Cleaning your drivetrain.
09-09-20, 10:38 AM
#101
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That question “...what’s it for?”, does come back to my rhetorical question of “why do it?” I’m an experimentalist and I have a long professional history of developing methods and procedures for chemical processes and chemical analysis. When I develop a procedure or look at someone else’s procedure, I look at all the steps and if there are steps that aren't required for function, I cut them out. If I can replace 4 elaborate steps with a single step, I’ve saved myself time, energy, and money. On the other hand, if someone points out a step that I put into a procedure that is unnecessary, I look at their suggestion and am willing to remove the step if it’s not necessary. I’ll check it first by doing experiments with and without the step while assessing the results. If the results are the same without the step, I’ll remove it.
09-09-20, 02:20 PM
#102
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The DuPont Chain Saver has 3% to 7% paraffin wax, where that is the primary ingredient in hot wax.
The DuPont Chain Saver becomes "dry" after the liquid petroleum carrier evaporates.
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09-09-20, 02:51 PM
#103
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That DuPont Chain Saver appears to be a decent product, but is significantly different from hot wax.
The DuPont Chain Saver has 3% to 7% paraffin wax, where that is the primary ingredient in hot wax.
The DuPont Chain Saver becomes "dry" after the liquid petroleum carrier evaporates.
The DuPont Chain Saver has 3% to 7% paraffin wax, where that is the primary ingredient in hot wax.
The DuPont Chain Saver becomes "dry" after the liquid petroleum carrier evaporates.
Dupont’s product has a bit less wax than other bicycle products...White Lightning Clean Ride is 20 to 40% wax...but as with most solvent based wax lubricants it is more convenient than hot wax. The chain doesn’t need to be removed from the bike for application.
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Plan Epsilon Around Lake Michigan in the era of Covid
Old School…When It Wasn’t Ancient bikepacking
Gold Fever Three days of dirt in Colorado
Pokin' around the Poconos A cold ride around Lake Erie
Dinosaurs in Colorado A mountain bike guide to the Purgatory Canyon dinosaur trackway
Solo Without Pie. The search for pie in the Midwest.
Picking the Scablands. Washington and Oregon, 2005. Pie and spiders on the Columbia River!
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09-14-20, 08:25 AM
#104
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I make my living off of health and safety issues, and I'll tell you not to use gasoline. I'll admit I'm not too concerned with it flammability (its just as flammable as a lot of other solvents), but the real danger is the additives the oil companies have put in their gasoline formulas over the last 40-50 years. While those additives are great for improving engine performance and emission reduction, they are really nasty to breath in or absorb through your skin (most of them burn up in the combustion process or get 'treated' in the catalytic convertor). With plenty of other alternative cleaners on the market, there's no reason to use gasoline. I use a Park clamp-on chain cleaning tool with some diluted Simple Green in it about 1x/month, seems to do a nice job. I might try Pine-Sol since I have a bottle of that around here somewhere (I don't like it for general household cleaning), dishwashing liquid might work, too. If you're really fond of petroleum distillates, try kerosene if its available in your area.
09-26-20, 11:55 AM
#105
Member
because i had a jug, and it's near the end of my riding season, i wiped down my dirty chain with MMO. then lubed with Parks oil. chain seems to run silent and stay cleaner between attentions (about every week/ 5 rides). next year i'll get a pinpoint oiler for the parks and keep up the routine.
09-26-20, 01:33 PM
#107
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I have two favorite lubes, Smoove and Rock n Roll Gold. The latter is the easiest to use, Smoove is trickier.
09-26-20, 04:03 PM
#108
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09-26-20, 06:33 PM
#109
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And nope.
WD-40 has the equivalent of mineral spirits in it...about 60%. It also has about 40% of “Petroleum Base Oil”. Once the solvent is evaporated, the oil remains. The oil is a lubricant. It’s a light lubricant meaning that it has a fairly low viscosity but it’s not all that different from Triflow if you let the banana smell (amyl acetate) evaporate. Triflow, as well as just about almost all the oil based lubricants, will flow some just flow faster than others.
WD-40 really isn’t a water displacer either. It completely hydrophilic and will not mix with water. Enough water will lift it off a metal surface and float it away...just like most any oil.
There are better lubricants than WD-40 but it could still be used as a chain lube. It’s messy but so are all oil based lubricants.
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Plan Epsilon Around Lake Michigan in the era of Covid
Old School…When It Wasn’t Ancient bikepacking
Gold Fever Three days of dirt in Colorado
Pokin' around the Poconos A cold ride around Lake Erie
Dinosaurs in Colorado A mountain bike guide to the Purgatory Canyon dinosaur trackway
Solo Without Pie. The search for pie in the Midwest.
Picking the Scablands. Washington and Oregon, 2005. Pie and spiders on the Columbia River!
