Kontact 

If the customer requested and received shims because Merlin called that huge seat tube that slips "in spec", that's hardly something to brag about.

olivettip

nobody is bragging here. It was noted that the Merlin would give customer an RA if requested, customer requested shims for replacement. This is the solution the customer expressed to resolve issue. There are many reasons a seat post might get sloppy, with having a frame in hand how is one supposed to remedy the fixable issue. Clearly you have made up your mind on the matter so its somewhat a non issue. The notes in this thread are just to shed light on generally a previously one sided slant.

Kontact 

That doesn't seem to be accurate. The OP claims:
So who is lying here? Did Merlin tell the OP that his seat tube is within spec, sent a stronger clamp, it keeps slipping, and no one responded to emails? Or did Merlin respond to the slipping seatpost emails and offer a new RA?


The OP talks about clamps, you bring up shims. The OP says he was told the bike was in spec, you say he was offered an RA for the seat post.

Seems like it isn't even the same story.


The problem for Merlin/Janus is that they have a bike that won't retain a seat post, and the response from Merlin makes it sound like the customer didn't want it fixed. Does that seem likely? Does it help make Merlin look on top of the situation?

Kontact 

As a service manager, I have been on the receiving end of a custom frame builder saying "we consider that in spec". This seems to be the ultimate warranty denial card that some companies play when they realize that something so essential is wrong with the bike that they might as well throw the frame out and start over.

Which is why I give some credence to the OP's story.

But I also know that some people get too involved in the process, trying to get to a workable solution. The right answer is more "this isn't right, and you need to fix it". But that takes a lot more time and is painful when the builder keeps insisting that everything is fine. It is hard to argue with someone that maintains a different reality than everyone else.

Russ Roth

Was an RA and a lightening fast turn around the first thing offered? I've ordered three custom frames and one of them ended up with an build spec issue. I've never said anything negative about the builder and could never do so in mentioning my bikes because the builder immediately requested it back, built a whole new frame to exact spec and tossed in a goodwill upgrade on something small. There was never a question on making it right and the whole conversation involving dealing with it was 15min over the phone, half of which was friendly banter. 3 weeks later I had my bike and the builder was able to sell it as a one off to recoup the loss. I also ended up with a 4th custom frame from yet another builder for the exact same reason, don't know what happened but he'd installed the bottle cage bolts in the wrong spot, and the buyer sent it back. Since you could slightly see where the old bosses were removed though the paint he sent the customer a new bike and my kid ended up with a small builder frameset for a steal. As someone who's done customer service work, I know that customers can downright suck and be difficult, but when you ask what your company asks for their frames, it should be perfect in every way. Doesn't matter if it just changed hands, the situation is made fully right and fast.

maddog34

dedhed

What does "within spec" mean? As someone who wrote and enforced specs on manufactured goods, without a written, measurable, quantifiable spec it's opinion and means nothing.

Kontact 

Precisely. It is a platitude, not a number. A technical sounding way of saying "seems okay to me".

Yan 

You were way too patient with these guys. They sold you a defective product. Fix it immediately (within a week), or return for refund. If refused, immediate credit card charge back. Simple as that, end of story. You are doing business with a merchant, not negotiating a divorce from your wife.

Credit card chargeback has a time limit of 90-120 days from date of purchase, depending on the bank. Once you miss that window, your only other recourse is small claims court (as you found out the hard way). Amex has a reputation for good customer service and fast chargeback resolution. I only use Amex for high dollar purchases.

Since you paid a deposit ahead of time, that $1500 would have missed the chargeback deadline. But at least you wouldn't have lost the remainder of the $7000.

Atlas Shrugged

Tough thread to follow but not clear about the seatpost sizing. Some titanium manufacturers use aluminum sleeves for a variety of reasons and is that just the case in this instance. Or is the sleeve out of spec? My adventure frame for example has a aluminum sleeve in the seat tube with a id. For a 27.2 seatpost.

Kontact 

Ti bike companies have used permanently bonded ti, carbon and aluminum sleeves to make the thin seat tube tubing thick enough for clamping and to get down to the common 27.2 size.

The OP's sleeve was too large inside to effectively clamp his seatpost.


​​​​​All the sleeved ti bikes I've ever serviced or owned were on the other end of the spectrum: perfectly fit or slightly undersized.

Atlas Shrugged

But this image from up in the thread indicates the OP did not use the sleeve. Something does not add up with this story. This is also the OP's second thread regarding this frameset and mucking about with it.

https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...7e88da7b65.jpg

Kontact 

How can you tell? The sleeve should not be visible from the outside.

My recollection is that has tried to address the oversized and permanently bonded sleeve with shims, and then tried to remove and replace the undersized sleeve completely.

You don't normally have an option to use it or not with the sleeve. As I mentioned, it is bonded in place. The one on my 96 Merlin in so nicely done you can't see it.

Mackers

So you're calling OP a liar, since he replied directly to YOU when asked that the sleeve was in place when the picture was taken, or did you just not read his post?

Kontact 

If you are basing this on the pinched look of the top of the seat tube, that is with a sleeve and is indicative of how undersized it is.