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Just *****ing about Trek

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Just *****ing about Trek

Old 07-07-20, 07:42 PM
  #1  
Elbeinlaw
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Just *****ing about Trek

My wife and I bought new Treks, the first new bikes we've bought in years. They have all this new (to us) technology: Bluetooth, disc brakes, hydraulic braking systems, spindle (?) quick releases … So I thought that of course there would be instruction manuals.

Nope. Not hard copy. Not on line. So I called Trek and asked for a maintenance or repair manual.

They don't have one. I have to call each individual component manufacturer. WTF? That's the bright shining future I have survived into, where manufacturers' customer "support" consultants can just say, "We don't owe that to you, go call each of the the components manufacturers"? Don't get me wrong, I understand that they use whatever components are available, and can't predict where they will be from or what the best combinations will be as the market changes. But if wire disk brakes are wire disk brakes, and hydraulic disk brakes are hydraulic disk brakes, it's not their responsibility to me as their customer to make sure they get me some general information about how to adjust these damn things?

I'm really disgusted.
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Old 07-07-20, 07:54 PM
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Join the club of customers who are finding out that in this new world the sourcing of data is not a click and paste or a printed page in a bag dangling on the bars. This topic has been visited here is a few different ways recently. Some of the issue is the changing specs and the off shore assembly/manufacturing delivery time lines. Some of it is the push to have the brand's dealer the only ones that service the bike. Some of it is the local dealer's staff that has limited space and organizational ability to retain and deliver the scant info that does come packaged with the bike. Some of it is the cost of printing the info and the ever shifting spec. Understand that the component manufacturer's customer is the bike brand, not the rider. But all levels of the business share some blame, including IMO the rider who buys the latest stuff when expecting the info but isn't provided it. Andy
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Old 07-07-20, 08:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Elbeinlaw View Post
I have to call each individual component manufacturer. WTF?
I don't think calling a component manufacturer will get you much. I doubt many of them have printed instructions to send you. I haven't encountered a current part that didn't have instructions readily accessible online. If the manufacturer doesn't have info on their site there are likely to be You Tube videos. I don't recall bikes ever coming with much in the way of instructions. IMO, there is a more info available now than there ever was before, just in a different format. Plus you can always ask on BF
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Old 07-07-20, 08:21 PM
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I have never gotten an instruction manual with a bike. And years ago there was no internet or youtube. There were generic repair books, but a lot of info came from word of mouth and trial and error. Admittedly, bikes were a bit simpler many years ago.

The concept of being provided all inclusive maintenance instructions over many manufacturers is completely foreign to me.

John
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Old 07-07-20, 08:40 PM
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Instruction manual as in owners manual? I think almost all of my bikes came with them, even the ones I bought online. Most recent was a Redline earlier this year. It actually came with what I thought was a very informative manual. They tell you how everything works on the bike, but they are not repair manuals.
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Old 07-07-20, 08:51 PM
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Only help I can offer is to just google your Trek bikes models and "owners manual" and see what comes up.
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Old 07-08-20, 05:55 AM
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Originally Posted by Elbeinlaw View Post
My wife and I bought new Treks. . . So I thought that of course there would be instruction manuals.

Nope. Not hard copy. Not on line.

I'm really disgusted.
https://www.trekbikes.com/us/en_US/manuals/
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Old 07-08-20, 06:55 AM
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Just about any eg. Campy part I've bought comes with a User Manual. Eg. a replacement FD I bought came with a 47page printed manual (English portion, a couple other languages as well in addition). Is the same the case with Shimano parts? I presume that what we're discussing is the fact that Shimano and others don't supply those same manuals to the bike manufacturers, or if they do, the bike manufacturers for some reason aren't putting them in the bike box that ships to the LBS?
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Old 07-08-20, 07:28 AM
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The user/owner manuals that come\cae with bicycles was\is pretty generic. And mostly useless.
Google is you friend, just search for "How do i adjust " component name.
Most bike adjustment, repair, service isn't terrible difficult. Well within the reach of average mechanical skills. A good set of allen wrenches is a good place to start for tools, along with a screwdriver, and a willingness to try to do the work yourself.
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Old 07-08-20, 07:48 AM
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Originally Posted by 70sSanO View Post
I have never gotten an instruction manual with a bike. And years ago there was no internet or youtube. There were generic repair books, but a lot of info came from word of mouth and trial and error. Admittedly, bikes were a bit simpler many years ago.