Stuart Black
Plan Epsilon Around Lake Michigan in the era of Covid
Old School…When It Wasn’t Ancient bikepacking
Gold Fever Three days of dirt in Colorado
Pokin' around the Poconos A cold ride around Lake Erie
Dinosaurs in Colorado A mountain bike guide to the Purgatory Canyon dinosaur trackway
Solo Without Pie. The search for pie in the Midwest.
Picking the Scablands. Washington and Oregon, 2005. Pie and spiders on the Columbia River!
Last edited by cyccommute; 09-26-20 at 06:37 PM.
09-26-20, 06:41 PM
#110
Senior Member
I use automotive grade Simple Green, this stuff cuts grease better than the ordinary stuff. I spray it on the cassette and chain rings, and brush it off. Simple Green corrodes raw aluminum, but will not harm anything which is properly coated or painted. Rinse it off completely with clean water.
For the chain, I use a Park Chain Gang cleaner with Simple Green. I run the chain through it, change the cleaner, run it again, then replace the cleaner with water. I do this several times until the water stops getting murky. Then I run the crank set backwards holding a towel around the chain to get out the excess water. The bike dries overnight, the next day I lube the chain, one link at a time, making sure the oil gets into the rollers.
If I do this every week, it doubles the life of my drive line. Where I live, there is usually a rainy day each week when I cannot ride, so it is a good day to do an hour of bike maintenance. I used to be a bike mechanic in a well-known shop, but I didn't like the job very much. But I do like working on my own bikes.
For the chain, I use a Park Chain Gang cleaner with Simple Green. I run the chain through it, change the cleaner, run it again, then replace the cleaner with water. I do this several times until the water stops getting murky. Then I run the crank set backwards holding a towel around the chain to get out the excess water. The bike dries overnight, the next day I lube the chain, one link at a time, making sure the oil gets into the rollers.
If I do this every week, it doubles the life of my drive line. Where I live, there is usually a rainy day each week when I cannot ride, so it is a good day to do an hour of bike maintenance. I used to be a bike mechanic in a well-known shop, but I didn't like the job very much. But I do like working on my own bikes.
09-26-20, 07:49 PM
#111
Senior Member
Yes to one. Nope to two. And yes to 3. WD-40 does not contain any thing to deal with rust other than a bit of lubricant.
And nope.
WD-40 has the equivalent of mineral spirits in it...about 60%. It also has about 40% of “Petroleum Base Oil”. Once the solvent is evaporated, the oil remains. The oil is a lubricant. It’s a light lubricant meaning that it has a fairly low viscosity but it’s not all that different from Triflow if you let the banana smell (amyl acetate) evaporate. Triflow, as well as just about almost all the oil based lubricants, will flow some just flow faster than others.
WD-40 really isn’t a water displacer either. It completely hydrophilic and will not mix with water. Enough water will lift it off a metal surface and float it away...just like most any oil.
There are better lubricants than WD-40 but it could still be used as a chain lube. It’s messy but so are all oil based lubricants.
And nope.
WD-40 has the equivalent of mineral spirits in it...about 60%. It also has about 40% of “Petroleum Base Oil”. Once the solvent is evaporated, the oil remains. The oil is a lubricant. It’s a light lubricant meaning that it has a fairly low viscosity but it’s not all that different from Triflow if you let the banana smell (amyl acetate) evaporate. Triflow, as well as just about almost all the oil based lubricants, will flow some just flow faster than others.
WD-40 really isn’t a water displacer either. It completely hydrophilic and will not mix with water. Enough water will lift it off a metal surface and float it away...just like most any oil.
There are better lubricants than WD-40 but it could still be used as a chain lube. It’s messy but so are all oil based lubricants.
”To remove surface rust, simply spray it on the rusted surface, leave it for around ten minutes and let it get to work on the surface rust.”
The bottom line with bicycle chains is the waxy products and products with PTFE are your even wax combined with PTFE. Which you can make at home, even in a liquid form with simple rubbing alcohol as the base. No crock pot required.
Last edited by Mulberry20; 09-26-20 at 07:54 PM.
09-26-20, 10:46 PM
#113
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Maybe you should apply as the lead chemist for WD40 since you are so technically familiar with the product. It is marketed for a lot of things and it does in fact remove surface rust. This statement is on the website.
”To remove surface rust, simply spray it on the rusted surface, leave it for around ten minutes and let it get to work on the surface rust.”
”To remove surface rust, simply spray it on the rusted surface, leave it for around ten minutes and let it get to work on the surface rust.”
Now if you put the WD-40 on the rusted surface, let it stand for 10 minutes and then used a steel brush on it, it might remove the rust. But you could remove just as much without the WD-40.
By the way, I am a chemist with decades of experience. I now a whole lot about substances and how to read an MSDS.
