Mystery Tange Prestige frame!
07-29-11, 11:41 AM
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Mystery Tange Prestige frame!
I recently purchased this frame on ebay for $125 shipped. The seller claims that it was made by Centurion, but there are no brand decals and the serial# does not match T-Mar's format. If in fact it is Tange Prestige, like the sticker indicates, and made by Centurion, then it is a Centurion Prestige. Am I correct in thinking this? What year would it be? 1989?
Here is what I know:
Serial # 89C3190
Standard 68mm ENG threaded BB
Recessed brake bolts
700c rims
100mm front spacing / 130mm rear
Shimano forged dropouts
Braze on shifters / bottle bosses (2-sets) & cable guides.
27.2mm seat post
1" steerer tube
28.6mm FD clamp diameter
These are the seller's photos, I will add more photos when I am finished building it up.
Here is what I know:
Serial # 89C3190
Standard 68mm ENG threaded BB
Recessed brake bolts
700c rims
100mm front spacing / 130mm rear
Shimano forged dropouts
Braze on shifters / bottle bosses (2-sets) & cable guides.
27.2mm seat post
1" steerer tube
28.6mm FD clamp diameter
These are the seller's photos, I will add more photos when I am finished building it up.
07-29-11, 02:48 PM
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Centurion offered a Tange Prestige frame in 1985, in the US market, and called it the Prestige.
It was a two-tone grey/grey model and was all Dura Ace 7400, 2x6 indexed, lugged fork crown.
The seat stay caps were satin-finished, and I think it had chromed dropouts and fork ends.
Because the seller offered me the frameset for $200 and the rest of the components for $400 more,
I ended up building this out of 600 tricolor, 7-speed. In hindsight, I should have bought it all.
A while later, on eBay and then here, a much newer Prestige by Centurion popped up, with the same
type of "marbled" fade treatment found on the 1989 Ironman, but in a blue-to-white scheme.
It did, however, have a unicrown fork, which had Prestige lables on it, also. It did not have Dura Ace components,
and appeared to be 100% Shimano 600 tricolor. The decals were very consistent with 1988 or 1989 Centurion schemes,
and it did have Prestige tubing per its labels.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/meadowa...n/photostream/
My guess at the time, and still is, is that it was not a US market offering, but rather a step up from the
non-US "Triathlon" model, which had Shimano 105 and Tange 1 tubing. I really don't know that much
more than what I've seen in photos of the non-US market models.
Those are the only two models I've ever seen. There were other,
very similar Prestige-framed bikes around the same time.
The Panasonic DX6000 comes to mind, and I believe Nishiki offered a Prestige-framed bike; not sure if it was their Prestige model or not.
There is currently an '85 on eBay.
https://cgi.ebay.com/85-Centurion-Pre...-/320733386263
It was a two-tone grey/grey model and was all Dura Ace 7400, 2x6 indexed, lugged fork crown.
The seat stay caps were satin-finished, and I think it had chromed dropouts and fork ends.
Because the seller offered me the frameset for $200 and the rest of the components for $400 more,
I ended up building this out of 600 tricolor, 7-speed. In hindsight, I should have bought it all.
A while later, on eBay and then here, a much newer Prestige by Centurion popped up, with the same
type of "marbled" fade treatment found on the 1989 Ironman, but in a blue-to-white scheme.
It did, however, have a unicrown fork, which had Prestige lables on it, also. It did not have Dura Ace components,
and appeared to be 100% Shimano 600 tricolor. The decals were very consistent with 1988 or 1989 Centurion schemes,
and it did have Prestige tubing per its labels.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/meadowa...n/photostream/
My guess at the time, and still is, is that it was not a US market offering, but rather a step up from the
non-US "Triathlon" model, which had Shimano 105 and Tange 1 tubing. I really don't know that much
more than what I've seen in photos of the non-US market models.
Those are the only two models I've ever seen. There were other,
very similar Prestige-framed bikes around the same time.
The Panasonic DX6000 comes to mind, and I believe Nishiki offered a Prestige-framed bike; not sure if it was their Prestige model or not.
There is currently an '85 on eBay.
https://cgi.ebay.com/85-Centurion-Pre...-/320733386263
Last edited by RobbieTunes; 07-29-11 at 02:56 PM.
07-29-11, 04:40 PM
#4
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I have my doubts it is Tange Prestige. I would have expected to see branded drop outs (maybe I just can't read them). The steering tube should be marked. All of the original decals are gone, but the Tange Prestige reappeared? Weight?
Kind of a technicality, but the whole idea Centurion built it is bogus, as Centurion did not build bikes. They outsourced that process (as far as I know, Robbie is the expert).