The concept of being provided all inclusive maintenance instructions over many manufacturers is completely foreign to me.

John
With my Turner, I got a small manual that was semi-useful in cable routing. IBIS is the best though. My Ripley came with an absolutely wonderful book that described the ins and outs of the bike and cable routing tips and suggestions. A keeper for sure.

Originally Posted by Sy Reene View Post
Just about any eg. Campy part I've bought comes with a User Manual. Eg. a replacement FD I bought came with a 47page printed manual (English portion, a couple other languages as well in addition). Is the same the case with Shimano parts? I presume that what we're discussing is the fact that Shimano and others don't supply those same manuals to the bike manufacturers, or if they do, the bike manufacturers for some reason aren't putting them in the bike box that ships to the LBS?
But the campy notes and manuals that come with the parts are useless. They have zero useful information. Just bought tons of Campagnolo parts and can't say I will keep a single one. Information on line is OK.

Originally Posted by leob1 View Post
The user/owner manuals that come\cae with bicycles was\is pretty generic. And mostly useless.
Google is you friend, just search for "How do i adjust " component name.
Most bike adjustment, repair, service isn't terrible difficult. Well within the reach of average mechanical skills. A good set of allen wrenches is a good place to start for tools, along with a screwdriver, and a willingness to try to do the work yourself.
I agree that most are generic and useless. IBIS has been the exception to me. Most bike stuff is easy and with youtube, easy to learn.
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Old 07-08-20, 07:51 AM
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Originally Posted by Sy Reene View Post
Just about any eg. Campy part I've bought comes with a User Manual. ... Is the same the case with Shimano parts?
I've bought three folding bikes, a mountain bike and a road bike over the last 20 years or so. All had Shimano components with the instruction sheets/brochures/manuals included. The folders all had instruction manuals from the manufacturers.
Most of the other bikes I've bought (for my kids) over the years had the basics in a bag attached to the bars, as mentioned ^^ by Andy. It seems to me that part of the problem is that since the beginning bicycles have been considered "simple machines", if not "toys", needing no explanation because any old back-yard mechanic could figure them out. As time has gone on, and components have become wildly more sophisticated, the owners' needs for home-maintenance purposes may have been left behind in many cases.
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Old 07-08-20, 07:59 AM
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Some years back my old beloved Nishiki touring bike frame broke. Since some of the components were 1980 vintage and was mostly using for commuting, I decided to buy a low end Trek. It came with a useless manual which had no specifications of components. I identified each component with models #'s so I could determine replacements in future. This was easy at time of bike purchase since I could easily find matches on the web. Years later, this has made replacement of components simpler. I find Trek Al frames to be way too rigid. The wheels were garbage and needed replacement relatively early. In retrospect, I wish I had repaired the Nishiki frame and replaced all the components.
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Old 07-08-20, 08:01 AM
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Did you get a repair manual with your car?

https://si.shimano.com/#/

https://www.servicearchive.sram.com/service
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Old 07-08-20, 08:59 AM
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So the OP was unable to find the online manuals at Trek (see link above courtesy ljsense). Just a cursory look shows them
to be more comprehensive than expected. The sad part is that apparently his LBS and the Trek person he called were unaware
or uninterested in letting the OP know about the online resources.
I have noticed the past 5-6 yrs that Shimano has moved all their user info online as well but the access to the dealer manuals
is very useful.

FWIW my most recent car had a basic 400pp owner manual but a great deal was left out, with the owner referred to the online
manual for more detailed info.
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Old 07-08-20, 09:21 AM
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Originally Posted by ljsense View Post
The generic Trek bike manual does have some useful info in it, and I was not aware of it. On the other hand, if I buy a $6000 bike, I kind of expect to get a manual that's tailored to that bike. So I'd still say Trek falls short in the manual department.
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Old 07-08-20, 09:48 AM
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Originally Posted by WizardOfBoz View Post
The generic Trek bike manual does have some useful info in it, and I was not aware of it. On the other hand, if I buy a $6000 bike, I kind of expect to get a manual that's tailored to that bike. So I'd still say Trek falls short in the manual department.
It doesn't seem unreasonable. But I'd be curious to see an example of this, if it exists.