The bottom line with bicycle chains is the waxy products and products with PTFE are your even wax combined with PTFE. Which you can make at home, even in a liquid form with simple rubbing alcohol as the base. No crock pot required.
Additionally, there are solubility limits that are based on well known properties. Hard wax is nonpolar. Rubbing alcohol...aka isopropyl alcohol or 2-propanol...is polar (i.e. water soluble). They don’t mix. Hard wax has zero solubility in 2-propanol. It only has limited solubility in mineral spirits.
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Stuart Black
Plan Epsilon Around Lake Michigan in the era of Covid
Old School…When It Wasn’t Ancient bikepacking
Gold Fever Three days of dirt in Colorado
Pokin' around the Poconos A cold ride around Lake Erie
Dinosaurs in Colorado A mountain bike guide to the Purgatory Canyon dinosaur trackway
Solo Without Pie. The search for pie in the Midwest.
Picking the Scablands. Washington and Oregon, 2005. Pie and spiders on the Columbia River!
Stuart Black
Plan Epsilon Around Lake Michigan in the era of Covid
Old School…When It Wasn’t Ancient bikepacking
Gold Fever Three days of dirt in Colorado
Pokin' around the Poconos A cold ride around Lake Erie
Dinosaurs in Colorado A mountain bike guide to the Purgatory Canyon dinosaur trackway
Solo Without Pie. The search for pie in the Midwest.
Picking the Scablands. Washington and Oregon, 2005. Pie and spiders on the Columbia River!
09-26-20, 10:55 PM
#114
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I used WD-40 on a Cross Country Tour. It worked fine for our needs.
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09-26-20, 11:33 PM
#115
Full Member
My buddy turned me onto this CRC Silicone spray. It is rain proof, and will not attract stuff that gums up your chain.
No more pulling the chain and using deadly solvents.
No more weird contraptions that bolt on to to your chain.
It's like heaven on earth.
Worst muck attractors in order of muckdom: Phil Tenacious Oil, WD 40, 90 Wt. Gear Lube, 30 Wt motor oil, transmission fluid,
No more pulling the chain and using deadly solvents.
No more weird contraptions that bolt on to to your chain.
It's like heaven on earth.
Worst muck attractors in order of muckdom: Phil Tenacious Oil, WD 40, 90 Wt. Gear Lube, 30 Wt motor oil, transmission fluid,
Last edited by cjenrick; 09-26-20 at 11:36 PM.
09-27-20, 10:52 AM
#116
Senior Member
What I do:
just like their product.
- Remove chain (use Connex chain link, doesn't matter what kind of chain you use, you don't need a Connex chain)
- throw the chain and Connex links into an ultrasonic cleaner (around 50-75 bucks on Harbor Freight)
- remove the wheels (optional)
- Give her a good spray down with simple green
- wipe off the main dirt
- spray your chain rings, then brush them with a metal wire brush
- metal wire brush also works good for scrubbing the cassette cogs
- wipe down chain rings with your rag
- use flat blade screwdriver to clean off the derailleur pulleys
- wipe down your pads, brakes, chainstay, bottom bracket area, etc....
- Get your chain out, wipe it down with a clean rag by holding the chain at one end, let it hang then just run the rag down it..do this multiple times.
- Reinstall your chain, add some fresh lube to it
- once everything is reinstalled, you can if you want to go the extra mile - rub a clean towel back in forth between the cassette cogs
just like their product.
09-27-20, 11:33 AM
#117
Full Member
If you ride everyday you need a system that does not take an hour or two everynight. that is why the silicone is great, because junk does not build up in the first place, so you simply run the chain thru a rag and you are done.
ever see those freaks at the self serve car wash? they got that high pressure nozzle going like crazy. well what that does is force water into every light socket on the car.
same with bikes, you do not want to use a pressure washer or a hose. you will be forcing water into bearings (yes, even sealed bearings are not perfect), you will be blowing lube out of your brakes, and many frames have small ventilation holes drilled into the forks and stays, so you will be forcing water into your frame.
so it is best just to use a damp cloth.
ever see those freaks at the self serve car wash? they got that high pressure nozzle going like crazy. well what that does is force water into every light socket on the car.
same with bikes, you do not want to use a pressure washer or a hose. you will be forcing water into bearings (yes, even sealed bearings are not perfect), you will be blowing lube out of your brakes, and many frames have small ventilation holes drilled into the forks and stays, so you will be forcing water into your frame.
so it is best just to use a damp cloth.
09-27-20, 06:52 PM
#118
Senior Member
Yep, Lemon Pledge is awesome. Since I use White Lightning, which is wax based, and Pledge has oils to dissolve excess wax, it makes a great chain cleaner as well as polish for the paint. Sure, not as durable as some hard automotive wax, but so much easier and smells great!
09-27-20, 07:18 PM
#119
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09-28-20, 01:42 PM
#121
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