Anti404

Hi all, I'm looking to replace my CAAD9 with a more endurance/sportive/relaxed frame to accommodate some back issues I've developed. I went and tested a few different bikes (Scott Solace - 56cm, Defy Advanced - 58cm, Synapse - 56/58cm, Felt Z4 - 56cm) and really couldn't distinguish much between them in terms of feel due to the short nature of the test rides I was allowed. In particular I've been trying to get sizing down, as I'm 6'1" w/ long legs and a short torso and never quite seemed to fit onto my 58cm CAAD9.

Is there any way to really get a good feel for the "right" bike, including frame size, in short (i.e. <1 mile) test rides?

Madtown Bob

I’ll read the label on the back of the wine bottle to see if I can really taste the flavors that they suggest. Sometimes I might be able to taste something that I wouldn’t ordinarily note but most of the times I have no idea what they’re talking about. Similarly, I might compare the bike geometries to see what the differences might suggest you should feel. Talk to the salesperson as well and ask them how different you look on the bikes. Then take the bikes out for a ride: do you feel the differences or do you have no idea what they’re talking about? Your rides should include some hills as well as flats, try to corner as fast as you can and try to make a real tight circle.

MRT2

Maybe you could have the shop put the bike on a trainer.

Inpd

I'm also looking for a more endurance style bike. The challenge is your buying a bike you hope to ride centuries on with great comfort but you have to decide after a 15 minute ride.

If your LBS only lets you ride for a mile then I'd get another LBS. That's ridiculous.

Anti404

Yes, that has been my concern as well. It is hard to say much from the short rides I've had. The Scott dealer allowed me a roughly 5 mile ride, but only had the 56cm frame so I couldn't compare it with the 58 or directly with the Giant/Felt/Cannondale bikes I was only able to ride for about 5min. Since I'm a 'tweener' with bike frame sizes I'd have really liked to take the 58 out after the 56. I have not yet been to the Trek/Specialized dealer.

RonH

Did you ask if you could do a longer test ride? Before I bought my 2010 Felt Z4 i asked and the shop manager said I could do a neighborhood ride. I ended up doing laps around the semi-hilly neighborhood for a total of just under 5 miles.
When I bought my Cannondale SuperSix EVO Hi-Mod last Sept I asked again and was told I could take the bike out for as long as I wanted. I did a 22 mile test ride.

jordanair45

Well, I mean, it's all about getting the best bike with the correct frame geometry for your size, always. Most are going to feel the same, positions will be about the same. Pedals, steam. seat post, handlebars, all come into play after. I could buy a really comfortable bike for me online, without a test ride, just by knowing the effective top tube length. I know for a fact I can go 54.8-56.4 cm, depending on the style I want.

For example, I love specialized. However, if I were to go with a 54 frame from them currently, it would be too small, and a 56 would be too big. Cannondale, currently for my body, has frames that are great for me, the geometry is better.

Know your measurements, know what kind of riding you're going to do, etc

Do use the calculator on competitive cyclist for a ballpark range. Because to me, even the longest test ride wouldn't matter. The bikes on the showroom floor are never set up correctly for your body.

thin_concrete

You're not going to learn much on a 15 minute ride around the parking lot. See if your LBS will let you take a bike out for a day or so and you can really put it through the paces.

I made the mistake of buying a bike that was too big after a parking lot ride and took a big loss on selling it.

Maelochs

This.

Considering you are planning to leave a healthy chunk of money with them, don't let them dictate how you shop. They don't care ... a 20-mile ride is no different from a 20-minute ride is no different than 20 feet across the parking lot ... they have your license and car keys and they are insured---for the bike.

As for your build, we are similar, and I end up usually with a 56 and some spacers ... a lot of bigger bikes have too much reach, even with a slightly longer head tube---the top tube stretches disproportionately it seems.

Endurance frames might be a little more forgiving ...

Anyway, check these sites below, and measure whatever you ride, and know what you like and what you would want longer or shorter.

Also (most important for me) measure Stack (BBcenter to center of virtual top tube (imaginary line stretching back, parallel to the ground, from the center of the headset to the seat tube (or where it would be if it rose up)----basically a vertical line rising from BB to center of the VTT.

And Reach--horizontal distance, parallel to the ground, from Stack line (vertical from BB) to center of headset.

I also measure BB to top of seat tube extended to top of saddle, and from that point both to center of headset and center of bars.

Bike Fit Calculator | Find Your Bike Size | Competitive Cyclist
Road Positioning Chart | Park Tool

Anti404

The reason I am doing short test rides is because these shops do not allow longer rides. They each have designated "courses" you can ride.

