Clarks

I always carpool. I only drive about 200 miles a year. Riding with different people is quite interesting. There's Conrad my neighbor, he's 49 and hit a 12 year old on a bike many years ago, fortunately she wasn't hurt. Conrad drives a 4200 pound sedan. whenever I'm riding with Conrad and he comes up behind a city bus that's stopped to load/unload passengers he'll pull into the next lane, floor the throttle and pass the bus at the speed of light proclaiming, "How's that for power. See, I don't need to move up to the more expensive model". I want to tell him he should do the opposite and slow down when passing a stopped bus because I know a taxi driver in Spain who hit a 16 year old girl that ran out from behind a bus, he said she wasn't hurt but he took her to the hospital and they examined her, he left before her exam was done but said national insurance covered her.

Some things Conrad knows, if he sees a child riding a bike or playing near the street he automatically eases up on the throttle, the problem is Conrad often doesn't 'see'. He once said to me anyone who rides a bike in this city is taking his life in his hands. He told me that bikes scare him and he just doesn't see them. One day we were in a small town and a cylist sped by Conrad on the passenger said, Conrad nearly jumped out of his skin he was so scared because he had no idea the cyclist was around. "What if I had hit him", he said.

Brake checking incident yesterday. Conrad was in the left lane, the only car on the highway was the car in front of us. The guy in front of us took 30 seconds too long to move out of the left lane. He finally moved and as we passed him Conrad glared at him. The guy smiled and Conrad said, "Did you see that, did you see that? He laughed at me". Next, Conrad changed lanes so that he was directly in front of the guy and jammed on his brakes, "Now I'm doing the same thing to him that he did to me."
Interesting how I thought the guy was smiling and Conrad thought the guy was laughing at him, I guess there are so many interpretations of what's happening on the road lol.

A while ago Conrad told me that speeding was like the new smoking and people who speed are made to feel bad just like smokers are made to feel bad. He can't understand why he can't drive as fast as he wants on the highway because his car is safe and he's a good driver. He's lost his license twice for speeding. He tells me he's a better driver at 90/95 than at 65.Amazingly, Conrad doesn't have accidents.

So, what's the best way of "correcting" drivers without insulting them, especially when you depend on them for transportation?

irwin7638

One word: therapy.

Marc

spock

Without insulting them? That's a tough one...

I guess you can close your eyes.

green427

Conrad is 49, he will never change. You can advise him until you are blue in the face, but he will not change unless he wants to. Some folks get a high by driving with that attitude.

BHOFM

I would refuse to ride with him! And tell him why!

10 Wheels

Too Late...

genec

For Conrad, pull out the valve cores, pull off the spark plug wires, put water and sugar in the gas tank, and put super glue into the ignition and door locks. Folks like him don't know how to "share the road."

Chris516

Not only that. Have you thought about two other possibilities......that you would have to get a ride with someone else if he loses his license while you are carpooling with him and/or, ending up in the morgue with him. As a result of his Devil-may-care attitude about driving responsibly.

bluefoxicy

Find other transport.

Come down heavy.

I am not a proponent of being nice to people. You be nice to people who are doing it right, people who need help, who are hurt. People who are screwing up do not get niceness.

buzzman

Unfortunately, people like Conrad are convinced by the false assumption that since they have not been in a serious accident then their behavior behind the wheel must be the reason. If your observations are accurate it sounds like Conrad is just real lucky. One day his luck will more than likely run out- at the expense of either someone else's life and/or well being, his own, or both.

The sad thing is people can ride their bikes under same delusion, convinced that their erratic, reckless riding style is a perfectly legitimate a way to get around because they're not dead yet. Should one of those bike riders attempt to occupy the same space at the same time as Conrad the consequences will more than likely be more catastrophic for the bike rider. Conrad will simply have to repair the minor damage to his 4200 lb vehicle and deal with the after effects on whatever conscience he may have and how much he is willing to acknowledge his own responsibilities for the accident.

There are also bike riders out there equally convinced that riding "predictably" and "following the rules of the road" will keep them safe from drivers like Conrad. Nothing could be further from the truth- drivers like Conrad are not paying attention, they are not driving predictably themselves, nor are they following the rules of the road. The only protection from the Conrads of the world is to be ever vigilant and to operate your bike in a manner completely dictated by the given circumstances of the present moment and not by any set standard of rules or biking behavior- it doesn't mean ride "unpredictably" or to NOT follow the rules of the road- it means do those things when dictated by the given circumstances (which is probably 99% of the time) but be ready to improvise in a moment's notice.

Since Conrad is a "friend"?/colleague/neighbor and not just some random driver it would make sense to let him know you're not always comfortable as a passenger in the car and let him know why. He may take offense, he may brush it off- since you're not a frequent driver he may think you are overly cautious, whatever, but it seems irresponsible on your part to not put some voice to how you feel about his driving.

fuji86

And that's why anyone riding the bus needs to be very cautious crossing the street after the bus has dropped them off at a stop. School buses obviously have the stop arm that swings out, even there kids should cautiously look and make sure a car isn't going around the school bus. Yeah, I know, what are the chances, but to be the one time in a million, you don't want to be the winner of that lottery. But as for the city bus. Those riders need to realize they get let out at the side of the roadway, there is no stop arm that protects their next move to cross the street. Sometimes when the bus stop is at an intersection, the light might change and drivers need to realize that too, otherwise they'll go into the intersection on a red light. That could be quite messy too.

Digital_Cowboy

Clarks,

As others have said at 49 yrs old Conrad is more likely than not set in his way's and you're not likely to change his opinion or his driving style. Also as others have said if at all possible you might want to consider changing carpool partners. If that isn't an option, get him talking about the 12yr old that he hit on the bike. Ask him how he felt when he hit her.

