ahead. But I haven't found time to be consistent enough with my riding that I can do those rides without nearly dying. So that's basically my goal with this.

Atlas Shrugged

For what you initially asked for and the equipment you presently own. I strongly recommend you look at TrainerRoad which is a workout-based system focused solely on fitness improvement.

jpescatore

Give Zwift a try, I think you'll find enough workouts, short races and other stuff to give you what you are looking for.

One new feature on Zwift is an odd looking thing called the "climb portal" - basically, you just go there and do versions of real world climbs, like the Alpe de Huez. Yesterday I did a 19 mile group ride that at the end used the portal to climb the Col des Aravis, a 3mile 5% average (but ranging from 0 to 19%) climb - just that was 24 minutes for me and an awesome workout.

PeteHski

That’s going to require a Smart trainer otherwise the climb won’t mean a thing.

unterhausen

I wouldn't have stayed interested in indoor training without a smart trainer. I have demonstrated this over many years. YMMV

rosefarts

And just like that, riding the streets are starting to feel safer than my garage.

MinnMan

A little more explanation?

rosefarts

If you see on that blurry zoomed in picture, that’s very clearly a black widow just chilling on my stem. I rode a hood 10 minutes before noticing it.

Polaris OBark

My garage is full of black widows. It definitely makes me nervous when I see them, but they don't typically attack.

Just suck them up with a shop vac and empty it outside.

Bring the bike in the house, get a smart trainer and an Apple TV and connect that to your TV, and ejoy the ride. Wear your spider-man jersey to enhance the irony.

If you can stay engaged on a dumb trainer, there is probably something wrong with you. I have a Kurt Kinetic, and more than 12 minutes on that is excruciating. It is hard enough to stay engaged on a smart trainer.

Bald Paul

Could have been worse. It could have been chilling under your saddle.
I had a Black Widow problem a few years ago. Called an exterminator who sprayed the perimeter of the house and garage with something (I don't know what, I don't want to know what) and that took care of them. He comes by annually and repeats the treatment.
Spiders have always freaked me out.

rosefarts

I made the "wise" decision to move to a city that is on the expensive side, and my career is not. Despite a sizeable raise recently, a house with enough extra room for a bike or "pain cave" just wasn't in the cards. I have a decent garage and enough space for a shed if I ever get around to building it though. So I ride in the garage. At least I won't break a sweat there until well after indoor season is over.

I did a weird thing, I think I might be a weird guy. I got a set of vintage Powercranks. If you don't know, the right and left side are independent and it's up to your hip flexors and concentration to keep 180 degrees apart. I've convinced myself that the wild hip flexor and calf workout they provide will make me a much better uphill skier so I'm trying to stick with it. I'll be logging backcountry days in less than a month if weather cooperates. So far, my workouts are under 15 minutes total. I can pedal slowly for about 90 seconds at a time before my small muscles give out on me, and I have to stop, rest, and try again. Reading archived reports of these cranks, this is about expected and I'll be a lot closer to actually pedaling soon. Right now, it takes everything I have just ride a little, I'm having better success offline in silence, just concentrating on circles.

Eventually, I would like to be fit enough to join a workout with these, but that is some time in the future. For now, I've paused my Zwift subscription. I am still halfheartedly browsing marketplace if the perfect wheel off trainer becomes available.

For the record, I don't think Powercranks will make me a faster rider. In any discipline or they'd still be on the market. I'll know if they help skiing soon enough.

spelger

if you ride in the garage you will sweat. until last year i was in the garage and i kept cardboard under the bike because of the amount of sweat. still used a fan but turned it on only after about 5 minutes of riding until i warmed up. and warm up you will.

the pedals sound pretty cool.

regarding a wheel off trainer...sure you have seen this thread but if not...

https://www.bikeforums.net/indoor-st...t-hub-psa.html

MinnMan

I don't fully agree. Riding solo, there's no difference between an incline and flat on a dumb trainer. But if you are riding with a group, you can "feel" the topography on a dumb trainer simply from the power required to keep pace with the group. As the road turns up, they put down the power and you get dropped unless you do too.

MinnMan

some years back there was a guy in my area who rode those. He was among the fastest riders around, regularly winning local Gran Fondos. Whether the power cranks made him faster, i don't know, but it was funny watching him coast with both cranks in the same position.

MinnMan

With or without Zwift or a similar immersive app? I had the same problem (with my Kurt Kinetic) until I started on Zwift, which allowed me to go for an hour rather easily and yet longer. The limit was sometimes boredom, but more often it was how long I could stay in the saddle on a stationary bike.

Not to dispute the advantages of a smart trainer, for me breaking the barrier between "ön the trainer, time crawls" to "I can put in reasonable hours on the trainer" was the advent of immersive interactive game apps such as Zwift.

rm -rf

Do you have a rear wheel speed sensor or is a speed sensor attached to the trainer itself? Zwift will need the wheel speed and the known resistance of the fluid trainer at different speeds to calculate watts. (Unlike smart trainers like a Kickr, where the Zwift software tells the trainer what resistance to set.)

For Zwift practice, you should try the "24/7 Group Rides". These are the bot rides, where a ghostly computer rider keeps the same pace on a loop route, 24 hours a day. Riders drop into the group, then keep their watts in a range to stay with the bot leader and the group. (There's drafting, where the rider or two on the front work harder -- or drift back into the pack. And uphills are a little higher power.) Quit anytime you like, or even just drift off the back of the group and continue free riding solo.

It's good practice for keeping the watts going and working with groups on Zwift. Now, there's a "teleport" button if you get separated, or if you want to jump to a faster or slower speed group. That's useful -- I can warm up at an easy pace, then jump to a faster group, or even try a "slightly too fast for me" group. Since your fluid trainer doesn't change it's resistance, the displayed watts from the trainer calculations should be useful. Is there a lag or delay? I'm guessing there might be.

Then after some practice sessions, you could try some event rides and see if you like them.

I like the workouts on my Kickr, since the trainer sets the resistance during the different workout levels. You'll probably get a lot of "speed up" or "slow down" messages pop up as you try to set the watts at the requested levels.

MinnMan

I just discovered the teleport. It's great, I love it. I generally start out with 5 minutes with a "D"bot, just to warm up my legs, and then quit and start again with a stronger bot group. No need for that anymore. Also, there are times when I select a bot and part way through, I realize that I've made the wrong selection for that day and moment. Teleport solves that problem.

Also, unrelated, but I love the new(er) 1st person perspective on Zwift. Riding in groups, it feels much more realistic and interesting than the original "camera over your shoulder" views.

Polaris OBark

I got the Kinetic 10 years ago when recovering from a bad ankle break, and that was before Zwift or anything. I don't remember being bored by it then, but coming back to it several years later, it was hard to for me to stay engaged, even with Zwift. I had ADHD as a kid, and most likely still do. It is hard for me to stay engaged watching a movie or a TV show. I think it is getting worse with age. What I have found is that the combination of feedback and Rouvy works best for me. Simple scenery and realistic resistance I guess is what my simplistic addled brain requires, which I think is the main reason why I ride in the real world.