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Obsessing over weight

Old 01-15-16, 01:53 PM
  #126  
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Originally Posted by rmfnla
The real value of a lighter bike is to impress others...

Once this "urban myth" is crushed, Walmart is going to own domestic performance bike sales.

J.
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Old 01-15-16, 02:10 PM
  #127  
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Originally Posted by woodcraft
You may have VERY heavy socks ...
Socks are super-important because they are rotating weight. See my post regarding toe removal.
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Old 01-15-16, 02:14 PM
  #128  
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Originally Posted by Maelochs
Socks are super-important because they are rotating weight. See my post regarding toe removal.
Yes, but they also improve handling by lowering your center of gravity...
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Old 01-15-16, 04:12 PM
  #129  
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Originally Posted by bakes1
As usual you have no clue and just like to rant against people you don't like or agree with regardless of what is fact lol.
...said Mr. Pot, to Mr. Kettle.
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Old 01-15-16, 08:28 PM
  #130  
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Originally Posted by Maelochs
Socks are super-important because they are rotating weight. See my post regarding toe removal.



Carbon fiber socks.

You heard it here first.
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Old 01-15-16, 08:45 PM
  #131  
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Originally Posted by rmfnla
Yes, but they also improve handling by lowering your center of gravity...
.... on your Walmart "10 speed" bike.

J.
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Old 01-16-16, 08:06 AM
  #132  
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Originally Posted by Maelochs
At least you are not psychologically slower.
As far as I know and I'll take that as a vote of confidence . And I think I would know if the heavy single speed did that, because I once commuted for two weeks with a worn out Huffy and I think it did make me psychologically slower. Hating your own bike will do that.
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Old 01-16-16, 03:38 PM
  #133  
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These threads always end up after some finger pointing with statements like

"people can spend their money on anything they like - it's their money....BUT, some people have foolish notions and I need to tell them they are wasting their money"
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Old 01-16-16, 03:56 PM
  #134  
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There are people who agree with me ... and there are the rest of the people, who are wrong.
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Old 01-16-16, 04:07 PM
  #135  
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Haha. There you go. Four months on BF and you're a seasoned pro.
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Old 01-16-16, 04:22 PM
  #136  
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Originally Posted by Maelochs
There are people who agree with me ... and there are the rest of the people, who are wrong.

It was Robin Williams who said, "I'm sorry, if you were right, I'd agree with you."
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Old 01-17-16, 07:51 PM
  #137  
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Originally Posted by Maelochs
At least you are not psychologically slower.
Or philosophically; I think I am slow, therefore I am...
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Old 01-18-16, 11:58 PM
  #138  
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Another one: guys who don't use bar tape to cut weight, or don't tape the drops because they rarely use them. That might cut 20g.
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Old 01-19-16, 04:10 AM
  #139  
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Originally Posted by 531Aussie
Another one: guys who don't use bar tape to cut weight, or don't tape the drops because they rarely use them. That might cut 20g.
That's not to cut weight... the bare bars are more aero than the tape. Less drag. I sandpaper the words off my tire sidewalls for the same purpose. Serious cyclists seek that edge.
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Old 01-19-16, 07:32 AM
  #140  
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Originally Posted by Maelochs
That's not to cut weight... the bare bars are more aero than the tape. Less drag. I sandpaper the words off my tire sidewalls for the same purpose. Serious cyclists seek that edge.
In what world does having all your cables out in the breeze have less drag?
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Old 01-19-16, 08:09 AM
  #141  
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Originally Posted by CafeVelo
In what world does having all your cables out in the breeze have less drag?
In the world of sarcasm.
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Old 01-19-16, 08:11 AM
  #142  
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Originally Posted by Doge
Its a hobby, not a sickness. No different than paying for a painting to hang over your desk. The painting does not make you smarter, unless you think it does.
You need to find better art.
I say that only half in jest, because the whole point of Art with a capital A is to make one a better person in some way. And the extent to which the work causes this (it isn't in ones head, it's the purpose of the work) is what makes it Art. Otherwise it's only decoration and amusement, if not clutter and noise. That said, there are bankers who hang a Picasso above their desk just to look smart in the same way there are dentists who ride Lightweights just to look fast. But that doesn't mean either can't be put to better use and effect by people who understand and appreciate them better.
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Old 01-19-16, 09:18 AM
  #143  
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I was not aware of that point of Art and can't find it in a definition. I indicated in my prior post ",unless you think it does" that aspect you post about. No doubt lighter makes some faster.
But actually the Full Definition of art fits better than I though to obsessing about weight.
Art | Definition of Art by Merriam-Webster

  • 1: skill acquired by experience, study, or observation <the art of making friends>
  • 2a : a branch of learning: (1) : one of the humanities (2) plural : liberal artsb archaic : learning, scholarship
  • 3: an occupation requiring knowledge or skill <the art of organ building>
  • 4a : the conscious use of skill and creative imagination especially in the production of aesthetic objects; also : works so producedb (1) : fine arts (2) : one of the fine arts (3) : a graphic art
  • 5a archaic : a skillful planb : the quality or state of being artful
  • 6: decorative or illustrative elements in printed matter
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Old 01-19-16, 09:35 AM
  #144  
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Here is some of the stuff I do to my son's bike:
120g cassette


Carbon Fiber bottle cages with alloy bolts.