Ask him why he thinks that cyclists are "taking their own lives into their hands" by riding on the road? Point out to him that cyclists have the same right to be on the road as he does. Point out to him that when he speeds past a city bus as is his habit that if there is a cop around that will more likely than not get a ticket for speeding. Also ask him feel how he'd feel if when he speeds around a public bus he hit someone who just got off of the bus? Remind him that it could be a member of his own family.

Is this a company run/sponsored carpool program? If so maybe reporting him to the committee is in order.

You've mentioned that he has had his license suspended at least twice, do you know if he continued to drive when his license was suspended?

ModeratedUser150120149

From the OP post it seems attempts have already been made to "correct/inform" this person with no effect except to raise the emotional climate. He is a young person well able to be flexible and to learn if he wants to. Since he doesn't want to your options are: A: Shut up and ride B: Drop out of the car pool.

fuji86

Hey, everyone takes their lives into their own hands these days when they get on the road. The other day I read about a couple of people waiting at a bus stop bench and on the sidewalk, so it's all relative in the context the driver was talking about ? Anyway, if I don't have a warm fuzzy feeling about another's driving habits or judgments, I don't hesitate to take that situation into my hands and find a safer ride. Live thru it, maybe mention it like you did and if it's unwelcome advice, don't get in the car with them ever again and avoid them if you know where they're going to be driving. If they ever ask, just tell them you feel better with other options for getting around. Just politely inform them you are opting out of the carpool and leave it civil. And if it comes down to a reason, fabricate that you have to stop off some where that is out of the way and that you feel obligated to not inconvenience the rest of the carpool.

gerald_g 

I kind of see a glimmer of hope in his idea that speeding is the new smoking. Perhaps he is feeling social pressure that speeding "isn't cool", and is "socially unacceptable"

I always think we need to make all bad driving socially unacceptable.

Speeding, Distracted driving, Drunk driving, Road rage, Stunting, etc. etc......

Spread the word, no longer acceptable behavior.

JimF22003

Not being sarcastic here, but that was actually a cool story bro.

Don't know what to do about Conrad though. He sounds like my idiot brother.

009jim

Put yourself in Conrad's shoes. What would it take for someone to do or say that would make you change? A near death experience? I don't like where this is going, so I'll stop now.

trackhub

It sounds like Conrad has not matured past the age of 19. Does he have a playboy air freshener dangling from the rear view mirror?

There is nothing you can possibly do to "correct" this guy's behavior. I would suggest you re-think
your transportation arrangements. Conrad has been lucky. Luck runs out sooner or later. Sorry I can't be more positive, but I've known these guys too.

jaywbee3 

Suggest to Conrad that he take the AARP Safe Driving course - https://www.aarp.org/home-garden/tran...on/ds_program/

adablduya

a couple of things come to mind from reading this:

- why do you continue to ride with a clearly aggressive, dangerous driver ?

- if you feel so strongly about his driving habits, what keeps you from saying anything ?

my conclusion is that you are too cheap to drive yourself or seek some other method of commuting, and that you are too gutless to speak your mind, especially in matters involving the safety of children. boo hiss on you.

2wheelcommute

I agree with the others that you're probably unlikely to ever change his mind. But don't be timid about speaking up when it comes to safety. No need to insult him, but just firmly and politely respond whenever he says something ridiculous. Even if you're not going to convince him, some things shouldn't go unchallenged.

People who bike are taking their lives in their hands--"Well, I think it's a perfectly legitimate way to get around, and think you should make an extra effort to look out for them..."

Complaining about speed limits being enforced--"I think those speed limits exist for a reason. We're all much safer because they're enforced. Even if you think you can drive safely at 90/95, aren't you glad that not everyone is going around at that speed...?"

etc.

And for the sake of the cyclists in your city, I'd make a point of looking out for them myself and pointing them out whenever you're in the car with him.

genec

What is interesting is that here is a problem that no one has a real good solution to... I wonder how many drivers are out on the roads like "Conrad..." both with lack of good skills and attitudes.

ladyraestewart

Honestly, why do you want to ride with someone who irresponsible who is at time jeopardizing your own physical and emotional safety? I flat out refuse to ride with someone who would pull some of those stunts. As for not insulting them, screw that noise. They deserve insulting but are probably too dense to get it anyway. More likely than not, they know their conduct is reprehensible and there are no subtle ways to tell them.

Digital_Cowboy

Good point, which is why as many of us have said in the past. That it should be harder to get a license and easier to lose it.

hshearer

I agree. Ask him to calm his habits, even if only for the sake of your nerves. Knowing he's frightening his passenger may give him some food for thought. It sounds like he has a conscience, but also a lead foot and a touch of machismo. Could you take the wheel a few days a week while he relaxes with a cup of coffee? Also, I certainly notice that aggressive and speeding drivers often don't make up nearly as much time as they think they do; they're usually just up ahead, waiting at a red light, or stuck behind a couple of trucks moving down the highway at the same speed.

Lastly, one of the biggest influences on my driving style was cycling. I was a fast driver, but cycling taught me to just slow down and enjoy the journey, and not to take other's bad driving habits too personally (unless they endanger me, but even then, I don't get mad, I get a plate #). I was never an aggressive driver, but I imagine some saddle time might help a fellow like Conrad see traffic in a different light. Is there any chance at all you could get him to go on a few short bike rides with you? Maybe even just on a bike path or residential streets? I bet even a couple hours of riding on residential streets would be an eye-opener for him.