Ergogenic drugs
12-09-15, 06:42 PM
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Ergogenic drugs
I figured with the popularity of the Ride Clean thread there might be some clean drugs to discuss. These are performance enhancing drugs / hormones (no calories) taken as allowed by USADA.
The hits I saw on ibuprofen were stomach bleeding. This might change things. New ibuprofen skin patch to deliver 12 hours of pain relief - CNET Anyone use ibuprofen to race?
The hits I saw on ibuprofen were stomach bleeding. This might change things. New ibuprofen skin patch to deliver 12 hours of pain relief - CNET Anyone use ibuprofen to race?
12-09-15, 06:44 PM
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I am fundamentally against the idea behind this thread.
I do realize there is a spectrum between blood doping and taking a supplement like Whey Protein (I drink whey shakes), but I am not into taking pharmacological agents to enhance performance, or aid in recovery.
Au naturale baby!
I do realize there is a spectrum between blood doping and taking a supplement like Whey Protein (I drink whey shakes), but I am not into taking pharmacological agents to enhance performance, or aid in recovery.
Au naturale baby!
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"Your beauty is an aeroplane;
so high, my heart cannot bear the strain." -A.C. Jobim, Triste
"Your beauty is an aeroplane;
so high, my heart cannot bear the strain." -A.C. Jobim, Triste
12-09-15, 06:47 PM
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I am fundamentally against the idea behind this thread.
I do realize there is a spectrum between blood doping and taking a supplement like Whey Protein (I drink whey shakes), but I am not into taking pharmacological agents to enhance performance, or aid in recovery.
Au naturale baby!
I do realize there is a spectrum between blood doping and taking a supplement like Whey Protein (I drink whey shakes), but I am not into taking pharmacological agents to enhance performance, or aid in recovery.
Au naturale baby!
12-09-15, 06:49 PM
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Like I said, I realize that it is a spectrum and there is a HUGE gray area.
Do I drink coffee? Yes, everyday.
Would I take a caffeine pill before a race? No. Would I drink coffee before a race? Yes. Is there a fundamental difference between the two? I don't know, but something about the former just feels dirty.
Do I drink coffee? Yes, everyday.
Would I take a caffeine pill before a race? No. Would I drink coffee before a race? Yes. Is there a fundamental difference between the two? I don't know, but something about the former just feels dirty.
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"Your beauty is an aeroplane;
so high, my heart cannot bear the strain." -A.C. Jobim, Triste
"Your beauty is an aeroplane;
so high, my heart cannot bear the strain." -A.C. Jobim, Triste
12-09-15, 06:52 PM
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Like I said, I realize that it is a spectrum and there is a HUGE gray area.
Do I drink coffee? Yes, everyday.
Would I take a caffeine pill before a race? No. Would I drink coffee before a race? Yes. Is there a fundamental difference between the two? I don't know, but something about the former just feels dirty.
Do I drink coffee? Yes, everyday.
Would I take a caffeine pill before a race? No. Would I drink coffee before a race? Yes. Is there a fundamental difference between the two? I don't know, but something about the former just feels dirty.
New study - you will live longer drinking coffee than not.
12-09-15, 06:58 PM
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So last year the rowing club my son joined this year won regionals and were getting ready for state. All the kids got a hold of this "pre-race" and ended up sick with caffeine poisoning - and didn't compete. It was a pretty big deal (police and all) The kids didn't know how to properly use legal substances.
12-09-15, 07:21 PM
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12-09-15, 07:22 PM
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12-09-15, 07:32 PM
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I started the thread because I was interested in both views and what they use.
So you see using caffeine and alcohol with purpose as "dirty" but recreational (you like it) is fine? Hey, I'm IPAing as I am posting. I don't see either one used properly as an issue. I see going around a corner mountain decent too fast (high risk) as an issue. Legal use of drugs for performance sounds like a good use of drugs.
So you see using caffeine and alcohol with purpose as "dirty" but recreational (you like it) is fine? Hey, I'm IPAing as I am posting. I don't see either one used properly as an issue. I see going around a corner mountain decent too fast (high risk) as an issue. Legal use of drugs for performance sounds like a good use of drugs.
12-09-15, 07:36 PM
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As a kid I was a pretty good white guy boxer. I was at the embassy Marine guard house in Liberia and got into a lift weights, take a shot, box a round with the Marines. Really all pretty stupid. I was 17ish - legal there but the Marines got in a lot of trouble for it. But I remember the more they drank the more they lifted - reps at least. Again, really bad stupid idea.
12-09-15, 08:13 PM
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The WADA code (they make the rules at this point) is sort of bizarre. The whole testing protocol was put in place originally because of health issues, not as some moral/fairness test. I'm not sure how they decide what goes on there now, but the pendulum has swung towards the latter. And it's nutty that we ostensibly subject one day license buyers to the same rules that we do Olympic athletes.