35g skewers


Silk tires without coating on the sidewall

Raw shell for seat - no cover, light tape, partially wrap bars, Cordz cables
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Old 01-19-16, 01:45 PM
  #145  
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This is good:WANKMEISTER: DOES WEIGHT MATTER? - Peloton Magazine

...
To sum it up, Gourley wants you to believe that bike weight doesn’t really matter. He proves this by taking out his calculator and plugging in some numbers, assuming identical rider weight and an identical steady grade. Air resistance, we’re told, isn’t factored in. That’s so we can have a model that is as far from reality as those triathlon outfits are from attractive.
What he “discovers” in his windless lab where everyone rides along at the same power output is that a one-pound weight advantage only gives you a 2.5 second advantage in his fantasy lab setting. And who doesn’t race in a laboratory?
...
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Old 01-19-16, 03:02 PM
  #146  
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Originally Posted by Doge
This is good:WANKMEISTER: DOES WEIGHT MATTER? - Peloton Magazine
... a model that is as far from reality as those triathlon outfits are from attractive.
...
I'd like to see someone from the 33-racing forum take their actual data instantaneous velocity from several races, postulate an extra 3 pounds and apply the simple physics formula to calculate the extra energy that would be required at each data point. Then add those delta's to the actual power reading to see how the profile changes.

In other words, riding the same race the same way, but calculated with 3 pounds heavier, what does that do to the 1-sec power, 10 second and so on for that race? I wouldn't be surprised if it throws it off beyond the rider's ability at some point in the profile, and that would be significant.
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Old 01-19-16, 03:06 PM
  #147  
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I know this isn't the racing forum. So I also don't exactly know what "matters" means. If it means will more weight make you slower, then yes. But that may not matter at all.
I have essentially done what you ask over the years for my son - same TT course, same road races - but the rider of course varies. Anyway doing all my silly stuff he has had wins that amount to 1.6sec. I can attribute that to the silly stuff I did. For junior racing, that did matter. For non racing, again, I don't know.
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Old 01-19-16, 03:08 PM
  #148  
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Originally Posted by Doge
And who doesn’t race in a laboratory? ...
What's racing got to do with it? if "racing" was the primary criterion, three-quarters of all cyclists would be excluded, and then, if we tried to set a scale of how "serious" the racers were ... And does the master wanker not read results on time trials, where 2.5 seconds might be the gap from first to third?

Speaking of "serious" ... Seriously, Doge, when are you going to get serious? Bottle cages with bolts? Make him carry the bottle in his jersey, or better still in his shorts (lower center of gravity.) "Serious" racers aren't going to let themselves be slowed by the weight of alloy cage bolts.
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Old 01-19-16, 03:30 PM
  #149  
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Originally Posted by Maelochs
What's racing got to do with it? if "racing" was the primary criterion, three-quarters of all cyclists would be excluded, and then, if we tried to set a scale of how "serious" the racers were ... And does the master wanker not read results on time trials, where 2.5 seconds might be the gap from first to third?

Speaking of "serious" ... Seriously, Doge, when are you going to get serious? Bottle cages with bolts? Make him carry the bottle in his jersey, or better still in his shorts (lower center of gravity.) "Serious" racers aren't going to let themselves be slowed by the weight of alloy cage bolts.
He did say that the weight-weenie thing is a hobby for him, and like any hobby it can seem absurd to non-enthusiasts.

I've actually been thinking of re-visiting the optimal "aero" placement of bottles, since I noticed the other day that Cervelo's wind tunnel suggests between the aerobars (and not on the frame DT or ST, either of which is better than the "tri" behind the saddle). Since I don't have an aerobar, and there are a few other places to try it. Commuters and weekend warriors need to optimize things to you know.

Just to be contrary, half a million USA Triathlon members plus 477,000 one-day members, vs 750,000 bike commuters (US Census) perhaps puts the racers in the majority. If we're excluding the millions who rode "at least once" in a year, and I think it's a given that most of them don't care much about weight.
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Old 01-19-16, 03:39 PM
  #150  
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Your quote of me was a quote from the article, that I pasted. I think MW was saying 2.5 matters a lot - in a race.
For non-racing, does going faster matter? I don't know what racing has to do with it except road riders tend to use the stuff racers do. I live next to the Pacific Coast Bike trails so I saw an eliptigo today and there are always a few recumbents around, but the majority of non-racers are on racing bikes/or those you could race. If I, my son, or my ride the Townie around people act as if we are not roadies (or looking at me, but whatever).
So for non-racing - does it matter? Well only if going faster matters.

And having just serviced my car with 185K miles on it (going for 300K), some things are not about practicality - and cost more than alloy bolts. I just want to get 300K on the car and I just want sub 14# race bikes (unless they are weighing them).
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