Mantis Style

So I took the plunge to start riding with a group and it went well. Much more fun, but much more intense than riding alone. I hung with the group & I'm "ok" with staying close but I know I have a ways to go.

My question is, how many "close calls" do you wind up having on your group rides?

Reason I ask is that on this particular ride, there were no accidents but I saw a lot of things that guys shouldn't have been doing - such as overlapping wheels, making dangerous turns, running lights. Or should I say, things that I've read you should really avoid on group rides. There were at least 3 or 4 really close calls where guys could have gone down just for them being lazy I suppose or not paying attention.

Again, I'm new to group riding so maybe this is just what I should expect? Didn't seem like there was a "leader" to tell me (or anyone else) what to do if/when they screwed up - which is what I figured what would happen. More of an organized free-for-all. Everyone knew each other though, so maybe that was my perception of things due to being new.

Good group? Bad group? Average? Should I be looking elsewhere?

(FYI, it was about 15-20 guys, we averaged over the day around 17-18mph through pretty hilly terrain (around 25-26 or so through the flat areas). Definitely right at or sometimes above what I can do fitness wise so it's very good for me in that respect.)

mkadam68

Well, in the end, we weren't there so we can't tell you if it was normal or not. That said, sounds somewhat normal, yes.

Overlapping wheels is, on one hand, fine, and on the other, dumb. It, in itself, won't crash you. But if the guy you're overlapping doesn't hold his line, then there's a good chance you'll go down (or whoever is doing it).

Running red lights is also stupid. It's overly dangerous, and it gives cyclists--particularly group rides--a bad name. But there's circumstances that may change that generalization. I regularly do group rides, specifically training rides. We don't run a red light if it's red when we get to it, but if the front of the group goes through while green & it changes, the remaining riders will follow & get out of cars way ASAP (this is a 100-200 rider group ride).

In our area, there's not really a "leader" because they can then become responsible if something bad does happen. But, there are some accepted standards of group ride etiquette. The first two are: hold your line and don't panic.

Good luck with your training.

DropDeadFred

running red lights or rolling through lights after looking...if you look at the law certain states don't require you to stop completely as a cyclist. overlapping wheels always happens....even the best riders do it...hold your line and youll be fine. the problem I hate is people who give an awesome pull and then drop because they tried to show off at the front because it hurts the overall group when he's not there for another pull later. I'm going out for my first group ride with the "fast guys". I've been doing real well lately on our group rides...I'm sure I'll get droped but if i don't go out I'll never get faster

Mantis Style

Yep, it's all pretty much as you describe it mkadam68 - for the most part no one was panicky, but definitely weren't smooth on holding their line. As that article states, it didn't SEEM like these guys were overly predictable. Unless we were going fast and all strung out in a line in which things all made sense (to me anyway).

Maybe it's just a matter of me getting used to it, but man it all seems like its just ONE screw up and everyone goes down. Rather than having some wiggle room in there somehow in case someone makes a bad move. Is that just something you get used to?

Mantis Style

DropDeadFred - Lights - It's more of a case that the guys in front will go through the light just as it's turning yellow, requiring everyone in the back to run through the light and potentially into traffic. I'm not even talking about pulling yet, simply because I was just holding on the other day and had no idea if I was even going to be able to make it....

DC_United_Fan

Sounds like a regular everyday group ride to me. Yes, you will get used to it, and it shouldn't take too long to get comfortable.

mkadam68

One screw up could bring down alot of people. Unfortunately happens on group rides all over the world. Happens in the pro peloton (i.e.: Tour de Crash this year). That's why if you do something sudden & unexpected, you get hollered at.

What you (and any one else on a group ride) need to do is practice ahead of time. This will help you remain calm in group settings (get used to it). Bump drills, looking backwards, touching the ground, etc... All these help you feel more comfortable on the bike, and help you remain calm if you are touched. Just cause your front wheel touches someone else's rear does not mean you will crash: it can be avoided. Just this past weekend, someone bumped handlebars & rubbed shoulders it spooked him. He stopped pedaling (a no-no) and went backwards, losing the support of the other riders' shoulder. Down he went. He should have just leaned into him, regained his composure, and ridden out of it. No big deal.

