cassette

I just want to see your face

dutret

cassette or broken record?

humble_biker

What's the rear spacing? That should be your main concern because a lugged/epoxy bond wont take kindly to lateral stress like clamping the rear drops.
Saying one frame material is better than any others in a crash is just plain old fashioned ********, crashes are crashes, regardless...Had a friend...hit a dog...carbon fork snapped... steel frame seemingly ok...less than a year later the crack in the down tube appears...

TLN

If you arent going to ride track, dont buy a track bike. Stick with a fixie for urban riding... different geometry! Dont waste your money.

Fugazi Dave

Yeah, HE GOT HIT. Whatever your bike frame material, if you get hit all bets are off.

Not riding carbon because it might fail when you get hit by a car is one of the stupidest things I've ever heard of here. You ride what you ride because of its qualities AS YOU'RE RIDING IT. Unless you're a ****ing suicide artist or something, always throwing yourself before cars in some misguided protest against the absurdity of life, what your frame is going to do in a catastrophic accident or crash shouldn't really be a big factor in buying a frame in the first place. If I get hit hard enough to damage my frame, that's probably the useful end of that frame, regardless of the material.

Bottom line is that carbon fiber is a damned good frame material, but like any other material it has its bad points as well. So does steel. Get over it.

TLN

I think what some people are trying to say, and excuse me if they arent, is that some frame materials' catastrophic failure will have a faster impact than others. In either case the crash will probably be unavoidable but the sign(s) of what is about to happen can be more apparent. Again CF and Aluminum, when at their failing point, is very sudden. Steel is less sudden and can show signs before the failure. Will you have time to react before the crash? Who can say. You'll find that out when it happens I guess.

Brian

I expect an abrupt return to civility in this thread. Also, do not go around the censors to post your profanity. That will result in a swift and lasting (1 week) ban. Your immediate cooperation is appreciated.

See, it's all about speed.

By the way, would the guy in the hospital bed have fared any better on a non-carbon frame?

Fugazi Dave

Demanding civility on this forum is like walking into a burger joint and demanding a Vietnamese entrée...

barba

I would give a very close look at the bonding between the CF tubes and the lugs. If the price is good, I would try it. There is no sense getting all Ludite about frames, IMO.

Morgie

+1


seems like someone is proud of their Blue Star... I guess it's kinda like a cop who just got his badge...

Brian

Right. Or the administrator who is sick of all the jerks that can't seem to get along.

Fugazi Dave

Either way, my point still stands.

Morgie

"THE" administrator...



Whatever man, I'm not tryin to cause trouble but I can't help but realize that you came over from the road forum and started layin the law down over here and tell'in folks what you "expect"...

I agree people should act a little more civil, and if you read the thread I wasn't in this debate or acting uncivil, but it's almost comical and sort annoying when admins wander into FGSS and start lay'n down the law. 165 does a pretty decent job, and I think has the respect of a lot of FGSS regulars.

roadgator

there are 2 types of overload failure. brittle and ductile.

ductile failure is when the material gradually stretches and tears away from itself (like bending a paper clip). this is the way that the steel and aluminum in bike frames should fail. it is preferable because the deformation that comes before the actual separation absorbs very large amounts of energy, which will in a sense soften the eventual failure.

in brittle failure (like snapping a dry stick) the material will deform and store energy like in ductile failure. however, the deformation is not permanent so when the 2 halves separate they will spring back to appear like the piece was cleaved clean in 1/2 and they could go right back together. in essence the part will "spring apart" releasing energy instead of storing it, leading to a potentially more catastrophic failure.

a single carbon fiber strand will fail this way, but when mixed with epoxy in a composite the sequential tearing of hundreds of individual strands will make the part as a whole fall somewhere in between the two modes.

but i think you have bigger problems to worry about if you and the bike are under enough force to cause either of these failures.

robtown

Thanks, I bought the frame. The first owner bought the bike in Japan for about $1,000 and stripped the components when it was too large. Apparently the px brought in small lots and he thought it would do.
It has some scrapes and the carbon seems limited to the triangle. I like the look, it's my size, and transferring the wheelset from the current ss saves on cost. It also allows me to reduce my bikes by 1 (selling hybrid to finance a carbon fork). It's 24.5" and 126mm rear.

BTW - I have an 853 steel Fuji World frame built as a 2 ring road bike / commuter with rack and fenders. The current SS is a 531 frameset 73 Raleigh. I do like steel.
The posts also fit my suntour cyclone shifters and I have a 126 wheelset so ss/fixie is not the only option.

Brian

I did not come "over from the road forum", nor did I start laying down the law over here. When we signed up for the forums, we all agreed to abide by certain rules and guidelines. Sometimes people in here need a reminder of that.

BostonFixed

Go for it. That's a rad frame. I'd be honored to ride it fixed or geared, although I'd probably put gears on it.

garagegirl

This is like telling lemmings not to jump off a cliff. But yeah, plus one.

mikearena

Mechanical engineers to the rescue! Did you graduate yet?

teddycarfolite

Is everyone here as angry as this guy? I just like bikes. In my mind "hipsters" united to keep cyclists up at night *****ing about their messenger bags and OG ways. A pleasing thought?

dutret

I'm not angry. There is just no reason to accommodate the elitist attitude that "true track bikes" are inherently more desirable then conversions or road specific bikes. The frequent expression of it on this board and elsewhere serves to encourage conformity and leads to people riding bikes that are ideal only in the sense of conforming to some faddish norm they have confused with functional advantage. Noobs are pounded over and over again with the suggestion that if they keep biking they are going to want something that is "track," which convinces them that track stuff is better for their purposes and in the end causes them to buy it. Chances are though track stuff is overpriced and does not not serve their purposes as well as road stuff does but they have been so thoroughly indoctrinated with this mantra that they will suffer with lesser functionality and repeat it to a new group of noobs. The statement becomes a downward spiral of self fulfilling prophecy.

Blanket statements such as poster Jet's should therefore be met swiftly and brutally with the scorn they deserve being both ignorant and elitist but worst of all confusing some faddish aesthetic ideal with functional advantage. This serves the purpose both of discouraging people from repeating them without the knowledge to back them up and quickly providing a counter point to those who may otherwise have accepting this position as fact merely because they have heard it so frequently.

This is not to say that no one is going to be best served by a track bike some people probably will be. For those who want a bike to ride best not gets the best compliments though this group will be a small minority.

Sammyboy

You do seem to have a deep seated desire, however, to enter into misguided pissing contests. You're very often right, but you have a way of putting things which most people don't seem to be able to avoid getting angry at. I'd call it flamebait, since you KNOW by now what will happen every time. Many people are able to make a point about bikes, bike mechanics, bike parts etc without making a personal attack at the same time, and walk away. Sometimes their points are taken on board, sometimes not. You, however, have battle in your blood, and have to deal with everything as though you were a professional wrestler. If you're like this off the 'net as well, your life must be exhausting.

dutret

It's far more exhausting to *****foot around correcting peoples irrational and dogmatic statements then to directly refute them without worrying about whether they may take offense or not. Any ensueing argument also makes the error the original statement harder to ignore to those who have not yet accepted the dogma.

EDIT: I hate these censors. That was a perfectly acceptable use of the word since it is referencing the way a cat walks rather then then a certain naughty bit.

Sammyboy

Possibly a telling comment. Many people find it more natural to be pleasant. I for one would find it quite hard work to be as rude as you. This is why people think you're angry, because for them to respond the way you do, they'd have to be really really pissed off about other issues the whole time.

fix

Best, and classiest, response to Dutret yet.