+1 Fork crown is pretty plain for a Prestige frameset. My Panasonic built Schwinn Prologue (1987), has the same fork crown as the close up Robbie provided. Robbie, did Panasonic build yours by chance? OK, I looked at my Prologue closer, the fork crown is similar, but not identical. And its not chrome of course.
Kind of a technicality, but the whole idea Centurion built it is bogus, as Centurion did not build bikes. They outsourced that process (as far as I know, Robbie is the expert).
+1 Fork crown is pretty plain for a Prestige frameset. My Panasonic built Schwinn Prologue (1987), has the same fork crown as the close up Robbie provided. Robbie, did Panasonic build yours by chance? OK, I looked at my Prologue closer, the fork crown is similar, but not identical. And its not chrome of course.
Last edited by wrk101; 07-29-11 at 04:43 PM.
07-29-11, 07:12 PM
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Bill is correct,
Centurion spec'd and imported their bikes.
A lot of those bikes came from the National plant (Panasonic) or thereabouts.
One only has to work on a few to start to get the feel for their obvious similarities.
A good idea is to check your serial number vs. the serial number on the bottom of the eBay Prestige.
The eBay Prestige is 855C68, Your frame is 89C3190.
I don't know how to interpret them, but there's a thread here that does.
We know for sure it's not an '85, but the '89 is a possibility.
Three obvious differences are the rear brake bridge, the fork, and the bottom bracket shell.
The bottom bracket shell on the '85 has Tange stamped on it, otherwise the lugs are similar.
The rear brake bridge on the '85 is bowed, and yours is straight.
The fork is obviously different, and I have no example of the '89.
However, I am quite familiar with '87-89 Tange forks, and the '91-'92 Tange forks on bikes I own.
The brake caliper mounting area is different. Where yours is squared off, all mine are concave.
(BTW, the '85 Prestige fork is pretty darn close to the chrome lugged fork that Tange is still selling, for about $100.)
Others may chime in, but the determining factor would really be weight, in my opinion.
Centurion spec'd and imported their bikes.
A lot of those bikes came from the National plant (Panasonic) or thereabouts.
One only has to work on a few to start to get the feel for their obvious similarities.
A good idea is to check your serial number vs. the serial number on the bottom of the eBay Prestige.
The eBay Prestige is 855C68, Your frame is 89C3190.
I don't know how to interpret them, but there's a thread here that does.
We know for sure it's not an '85, but the '89 is a possibility.
Three obvious differences are the rear brake bridge, the fork, and the bottom bracket shell.
The bottom bracket shell on the '85 has Tange stamped on it, otherwise the lugs are similar.
The rear brake bridge on the '85 is bowed, and yours is straight.
The fork is obviously different, and I have no example of the '89.
However, I am quite familiar with '87-89 Tange forks, and the '91-'92 Tange forks on bikes I own.
The brake caliper mounting area is different. Where yours is squared off, all mine are concave.
(BTW, the '85 Prestige fork is pretty darn close to the chrome lugged fork that Tange is still selling, for about $100.)
Others may chime in, but the determining factor would really be weight, in my opinion.
Last edited by RobbieTunes; 07-29-11 at 07:18 PM.
07-30-11, 12:38 AM
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So this is the frame I was told about... It's not a Centurion I don't think.
Maybe it's some Nashbar or similar frame. I'm kind of serious...maybe. Lol.
Maybe it's some Nashbar or similar frame. I'm kind of serious...maybe. Lol.
07-31-11, 11:14 AM
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Just keep pedalling!
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Bikes: 1987 Schwinn Circuit, 1987 Panasonic DX-4000, 1984 Peugeot PSV10, 1989 Centurion Prestige, 1973 Raleigh Sprite, 1987 Peugeot Canyon Express, ~1986 Raleigh Capri, 1994 Trek 850, 1984 Centurion Pro Tour 15, 2012 Gravity Zilla
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OK, here is what I got:
-Frame weight: ~4-1/2 lbs (on my crappy fish scale with the headset cups still installed)
-Drop outs are labeled "SHIMANO EF"
-Fork ends are labeled "TANGE-TFR-Q"
-Steerer tube on the fork is stamped "TANGE9B MADE IN JAPAN CR-MO"
-Steerer tube also shows signs of a possible repaint.
-The rear wheel has to have the tire somewhat deflated to be able to be installed, so it is very tight.
-The tube lengths measure the same as my early 90s Centurion Diamond Back Expert TG (seen in photo below)
-The seatpost is 27.2mm, so I know that this makes it at least a decent frame.
Is there anything else that could help ID this frame?
-Frame weight: ~4-1/2 lbs (on my crappy fish scale with the headset cups still installed)
-Drop outs are labeled "SHIMANO EF"
-Fork ends are labeled "TANGE-TFR-Q"
-Steerer tube on the fork is stamped "TANGE9B MADE IN JAPAN CR-MO"
-Steerer tube also shows signs of a possible repaint.