Trek released a very detailed and helpful model-specific manual for the Madone 9 when it came out (in 2016 I think?) but that bike was over $6,000. Maybe $10,000 is the threshold for a copywriter to step into manual production. Overall, it seems like they do a better job than most in explaining their products. They have a massive YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/user/trekbikesusa/videos

When I bought my first racing bike at age 15, which seemed to cost all the money in the world, or at least every dollar I could muster, the manual was just a generic pamphlet with legal disclaimers and so on. I had to learn to race and fix it in the grand tradition of cycling.
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Old 07-08-20, 09:54 AM
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Not new, and not unique to Trek. 14 years ago, and 8 years before that, the manual that came with my new bikes we 2 pages of "Isn't this a great bike?", 5 pages of "Don't ride the bike, it could be dangerous" warnings, and 10 pages of "Take it to your dealer to get it serviced."

Maybe not the seat height adjustment. Maybe I was capable of tightening the seat clamp. But I'm not sure about that.
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Old 07-08-20, 09:58 AM
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Originally Posted by sch View Post
FWIW my most recent car had a basic 400pp owner manual but a great deal was left out, with the owner referred to the online
manual for more detailed info.
My recent cars have also come with huge owner's manuals but the majority of the information covers the "infotainment" systems, other electronic do-dads and what all of the buttons and touch screen icons do. The other major topics were the nearly endless safety warnings and lawyer-speak and some maintenance guidelines such as oil and filter change intervals, etc. It had absolutely no repair information at all. That's what Youtube, books and past experience cover.
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Old 07-08-20, 10:28 AM
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No manuals

That's what makes the forum so valuable!

I recall back in the early eighties when we'd by a new HP mini- computer at work, it would come with about 20 large binders crammed with technical information on every aspect of the hardware and software; a significant investment of time and money by the seller, but vastly increasing the ability of users to interface and build on the original system.

Those were the days... now you by a tablet that comes in a plastic bag and no instructions to tell you how to turn it on. We get great prices now, though. Before the internet, finding info was brutal, and providing it with products essential. Now, not so much.
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Old 07-08-20, 10:50 AM
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I think it’s fantastic that you can reach into your pocket and grab your phone and look up a manual for any part on any bike at any time.
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Old 07-08-20, 11:13 AM
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These days are long gone.


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Old 07-08-20, 11:30 AM
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Did not get the CD* with the bike? each component if bought separately retail in the individual box would have a printed page,
but you did not buy a frame and every part separately..
*one came in the Carton with the small parts for the set up mechanic to install ..

but typically it not in the hang tag on the displayed bike.. you ask for all that when you bought the Bike?
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Old 07-08-20, 11:35 AM
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Originally Posted by ljsense View Post
It doesn't seem unreasonable. But I'd be curious to see an example of this, if it exists.

Trek released a very detailed and helpful model-specific manual for the Madone 9 when it came out (in 2016 I think?) but that bike was over $6,000. Maybe $10,000 is the threshold for a copywriter to step into manual production. Overall, it seems like they do a better job than most in explaining their products. They have a massive YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/user/trekbikesusa/videos

When I bought my first racing bike at age 15, which seemed to cost all the money in the world, or at least every dollar I could muster, the manual was just a generic pamphlet with legal disclaimers and so on. I had to learn to race and fix it in the grand tradition of cycling.
When I bought my Paramount in 1979, it came with a manual.
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Old 07-08-20, 11:52 AM
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Originally Posted by vespasianus View Post

But the campy notes and manuals that come with the parts are useless. They have zero useful information. Just bought tons of Campagnolo parts and can't say I will keep a single one. Information on line is OK.
.
I don't think I agree. Yes, perhaps better or more easily followed tutorials might be found online, but it's a stretch to say their manuals have zero useful information.

Heck the manual that comes with even a Chorus chain (123 pages btw) covers correct way to size, remove, pin and peen, determine wear requiring replacement, etc. The FD manual covers normal operation (2 clicks vs 3 clicks), how to use the barrel adjusters, etc..
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Old 07-08-20, 11:52 AM
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Originally Posted by Darth Lefty View Post
I think it’s fantastic that you can reach into your pocket and grab your phone and look up a manual for any part on any bike at any time.
Exactly. Not like anyone misses the phone book. Maybe I should have said “almost” anyone.

John
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