I'm not fundamentally opposed to this thread; though I can see why folks would be. if XYZ is not on the verbotten list it's likely folks are going to try it. If folks try it and break out in hives and vomit, it may be good to pass that on.
Everything we put into our bodies and every workout we do chemically alters us. We have the WADA list and our own mirrors to make choices.
FWIW Doge, ibuprofen is a blood thinner aside from being an analgesic NSAID. Could it increase the degree of internal bleeding or the likelihood of a cerebral hemorrhage in the case of an accident? Absolutely. Could it mask injury to the point where an athlete creates greater damage? I would say yes. Any performance gains or risks would have to be assessed individual to individual.
I'm not fundamentally opposed to this thread; though I can see why folks would be. if XYZ is not on the verbotten list it's likely folks are going to try it. If folks try it and break out in hives and vomit, it may be good to pass that on.
Everything we put into our bodies and every workout we do chemically alters us. We have the WADA list and our own mirrors to make choices.
FWIW Doge, ibuprofen is a blood thinner aside from being an analgesic NSAID. Could it increase the degree of internal bleeding or the likelihood of a cerebral hemorrhage in the case of an accident? Absolutely. Could it mask injury to the point where an athlete creates greater damage? I would say yes. Any performance gains or risks would have to be assessed individual to individual.
12-09-15, 08:38 PM
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taking ibuprofen would be stupid. it's proven to hurt recovery as well.
The use of nonsteroidal anti-inflammatory drugs for exercise-induced muscle damage: implications for skeletal muscle development. - PubMed - NCBI
I take caffeine pills before races because caffeine pills are reliably dosed and I know what I like. I also take caffeine pills before training sometimes because I like to train hard and caffeine makes that a little easier. Sometimes I take them because I have a headache because I'm addicted to caffeine and I haven't had any. Thankfully caffeine is cheap and the addiction is easy to break if I have a need to do that.
Otherwise Beta Alanine, Beets, ZMA.
I also don't let my dad buy me mercury wheels or perform any maintenance on my bike.
I gotta add, if you want to talk **** about my caffeine pills you better be prepared to defend your position vigorously, for a long time! Well into the night! Probably right through to morning!
!!!!
The use of nonsteroidal anti-inflammatory drugs for exercise-induced muscle damage: implications for skeletal muscle development. - PubMed - NCBI
I take caffeine pills before races because caffeine pills are reliably dosed and I know what I like. I also take caffeine pills before training sometimes because I like to train hard and caffeine makes that a little easier. Sometimes I take them because I have a headache because I'm addicted to caffeine and I haven't had any. Thankfully caffeine is cheap and the addiction is easy to break if I have a need to do that.
Otherwise Beta Alanine, Beets, ZMA.
I also don't let my dad buy me mercury wheels or perform any maintenance on my bike.
I gotta add, if you want to talk **** about my caffeine pills you better be prepared to defend your position vigorously, for a long time! Well into the night! Probably right through to morning!
!!!!
Last edited by Ygduf; 12-09-15 at 08:44 PM.
12-09-15, 08:40 PM
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There is also a school of thought that NSAIDS decrease the effect of training by reducing post-exercise inflammation. The proposed mechanism is that inflammation increases the tension on membranes and the membranes respond to the stress by releasing signalling factors which tell the body to adapt.
I have used, in decreasing order: caffeinated drinks and gels; BCAA caps (which is sort of a food, but I don't take it for the calories); allowed amounts of pseudoephedrine; and have experimented with small amounts of sodium bicarbonate (compared to the doses used in research which are huge).
I have used, in decreasing order: caffeinated drinks and gels; BCAA caps (which is sort of a food, but I don't take it for the calories); allowed amounts of pseudoephedrine; and have experimented with small amounts of sodium bicarbonate (compared to the doses used in research which are huge).
12-09-15, 08:52 PM
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does that buffer LA production or something?
__________________
"Your beauty is an aeroplane;
so high, my heart cannot bear the strain." -A.C. Jobim, Triste
"Your beauty is an aeroplane;
so high, my heart cannot bear the strain." -A.C. Jobim, Triste
Last edited by TMonk; 12-09-15 at 08:58 PM.
12-09-15, 08:59 PM
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Effects of Sodium Bicarbonate on High-Intensity Endurance Performance in Cyclists: A Double-Blind, Randomized Cross-Over Trial. - PubMed - NCBI
They used 0.3g/kg, the most I have tried is 0.1g/kg.
Sodium bicarbonate intake improves high-intensity intermittent exercise performance in trained young men. - PubMed - NCBI
Here 0.4g/kg... which is a big pile of salt...
They used 0.3g/kg, the most I have tried is 0.1g/kg.
Sodium bicarbonate intake improves high-intensity intermittent exercise performance in trained young men. - PubMed - NCBI
Here 0.4g/kg... which is a big pile of salt...
12-09-15, 09:01 PM
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This was widespread with race horses for a number of years, but is now prohibited. (Even when there was significant use, the legality was gray at best but testing protocols hadn't been established and many 'got away' with it.)