-The rear wheel has to have the tire somewhat deflated to be able to be installed, so it is very tight.
-The tube lengths measure the same as my early 90s Centurion Diamond Back Expert TG (seen in photo below)
-The seatpost is 27.2mm, so I know that this makes it at least a decent frame.
Is there anything else that could help ID this frame?
Last edited by big_heineken; 08-01-11 at 09:29 AM. Reason: typo
07-31-11, 01:32 PM
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Hey - What ever it is you got a fair deal - I can see this bike giving you a very nice ride...
08-01-11, 09:28 AM
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I took a couple more photos of possible identifying features.
The first photo is of the lug between the downtube and headtube. It has a cirlce cut out:
The 2nd isn't as helpful, but it is the bike shop sticker. Wolf Cycling & Fitness in Manitowoc, WI:
The first photo is of the lug between the downtube and headtube. It has a cirlce cut out:
The 2nd isn't as helpful, but it is the bike shop sticker. Wolf Cycling & Fitness in Manitowoc, WI:
08-02-11, 12:56 PM
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Just keep pedalling!
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After looking at photos of Loose Chain's Centurion Prestige, I believe mine is the same model, just repainted. The bottom bracket's cable guides, serial # placement & format, and lug cutout match exactly. The way the seat stay attach to the seat tube lug is also identical.
Here are Loose Chain's photos:
Here are Loose Chain's photos:
08-02-11, 02:01 PM
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Centurion offered a Tange Prestige frame in 1985, in the US market, and called it the Prestige.
It was a two-tone grey/grey model and was all Dura Ace 7400, 2x6 indexed, lugged fork crown.
The seat stay caps were satin-finished, and I think it had chromed dropouts and fork ends.
Because the seller offered me the frameset for $200 and the rest of the components for $400 more,
I ended up building this out of 600 tricolor, 7-speed. In hindsight, I should have bought it all.
A while later, on eBay and then here, a much newer Prestige by Centurion popped up, with the same
type of "marbled" fade treatment found on the 1989 Ironman, but in a blue-to-white scheme.
It did, however, have a unicrown fork, which had Prestige lables on it, also. It did not have Dura Ace components,
and appeared to be 100% Shimano 600 tricolor. The decals were very consistent with 1988 or 1989 Centurion schemes,
and it did have Prestige tubing per its labels.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/meadowa...n/photostream/
My guess at the time, and still is, is that it was not a US market offering, but rather a step up from the
non-US "Triathlon" model, which had Shimano 105 and Tange 1 tubing. I really don't know that much
more than what I've seen in photos of the non-US market models.
Those are the only two models I've ever seen. There were other,
very similar Prestige-framed bikes around the same time.
The Panasonic DX6000 comes to mind, and I believe Nishiki offered a Prestige-framed bike; not sure if it was their Prestige model or not.
There is currently an '85 on eBay.
https://cgi.ebay.com/85-Centurion-Pre...-/320733386263
It was a two-tone grey/grey model and was all Dura Ace 7400, 2x6 indexed, lugged fork crown.
The seat stay caps were satin-finished, and I think it had chromed dropouts and fork ends.
Because the seller offered me the frameset for $200 and the rest of the components for $400 more,
I ended up building this out of 600 tricolor, 7-speed. In hindsight, I should have bought it all.
A while later, on eBay and then here, a much newer Prestige by Centurion popped up, with the same
type of "marbled" fade treatment found on the 1989 Ironman, but in a blue-to-white scheme.
It did, however, have a unicrown fork, which had Prestige lables on it, also. It did not have Dura Ace components,
and appeared to be 100% Shimano 600 tricolor. The decals were very consistent with 1988 or 1989 Centurion schemes,
and it did have Prestige tubing per its labels.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/meadowa...n/photostream/
My guess at the time, and still is, is that it was not a US market offering, but rather a step up from the
non-US "Triathlon" model, which had Shimano 105 and Tange 1 tubing. I really don't know that much
more than what I've seen in photos of the non-US market models.
Those are the only two models I've ever seen. There were other,
very similar Prestige-framed bikes around the same time.
The Panasonic DX6000 comes to mind, and I believe Nishiki offered a Prestige-framed bike; not sure if it was their Prestige model or not.
There is currently an '85 on eBay.
https://cgi.ebay.com/85-Centurion-Pre...-/320733386263
02-04-13, 08:23 PM
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Mystery Prestige Tange frame
That looks exactly like my mystery frame. My serial number is 89B2273. Same stats. I just have these few images. Frame is currently with painter.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/92825087@N06/8440160713/
https://www.flickr.com/photos/92825087@N06/8440160713/
Last edited by mcoovelis; 02-04-13 at 08:25 PM. Reason: More information