Maelochs

Tell them thanks, but you aren't dropping a couple grand on a bike you don't absolutely know is right for you. They can change their policies or you can visit other bike shops.

Or, tell them you need to do 30 laps of their course---again, if they don't like it ... you have the option to shop there or not.

Sometimes it might be really convenient to shop at a particular store ... but it is very inconvenient to buy the wrong sized bike. Tell them this, and ask them if they will put, in writing a one-week 100% return policy, where if a bike doesn't fit they will swap it for a different size.

or .. take your chances and buy the bike, and if it fits ... hooray!

But if it doesn't .. there are always posts here about people trying to make a wrong-sized bike fit, or having to sell one at a huge loss as thin_concrete did. You can be the next guy in that list, or you can shop around for a bike shop.

I guess if ti were me, it would depend on the "course" they allowed. if it was the three nearest right-angled streets to the bike shop with no hills, no room to really build up speed, and no room to cruise at speed in different positions before needing to turn, I would tell them, "I am serious about spending what this bike costs--here or somewhere else. if you cannot give me a serious test ride, why should I buy it here?"

If the course was long enough that i could actually stay in the drops or on the hoods for a good long while to see how it felt for a while before having to turn ... if there was room to get up a head of steam and cruise fast for a while, maybe do some S-curves at speed, maybe a quickish turn without risking a wreck ... then I would tell them I was going to ride the course until I was sure ... if that was a problem, no problem, good bye.

If nothing else, call all the bike shops within driving range and tell them what's up and see what they say.

Or ... do whatever makes you feel most comfortable. It is easy to type stuff, but you are the one who has to live it.

I like the Giant Defy and have heard a lot of good stuff about the Synapse.

I say, screw 'em all and build a Workswell 085.

StanSeven

I agree. I wouldn't buy a bike from a shop that doesn't allow a reasonable test ride.

San Pedro

Pretty much no shops here do test rides. It does make it tough to choose a bike by just sitting on it.

You guys are spoiled, and I'm jealous.

cyclezen

hate to be the guy who drops the cold water on the test ride... unless you have some reasonable knowledge as to what characteristics you wish, a test ride is influneced by so many variables. A change of just 4 - 5 mm in for/aft of saddle will make a difference, rotation of the bars, where the brifters are positioned on the bars, the other usual stuff like stem length & angle, tires and inflation. I mean you should be able to tell the difference between sizes in the same bike. But from one bike to another, differences will be influenced and not always by the obvious.
DO test rides? Sure, you may be blown over by a bike; and that's as good a place to start as anywhere.
Looks at the frame geometry specs - some things don;t mean anyhting and are dependent on more important factors (wheelbase) some are just so std, that most frames don't vary any amount (BB drop) and if they do vary quite a bit, I would be very suspect.
Things that are important - too small a head tube is very hard to compensate for properly, too tall can also be a problem, but less so. For tall riders with long legs - too steep of a seat angle is a real problem. For longleg/short torso too long toptube can be a real problem. Super short stems are not a solution for too long TT. Descending and tight turn navigation are a real problem if you are not over the front wheel enough. SHort stems amplify the movement of the bars.
Compare the important components - the drivetrain - the wheels, the gearing. Saddles are important, unless you already know what you need/want.
Get clued in on the geometry details of each considered bike. Things like wheel space in the chainstays would be a consideration for me. I bought a bike knowing full well that it would never allow tires over 23 on the older school narrow 17 & 19 mm rims. I bought it anyway and enjoyed it a bunch. But its now gonna be donated to the local cycling worksop because I no longer have wheels with rims narrow enough to fit the narrow stays.
A removeable/replaceable RD dropout hanger is a MUST HAVE for me - no screwing with permanent hangers.
Lots of small things add up to important differences.
make a list of importan things and then compare. try things which you might do often, like changing the rear wheel. Take it out of the dropout and then put it back in and see how exact the wheel/axle sits in the dropout. check the cranks for smooth fit, easy movement and no play. Check the wheels for play in the hubs, uneven tensioned spoke groups, smooth seams at the rim joints.
Things like that.

Dean V

You need to figure out the fit you want (reach, drop etc). You can do this with your existing bike. Then get a bike with frame geometry that suits your fit. If you are concerned about ride harshness make sure the new frame will accommodate a larger tyre.
All this can be done without having to test ride the new bike.

scarywombat

In Tokyo we recently had Specialized and Pinarello having `Test Ride` days. But apart from that, I agree it is tough

San Pedro

There's a shop in Nagoya that does them (Y's Road which also has branch in Tokyo I believe), but I think they do like 15 minute rides or something, and it's too far for me to go there leisurely to buy or service my bike.