And yes, a faster ride is (usually) a safer ride.

merlinextraligh

As for the "close calls" my bet is that your inexperience riding in a group makes you worried about things that others wouldn't even notice or think twice about.

Unless the guys you are riding with are really sketchy, I think your comfort zone will expand with experience, and you'll look back at this thread with a much different perspective.

As to the red lights, running red lights in a group is a personal pet peeve of mine, and it's wrong for a gazillion reasons. The people at the front need to stop if the lights turning yellow and the whole group can't make it through the light safely. If it's not safe to stop, the front of the group that does make it through should sit up and soft pedal, so that no one feels compelled to run the light, or get dropped.

uciflylow

Lapping wheels on these kind of rides are quite common. I have gotten into the ridder in front of me on a few occasions. Learn how to handle unexpected contact!
As I told a new fella I have been ridding with "in these pace lines you need to be like a banana milk shake, smooth and cool!" You will learn in time that there are some people you can draft, and some you can't!

EdIsMe

I've only been riding a few months now, but have seen/experienced just about everything you described. For me, the solution is simply to keep a level head and know how to anticate and deal with problems as they arise. As a general rule: Stay calm, never panic.

Palomar01

Yup. It's normal. I don't think one gets used to it, riders just get numb to the dangers of it. I didn't like it the first time and I still don't like it. Group rides is usually where people have "contact" more and crash. When it happens on a fast ride it's ugly. Now I just ride with one or two guys I know well. That's it. Running red lights, and watching someone's rear wheel for hours is not my cup of tea.

Oh yeah I've fallen prey to pulling too hard then getting dropped because I was showing off. It's hard not to try hard when you're pulling because there are a lot of guys who get a bit annoyed if you're too slow. I'm one of them of the puller is slower than what I'm comfortable with. I keep my mouth shut though but all I can think about is I want to get ahead of the slow pull.

Riding with just one or two guys who go at the same pace as I do works better for me. It's less dangerous, less stressful, and a whole lot more fun. I guess I'm not that competitive.

prathmann

Which states are those? AFAIK, Idaho is the only state that allows cyclists to go through a red light if there's no conflicting traffic but they still require the cyclist to come to a full stop first and only proceed if safe. Some states also allow you to proceed if you've waited a specified amount of time and/or number of cycles if the traffic sensor doesn't detect you - but again a full stop is still required.

marcosbullock

My cycling team? Very few.

My triathlon team? I wish I could wear two helmets!

JayC

Depends on which group I ride with. If I ride with the faster guys, its usually very safe. There is a slightly slower group that Ive been riding with because I gained a lot of weight and couldnt hang with the fast guys and every time I ride with them I feel l'm taking my life into my own hands. Last time I rode with them, we had the tandem out and a girl in front of us slammed on her brakes for an oncoming car. It wasnt in our lane.. at all.. and there was no reason to lock them up for an oncoming car but she did and I went off and everyone got mad at me.

Needless to say the next week I rode with the faster group and just hung on as long as I could.

kimconyc

Which club/group were you riding with if you don't mind answering?

njkayaker

It's one state, Idaho (cyclists can treat stop signs as yields and stop lights as stop signs). Oregon tried to pass a similar law but failed.

DC_United_Fan

DropDeadFred

correct...but how often are you going to make that full stop just to unclip when it's clearly safe. I had a situation in florida where me and a friend were riding and we came up to a red light...stopped in the front and the light stayed red for a solid 3-5 minutes it seemed...we didn't go because a cop was behind us and I was unsure of their laws. we inched up to allow the cop to set off the sensor so we could all finally get to moving...

halfspeed

Different groups are different. My weekend group ride is with a bunch of veteran (read old) riders, some of whom have significant masters and/or upper category racing experience. That ride is fast, but very smart. It's a tightly organized double or rotating paceline. We're professionals with families and careers. The weekday rides have some younger guys and it's also fast, but lots more aggressive and everyone better be on his toes. It's not unsafe, but awareness is paramount. Pacelines come together and break apart with surges, sprints, and hill attacks. There's another ride in town about which I've heard nothing good. Then there are slower groups and the skills vary widely there as well. Right now, as a n00b you're probably a bit squirrely and if nobody is yelling at you or taking you aside for some instruction, chances are good that your group ride is a bit squirrely as well.