I wonder if Specialized is doing a "Test Ride" day here at my local shop... already know what the Allez geometry feels like though...

BenPS

Best advice I've seen here. The internet seems to have this huge sense that 50 mile test rides are important to tell how a bike really feels over the long run, but honestly as long as the frame size is right (which you should already know, or be able to tell in a parking lot test) most everything else can be adjusted to fit. You wouldn't believe the amounts of bikes sold because one test ride had 80psi in the tires when the next one had 120 psi.

Sure you should try it out, and see how they handle, but don't be the guy that gets paralyzed for choice when buying a bike because you think that how each bike rode on test-ride day is the end all be all of how it can ride

GlennR

If all you're using to decide is a ride in a parking lot, then but the one that is the color you like best.

Obviously, a much longer ride is best.

If you trust the LBS, then go with their recommendation.

VegasTriker

Look it from the perspective of the bike shop. They may be trusting you with a very expensive bike not knowing if it will be returned in pristine condition. The longer the customer has it, the more likely it is to be damaged or show the effects of having been ridden before. Apparently customers may be put off by signs of wear as this post in the General Cycling section shows:

"I recently bought a road bike from multi-store LBS. I gave it a couple test rides then bought the bike online through their website for convenience. Instead of a new-build, it's going to be a bike that's been sitting on a rack in the store. I expected it would be a new build but there's probably fine print somewhere that says otherwise. I haven't seen the bike yet, but I've noticed that some bikes on the rack in their local store have wear on their tires and the handlebars are grubby. Certainly if I were to buy a bike in the store I would want the price to reflect the wear or at least ask for a new wrap job on the bars. What would be your threshold for wear and how would you handle it?"

Test rides are part of the business but can become an extra cost on the bike shop as this discussion shows. I remember a customer returning a rental bike with the front wheel seriously tacoed. He claimed he had no idea how it happened. The shop can't afford that with an expensive new bike.

dwing

Take your current bike with you to all the test rides and take a friend so you can jump on & off between bikes without having to go back into the shop each time. It'll provide immediate baseline feedback of your current situation and will help with the fit/feel of the bike you're demoing. The shop should be able to set up 2 different sizes for you (if they have it).. your friend is there to help with the quick swap outs.

Do this in a parking lot so you can make quick changes.. sprints, dive into corners, etc.. then swap and do the same. You should figure pretty quickly which sizing is right. And if you do this for each bike you're looking at it should help with process of elimination. Enjoy the hunt!

thin_concrete

I don't know that I entirely agree with you here. I understand what you're saying about wear, but I would be fine with putting up $200 or so that could be applied toward the purchase of the bike for a weekend "rental" so that I could really put the bike through a test. If I didn't like it, refund the money or give me another bike. You're not going to do that much wear over the course of a weekend, even if you do 2 century rides.

Obviously, a comprehensive policy would need to be developed, but it sure beats plunking down a bunch of money for something you only have 15 minutes with.

Anti404

Thanks for your response, as this seemed to answer my issue more than some other's posts (not that I don't appreciate their content as well). I've been reading up on geometry and sizing charts and it really seems that most of the "endurance" bikes are relatively similar, geometry wise. I really nitpicked and read and rode bikes when I got my CAAD9, but where I live now LBS just don't offer the services other people seem to get (i.e. extended test rides, pre-purchase fitting, etc.). Other people say take trips to find a good LBS but with my work schedule (on call 24-7 excluding pre-approved vacation) that isn't so easy and would also make after-purchase service difficult.

I have a feeling I'll pick up either a Scott Solace, CR-1, or Defy Advanced as they seemed to "just fit" better than the Felt or Synapse - though of course this could've been down to saddles, stem length, etc.

Shuffleman

I have to agree with this. Test rides are over rated because there are so many variables to consider. I personally have no problem buying a frame on line as long as I pay attention to the size and geometry. The rest is simply a matter of dialing in the correct fit.
I think that a shop should allow one to test ride the bikes and the lbs that I go to does. I also get why a shop would not allow much more than 15 minutes. It really cuts both ways. All the bikes that the OP mentioned are good bikes that should do the trick. Nail down your size and the specs that you want and you should be fine.

Maelochs

We are adaptable animals. Once you make that decision, it will be your bike, and you will adjust it to fit and it will, and you will love it.